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Hey @Apech this meme feels low-key transphobic and kinda sucks. 👎

 

I get why this might cause a sardonic chuckle. Gender nonconformity and transgenderism is a new, strange thing for many of us and there are legit funny things about gender in 2019.

 

But good sociopolitical humor is rooted in:

  1. A deeper understanding of the issue being mocked than the audience
  2. Not punching "down", i.e., at people that are already structural targets

 

This meme fails hard at both.

 

It's also so overplayed that's it's basically a meme format, and one that alt-right chuds online love, by the way.

 

Sean

 

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1 hour ago, sean said:

Hey @Apech this is a transphobic meme and it actually really sucks. 👎

 

I get why this might cause a sardonic chuckle. Transgender is a new, strange thing for many of us and there are legit funny things about gender in 2019.

 

But good sociopolitical humor is rooted in:

  1. A deeper understanding of the issue being mocked than the audience
  2. Not punching "down", i.e., at people that are already structural targets

 

This meme fails hard at both.

 

It's also so overplayed that's it's basically a meme format, and one that alt-right chuds online love, by the way.

 

Sean

 

 

It was posted by a gay friend of mine on Facebook and I have no idea what it has to do with transgenderism - its a comment on changing standards in attire over the decades.  You should get off your high horse I think.  But if you really object, its your site so take it down.  I have no idea what punching down at structural targets means - perhaps you could rephrase that in plain English for me.

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, Apech said:

It was posted by a gay friend of mine on Facebook and I have no idea what it has to do with transgenderism - its a comment on changing standards in attire over the decades.  You should get off your high horse I think.  But if you really object, its your site so take it down.  I have no idea what punching down at structural targets means - perhaps you could rephrase that in plain English for me.

 

I only have a small horse. Could even be considered a pony. 🐴 Also, my role here, for better or worse, is to get on my little pony sometimes. 😆

 

I like giving you the benefit of the doubt. And it's sincerely possible I'm being too trigger happy, given how frequently I see this exact meme deployed by jerks in online spaces.

 

In plain English, what, specifically, is this meme suggesting went "terribly wrong" in the "changing standards of attire over the decades"?

 

What I see it suggesting is that, by traditional gender norms, men are sometimes now more openly effeminate and that this is the core punchline of the joke and what's gone terribly wrong.

 

In other words, the mere existence of gender nonconformity in modern life is "very bad, actually", and represents some sort of aberrant deviation from our proper social course.

 

EDIT: Moved my potentially knee-jerk transphobia part here: https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/49802-transphobia

     

    Sean

     

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    Its times like these i feel the need to make a joke (on an entirely different subject , of course ) to 'ease the tension' . But I usually fail , and make things worse .

     

    Like the comedian who  was trying his best to lift the mood during his performance but he said that he noticed, no matter what he did, a couple in the front row just sat there looking glum and depressed .

     

    He said " As a comedian, I felt it was my duty to lift their spirits, so I had to ask them . ' I noticed you have not laughed or even  smiled once, is there something wrong ? ' 

     

    'Yes', they replied, 'Recently our son was taken by a shark' .

     

    '" Boy, was that a downer . The whole audience slumped and a dark cloud descended over my performance . Again, as a comedian, I thought it my duty to try and lift spirits with a joke, so I offered   ....

     

    'Oh well, maybe the shark took him somewhere nice . '  " 

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    .... I realise some people dont appreciate my sense of humour ; recently I made a joke about a car accident  and eveyone just gave me a bad look. One guy  actually complained verbally ;

     

    " Car accidents are NOT funny, property is damaged , hardship is caused , people get injured  ... at least wait until the ambulance leaves ! "

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    1 hour ago, sean said:

     

    I only have a small horse. Could even be considered a pony. 🐴 Also, my role here, for better or worse, is to get on my little pony sometimes. 😆

     

    I do prefer to give you the benefit of the doubt. And perhaps I'm being trigger happy, given how frequently I see this exact meme deployed by alt-right types in online spaces. But I worry you're being facetious in your description of what this joke is really about.

     

    In plain English, what, specifically, is this meme suggesting went "terribly wrong" in the "changing standards of attire over the decades"?

     

    What I see it suggesting, the actual target of the joke, is that, by traditional and often oppressive patriarchal gender norms, men are sometimes now more openly effeminate and that this, precisely, is what's terribly wrong.

     

    In other words, the mere existence of gender nonconformity in modern life is "very bad, actually", and represents some sort of aberrant deviation from our proper social course.

     

    Why does this matter?

     

    Well, it matters because transphobia directly and materially impacts tens of millions of particularly vulnerable human lives. (Include rigid, conservative gender roles to increase said impact by orders of magnitude.)

     

    This is the "structural targets" part. Transgender people are constantly compelled to explain and defend their very existence everywhere they go, often with valid fears of being ostracized, fired, attacked and murdered.

     

    The very least that I can do here, is be an asshole sometimes to ensure that any trans or gender questioning people visiting this one so-called spiritual forum never need to explain, defend, or feel shamed or mocked for their existence. Period.

     

    If the price for this sanctuary is that some, perhaps innocently, ignorant members are no longer given a safe space to confidently air their incomprehension of the world being more complex than they were assured as little boys and girls — well, sorry, that's the price I'm willing to pay.

     

    I recognize this can be an exasperating subject for newcomers. Modern life already feels so complex. Now you're telling me that gender, something surely based on the definitive, "hard science of genitalia and chromosomes", is being questioned? I've had this conversation in person with so many people, and the visceral frustration that gender might not be simple "anymore" is palpable. I can empathize with that.

     

    For you, or anyone trying to understand this stuff, I can recommend the following two very entertaining suggestions:

     

    Meanwhile, let's try to do better than amplifying a default emotional reaction of laughing at people who might be struggling with something extraordinarily difficult and fraught.

     

    ❤️

     

    Sean

     

     

    I have no idea why you think I was being facetious.  I wasn't.  I literally had no idea this picture had anything to do with transphobia, I thought it was about smart clothing versus not smart clothing. I thought this partly because it was posted to Facebook by my gay friend who would not dream of attacking or laughing at anyone for their sexual orientation/gender or anything like that having experienced discrimination throughout his life on this basis.  If this meme offends you then take it down.  I said this before.  But spare me the censorious lectures.

     

     

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    21 minutes ago, Apech said:

    I have no idea why you think I was being facetious.  I wasn't.  I literally had no idea this picture had anything to do with transphobia, I thought it was about smart clothing versus not smart clothing. I thought this partly because it was posted to Facebook by my gay friend who would not dream of attacking or laughing at anyone for their sexual orientation/gender or anything like that having experienced discrimination throughout his life on this basis.  If this meme offends you then take it down.  I said this before.  But spare me the censorious lectures.

     

    Ahh. You caught my post before my last edit, in which I tried to soften a bit and moved the transphobia piece to another topic.

     

    OK. I'll trust your intention. I'm sorry if I'm being knee-jerk about this topic and caused you any stress.

     

    🙏

     

    Sean

     

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    As a gay man, I´d much rather date the guy from 1947.  Why do you think we like old movies?  At the same time, I think I see what Sean finds offensive in the meme and feel the same way.  So I guess you could say I both (not-so-secretly) agree with the sentiment of the meme and find it offputting at the same time.

     

    Life´s complicated.  So is humor.  Most things wouldn´t be funny if there wasn´t at least an eensy-beensy potential to offend.

     

    I think both Apech and Sean have the best of intentions here.  That´s not very funny but it´s true.

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    What made me laugh yesterday and again today when I re-read it on FB: the story a Russian opera singer, Maria Ostroukhova, told the press about being mugged in Venice, Italy, and losing her wallet and her passport to the thief.  She didn't speak any Italian except for the opera roles she had learned by heart, so she had to scramble for Italian opera phrases to explain to the police what happened and urgently ask for help.  She hit the astounded cops with approximately the following speech:

     

    "I implore you, kind lords, bring justice to this cruel world!  What am I going to do without a passport? (She managed to substitute "passaporto" for "Eurydice" of the original.)  Oh where can I go without a passport?  My fate is dark peril and devastation!"

     

    So, the cops understood her (sort of) and showed her some mugshots of the known or suspected pickpockets.  She recognized a young woman who "accidentally" bumped into her earlier on some bridge, and exclaimed with great operatic emotion, 

     

    "There she is, that accursed woman!  I swear I will dismember her!!"

     

    The cops were beginning to feel a bit uneasy, but then the happy ending arrived, in the form of a boy who came in bringing the goodies he'd just found -- Maria's wallet, emptied of cash but still containing the credit cards, and her passport, which the mugger discarded in the vicinity of some public restroom.  The cops handed them to Maria who then proclaimed,

     

    "Oh noble knights, may the almighty reward you for your exemplary virtue!"

     

    Seeing her off, one of the cops said, with much respect, "Your Italian is truly exquisite."          

     

    Here's what she looks like:

     

    ostrouh600.jpg?w=600&ssl=1

    Edited by Taomeow
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    I'm reading a little book that someone gave me.  It's Against The Stream by Noah Levine.  It describes itself as a 
    Buddhist manual for spiritual revolutionaries.  I'm reading in a place where he's discussing attachments.

     

    "The Dalai Lama is rumored to have said that being able to have sex without any attachment would take the level of attainment of being able to eat either chocolate cake or dog shit without any preference between the two.  The Dalai Lama also said that he didn't know anyone alive who had attained this level of non attachment."  :lol:

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    That reminds me of an instance in my youth.

     

    When I was maybe 7, we had some people coming over for dinner.  I had to set up the fancy water glasses and stuff, that was my job.  I looked for the good napkins to set out and couldn't find them.  But I did remember that there was a box that said  'sanitary napkins' under the sink in the bathroom.  Need I say more?

     

    Hey, it made perfect sense to me at the time.  Gave the folks a bit of a chuckle

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