JinlianPai

Full Lotus is a state of being.

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I was told by my teacher that going into full lotus is a state of mind and attainment. That full lotus is not just about a certain way of sitting but the manifestation of a particular state.

 

Sitting in full lotus can help you cultivate the golden elixir but it has a double meaning  ;) .

 

The golden state of realization where yin and yang is balanced.

 

To manifest the lotus of enlightenment.

 

My teacher is from a lotus tradition.

 

Thoughts opinions?

Edited by JinlianPai
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All Asanas are Mudras

and mudras are outer expressions of inner mindscapes. Gestures of liberation, so to speak. 

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Be careful promoting full lotus on thetaobums it pisses people off. haha.

 

But yeah all the qigong masters I know about rely on full lotus for long meditation - 4 hours nonstop full lotus every night to recharge the energy.

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I wonder, how much do I lose by being a half lotus sitter, ie a relatively tight half lotus, one leg rested on top of the other. 

 

and sometimes I'm 'looser' then that, sitting 'indian style' with out leg further out, not on top of the other.  How would you compare the 2 stances energetically?

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buddha-moi.gif

 

The lotus in internal alchemy has many meanings but it is mainly known as the symbol for enlightenment.

 

The full lotus position is good for pumping the essence up the spine to the brain to create the elixir and then back down thru the middle dantian to be purified yes.

 

But that is not the only way to do it.

 

To attain and manifest the lotus of enlightenment is the goal.

 

https://books.google.com/books?id=t5pZaCTJX3oC&pg=PR12&lpg=PR12&dq=gold+lotus+immortal&source=bl&ots=HB5rwlzKRX&sig=rwGjxC0-tMomUEK4-VbJaNpBnBg&hl=en&sa=X&ei=aFLtVKGWJrHjsASLhYCIBQ&ved=0CEEQ6AEwCTgK#v=onepage&q=gold%20lotus%20immortal&f=false

 

 

The gold lotus of taoism symbolises enlightenment., the Tao (the Way) or spiritual rebirth. The opening of the flower is believed to represent the development  of spiritual potential of humans.

 

 

So to manifest the full lotus would to show your Buddhist immortal nature.

 

http://www.cttbusa.org/esscommentary/earthstore1_2.htm

 

 

Lu Xuan Chang immediately knelt down and said, ‚ÄúVinaya Master, it's not that I did not make offerings yesterday but when I did, I could not enter your hut. More than a dozen miles radius around this hut shone with a golden light that was so bright I could not open my eyes. I could not see the roads in front of me. I asked the local earth Bodhisattva how come the golden lights were so bright up ahead that I could not proceed. The local earth Bodhisattva said, ‚ÄėSomeone in the hut is a Bodhisattva in the flesh, a living Bodhisattva.‚Äô

 

Something like that.

Edited by JinlianPai
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Chunyi Lin qigong master said 20 minutes of full lotus = 4 hours of any other type of meditation.

 

Sorry but half lotus is not nearly the same.

 

The thing with full lotus is it naturally resonates the complementary opposites energy dynamic.

 

Some call this 5 points facing heaven - center of feet, hands and top of head.

 

But the pressure on the legs - crossed - the key is that it stretches out and opens up the Gate of Destiny - the lower back - which Gurdjieff said is the Kundabuffer that controls modern people.

 

So then at first the legs go completely numb in full lotus but since the energy circulates naturally when the numbness goes away the energy channels open up with bliss going up the spine.

 

So then that cycle deepens - sympathetic nervous system extreme to opposite parasympathetic bliss extreme.

 

This is why it is said that if the body doesn't move then jing is converted to qi.

 

Yogananda said full lotus burns bad karma - and so he took pride in one youth doing 9 hours nonstop full lotus.

 

Chunyi Lin says the small universe will activate automatically in full lotus.

 

But of course the best is with eyes closed and tongue against roof of mouth and thoughts emptied out.

 

You're supposed to wait 2 1/2 hours after eating - according to Sri Dhanyogi - on his full lotus practice. So that makes it more difficult.

 

But at least just do some active standing exercise with horse stance to clear out the intestines before doing full lotus meditation.

 

But I just sit in full lotus while at the computer or watching t.v. - just to keep better posture and stretch out lower back and exorcise out bad energy.

 

I try to wait at least half hour after eating but sometimes I can't wait. haha.

 

Also left leg on top is for internal energy focus and clears out the liver blockages better.

 

Right leg on top is for transmitting the energy externally - for teaching, etc.

 

I accidentally sat in right leg on top all the time and so am still training left leg on top.

 

I noticed the qigong master when left leg on top - has the left leg more over the calf muscle of right leg - to cushion the pressure - which is what I do also - but the right leg needs to be up against the hip bone.

 

This is also taught in the yoga documentary I watched - on the hatha yoga teacher Iyengar  Breath of the Gods.

 

Yeah - so the qigong master says the "hips need to drop" for better full lotus.

 

Of course also they say not to force the full lotus.

 

I went into a Buddhist theraveda monastery and I got chastised for sitting in full lotus since it wasn't the Burmese style they used - but I could read the other monk's energy - his shen-qi was stuck in his lower body and he was a perv. I left that monastery in the middle of the night, in the cold rain, on bicycle - but not until after I read their books. haha.

 

https://www.facebook.com/HelenAylingIyengarYogaTeacher/posts/644138192373625

 

interesting it says to get the knees as close as possible.

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This based on my own personal experience in alchemy given what I practice now.

 

There seems to be a mis-understanding between

 

Zhen qi as elixir

Golden pill as elixir

And Golden elixir

 

Given the types of alchemy ive done and still do ill put it like this.

 

Zhen qi the original true energy is elixir but not golden elixir and ill explain why below.

 

The golden elixir is made inside pineal gland. An somehow correlates to the actual chemical agent of gold. It is this that is transformed and purifed and turned into the golden pill.

 

The golden elixir is blissful

 

http://www.qi-journal.com/Culture.asp?-token.D=Article&-MaxRecords=1&-SkipRecords=3&-Op=bw&Name=Daoist%20Alchemy

 

 

When the golden elixir is established and recognized, true blissful tranquility settles in place and the calmness of autonomous and non-personal knowing is attained. The ‚Äúgolden elixir‚ÄĚ is called golden because it is even, shining, and mellow like the quality of real truth. It is called the elixir because it is the fountainhead and source of all that is real, genuine, and actual.

 

 

Can zhen qi and the pill be attained without the golden elixir and the answer is yes in some lineages they transmute the elixir into the golden elixir and experience the bliss later.

 

Zhen qi has a spiritual light to it but its not the golden elixir.

 

zhen qi can be used to awaken and stimulate the pineal gland to create the golden elixir yes that is true.

Edited by JinlianPai
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Chunyi Lin qigong master said 20 minutes of full lotus = 4 hours of any other type of meditation.

 

Sorry but half lotus is not nearly the same.

 

The thing with full lotus is it naturally resonates the complementary opposites energy dynamic.

 

Some call this 5 points facing heaven - center of feet, hands and top of head.

 

But the pressure on the legs - crossed - the key is that it stretches out and opens up the Gate of Destiny - the lower back - which Gurdjieff said is the Kundabuffer that controls modern people.

 

So then at first the legs go completely numb in full lotus but since the energy circulates naturally when the numbness goes away the energy channels open up with bliss going up the spine.

 

So then that cycle deepens - sympathetic nervous system extreme to opposite parasympathetic bliss extreme.

 

This is why it is said that if the body doesn't move then jing is converted to qi.

 

Yogananda said full lotus burns bad karma - and so he took pride in one youth doing 9 hours nonstop full lotus.

 

Chunyi Lin says the small universe will activate automatically in full lotus.

 

But of course the best is with eyes closed and tongue against roof of mouth and thoughts emptied out.

 

You're supposed to wait 2 1/2 hours after eating - according to Sri Dhanyogi - on his full lotus practice. So that makes it more difficult.

 

But at least just do some active standing exercise with horse stance to clear out the intestines before doing full lotus meditation.

 

But I just sit in full lotus while at the computer or watching t.v. - just to keep better posture and stretch out lower back and exorcise out bad energy.

 

I try to wait at least half hour after eating but sometimes I can't wait. haha.

 

Also left leg on top is for internal energy focus and clears out the liver blockages better.

 

Right leg on top is for transmitting the energy externally - for teaching, etc.

 

I accidentally sat in right leg on top all the time and so am still training left leg on top.

 

I noticed the qigong master when left leg on top - has the left leg more over the calf muscle of right leg - to cushion the pressure - which is what I do also - but the right leg needs to be up against the hip bone.

 

This is also taught in the yoga documentary I watched - on the hatha yoga teacher Iyengar  Breath of the Gods.

 

Yeah - so the qigong master says the "hips need to drop" for better full lotus.

 

Of course also they say not to force the full lotus.

 

I went into a Buddhist theraveda monastery and I got chastised for sitting in full lotus since it wasn't the Burmese style they used - but I could read the other monk's energy - his shen-qi was stuck in his lower body and he was a perv. I left that monastery in the middle of the night, in the cold rain, on bicycle - but not until after I read their books. haha.

 

https://www.facebook.com/HelenAylingIyengarYogaTeacher/posts/644138192373625

 

interesting it says to get the knees as close as possible.

 

Do you experience bliss from your practice?

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This based on my own personal experience in alchemy given what I practice now.

 

There seems to be a mis-understanding between

 

Zhen qi as elixir

Golden pill as elixir

And Golden elixir

 

Why are these call elixir?

 

Well because practitioners experience it like this.

 

Zhen qi feels like a powerful vibration going thru the body which can remove blockages.

 

The pill is like the umph behind the zhen qi once this is attained its sends aa powerful vibration thru the body.

 

The golden elixir is blissful and has some vibration to it.

 

The real golden elixir is the combination of the zhen qi and golden elixir to form the golden pill.

 

The golden pill sends a powerful blissful energy thru the body.

 

With the golden pill the light that the body gives off will be strong.

Edited by JinlianPai
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Why are these call elixir?

 

Well because practitioners experience it like this.

 

Zhen qi feels like a powerful vibration going thru the body which can remove blockages.

 

The pill is like the umph behind the zhen qi once this is attained its sends aa powerful vibration thru the body.

 

The golden elixir is blissful and has some vibration to it.

 

The real golden elixir is the combination of the zhen qi and golden elixir to form the golden pill.

 

The golden pill sends a powerful blissful energy thru the body.

 

With the golden pill the light that the body gives off will be strong.

 

 

And ive seen it all zhen qi with no pill.

 

bliss with no zhen qi or pill.

 

and golden elixir with no zhen qi or pill.

 

You can have one and not the other.

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What are you trying to achieve?

 

Nothing.

 

Just workin thru my own stuff.

I think thats a good place to be. 

 

Sometimes we push,

sometimes  we  just  practice.

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We have to many stroke victims because of the over importance of the duration of postures. Some people appear to gain from the pain and they seem to enjoy speaking about it in their pursuit of full lotus or in holding it for several hours.

 

I used to do full lotus for many hours on end without pain and without my legs going to sleep, I then learned to do sitting meditation in a chair and much later standing meditation.

 

Comfort, straight spine and non-distraction are far more important.

 

Sitting American Indian style, half lotus, full lotus or sitting in a chair all work extremely well and while I have not done much standing meditation it is claimed to be the best by many.

 

Once you get into a long meditation that is out of trance and usually about four hours into it - it does not matter what you started with - you will typically find the spine finding a super straight posture and everything else falls into place for the rest of the meditation whether it is 8 or 10 hours or more.

 

If you have a teacher that constantly extols the greatness of the full lotus and it is creating anxiety in you - leave the teaching.

Full lotus is unequivocally Not That Big of a deal.

Edited by Spotless

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 and while I have not done much standing meditation it is claimed to be the best by many.

 

It is definitely a significant key to internal power in a martial arts context... but also contributes to good bodily health in general.

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Its definitely cool, but yeah I don't believe that its necessary. I once used to practice it daily several times a day and could maybe hang out for 45 mins or so, but legs would always go numb at first. I have varicose veins in my legs too, so it don't make no sense to me to do for myself.

 

But if you really want to be sure you aren't missing out, just be smart about it and progress slowly. Some people spend ten years perfecting it. Don't cripple yourself.

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Its more useful to full-lotus the mind than it is the body. 

 

Plenty of people can get into and maintain the physical posture with ease, but training the mind thereon in is entirely independent of that posture. Those who make extensive claims of the overriding benefits of the FL are simply stuck on that level. A good meditator finds ease in any mental and physical space. A great meditator would have learnt to let go even that, sometimes by simply contemplating what 'ease' means, in reality - perhaps by deeper reflections on what remains in the absence of all mental picturing of dis-ease. 

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Their are other problems associated with the full lotus:

 

If you are having difficulty with the full lotus posture then when you happen to be at say a satsang and do not have a high enough cushion or no cushion your back will not be straight - the most important aspect of posture.

 

Being at ease with the full lotus requires not only the knees to be able to bend but the ankles and the hips.

 

Their are advantages to sitting up on a chair - the feet are flat on the ground and the legs are not crossed - this allows for very good flow of many energies and the aura does not spin in this position nor does it spin in a standing meditation.

 

The full lotus is a wonderful position and having the feet facing up is a nice thing but pain and blue legs and possible blood clots and the inability to be un distracted for long periods of time all make this practice just fine if you can do it and fine if you cannot.

 

Many years ago I could put my legs behind my head and easily sit in full lotus. I never suffered to learn it and enjoyed meditation that way because I knew no other - but having learned several other postures and having done them for many long sittings in excess of 6 hours and up to 18 hours straight - I have no particular fondness for full lotus - perhaps because it was never a holy grail to aspire to.

Edited by Spotless

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