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@silent thunder Your response about Earl the Pearl reminds me of an old story about a man who wished to be wise and seek the greater truth beyond what was known in Ancient Greece. I don't remember the details too well, but this is roughly how it went:

 

The man was told by his teacher that in order to be wise, for two years, he had to pay anyone who insulted him, no matter who it was or how great or small it was. Because he was dedicated to this, he did so diligently for two years, then he was instructed to enter the gates of Athens and approach the deranged old woman who waited there cutting down everyone with her sharp tongue. 

 

As he approached the deranged old woman, as expected, she began to mock him about his hair, his face, his sandals--everything that could be gleaned. The man responded by bursting out in laughter. The deranged old woman looked at him scornfully and confused, then said, "Why are you laughing?!" 

 

The man responded, "For two years, I have been paying people to insult me. Now, you're doing it to me for free." 

 

The woman smiled, embraced him, and welcomed him both into Athens and then into the mystery school. 

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There's a funny discrepancy in that story.  'He had to pay anyone who insulted him' would indicate that the person had already insulted him and he paid him in retrospect.  But he says the old lady does it for free.  So she insulted him just as everyone else had, for free - and then he paid later.

 

But then he later says 'for 2 years I've been paying people to insult me'.  That would indicate he paid up front.

 

Just sayin'

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10 hours ago, manitou said:

There's a funny discrepancy in that story.  'He had to pay anyone who insulted him' would indicate that the person had already insulted him and he paid him in retrospect.  But he says the old lady does it for free.  So she insulted him just as everyone else had, for free - and then he paid later.

 

But then he later says 'for 2 years I've been paying people to insult me'.  That would indicate he paid up front.

 

Just sayin'


It is not a discrepancy—while I don’t remember the exact details, what I do remember was that was a discussion point for deliberately obfuscating details as to what is exactly “insulting”. :) 

 

I made the same observation too and the person who told me that story smiled.

 

PS:he didn’t pay her. He only paid for the two years before going to Athens, as per the story.

Edited by Earl Grey

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For years now, I´ve been questioning my participation in this forum.  It often seemed to me that there was more conflict here than comaraderie  -- and that always bothered me.  What kind of spiritual forum is this with so little kindness?  Little did I realize that being insulted is actually a precursor to being accepted into a genuine "mystery school."  Turns out I´ve been in the right place all along.

Edited by liminal_luke
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31 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

For years now, I´ve been questioning my participation in this forum.  It often seemed to me that there was more conflict here than comaraderie  -- and that always bothered me.  What kind of spiritual forum is this with so little kindness?  Little did I realize that being insulted is actually a precursor to being accepted into a genuine "mystery school."  Turns out I´ve been in the right place all along.


Let me share a few things going back to what I learned in workshops to help negotiate conflict between kids and bullies, bonding with peers my age from my grade school years to college (even now!), a video game and old television show, a movie, and my recent conflict with Gendao before becoming buddies with him.


When kids tease and make fun of each other, researchers and coaches who taught us said that getting a reaction from us encourages them as it rewards them and we gain nothing from getting mad. Giving no reaction or even having a retort in good humor (this is crucial) rather than malice will actually challenge them and even amuse them until they see it’s more beneficial to be friendly with you than it is to antagonize you.

 

Let us cut to how this was hammered in first with a couple of video games. The first was The Secret of Monkey Island, the second was The Kingdom of Loathing. In the former, you battled pirates in a game of dueling wits: you crossed swords but tried to insult them or have a sharp (no pun intended) comeback to their insults, confusing them and making them unable to retort, and as a result, getting clumsy with their swords. As you fought more, you learned more insults and barely have to use your sword. The second game was inspired by this and made it insult beer pong, where you did roughly the same thing, but the more you got witty, the more the crowd of pirates became chummier with you, eventually rewarding you with drinks, friendship, and gear.

 

Now, changing the channel, there was an old television show, In Living Color, which had some of the most legendary insults of the Yo’ Mama variety from the segment “Dirty Dozens”, and of course, the “Men On...” segment for innuendos.

 

When I moved around a lot growing up, I had a pack of insults both from the games and from the tv show, which I employed often, being the new kid, the minority, the foreigner, and the fat kid, on top of my personality quirks. When people made fun of me, they would get a rise out of me, until I figured out a game. The first game was not fun: it was violent and involved me fighting back against bullies, but getting suspended because regardless of who started it, we all lose. The second game was insults, which made them laugh when I had a Yo’ Mama snapback whenever they’d say things like “my mom is a slut” or other things like “hey you little chinky f****t”. Some comebacks I made were really just a lot of the same material, but still elicited laughter: “My mom’s a slut? Well... Yo’ Mama’s so loose, she only wears panties to keep her ankles warm.” And as they get flabbergasted as their friends laugh, struggling to retort, I would be rapid fire: “Yo’ Mama’s so slutty, she’s like a television: EVERYONE turns her on! Yo’ Mama’s so slutty, her legs are like 7-11: open 24 hours a day!” And as the laughs came, the bullies got pissed, and had two choices: violence or lame insults that nobody laughed for, but laughed at them.

 

I didn’t make friends with everyone, but I at least had a reputation for not being an easy target, especially because I accepted my idiosyncrasies that people tried to humiliate me for constantly—everything from bands I liked to my hair or having a funny last name.

 

I mentioned in another thread The Matrix Reloaded, where the character Seraph does a character test on everyone by fighting them. It is true: in conflict, you will see a man’s true character (man not as in gender, but man as in our species, mankind, or a person for non-gendered pronouns). You see how he is in hardship or when he’s weak when fighting, or when he is in a position of power and advantage, with how much restraint or humility he shows. Look then at how Gendao and I don’t mind each other anymore. We had conflict, we got tired of it, buried the hatchet, and are buds now who do our own thing while disagreeing on a few things, but through that conflict, in the view of the public and retrospective analysis, learned from each other and ourselves. A LOT of insults before, but I went off script and lost my cool, then decided I got tired of it and tried a new script.

 

If this still is hard to follow (it is), the takeaway here is that you learn a lot within conflict, but for some reason, so many people are averse to it because it takes them out of their comfort zones—pressure building up releases things like a volcanic catharsis, which, while it was an insult gendao used on me, it was actually correct because one of my teachers said pressure is what causes these things to come out and form new landmass among other things.

 

Don’t be afraid of conflict, don’t get attached to it, don’t seek it, and don’t forget to learn from it is about the simplest I can say here.

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14 hours ago, Earl Grey said:


 

PS:he didn’t pay her. He only paid for the two years before going to Athens, as per the story.

 

 

There was no difference in any of the three insults.  He just chose not to pay her;  he chose to pay the other two.

 

Should we start a separate thread on this?  :lol:

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Just now, manitou said:

 

 

There was no difference in any of the three insults.  He just chose not to pay her;  he chose to pay the other two.

 

Should we start a separate thread on this?  :lol:

 

Haha, naaaaah I think the details in that story of paying people for two years (should have written "only" to be clear) and then afterwards going to her was more than enough, and the point was made--no need to beat a dead horse. :) 

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12 hours ago, liminal_luke said:

For years now, I´ve been questioning my participation in this forum.  It often seemed to me that there was more conflict here than comaraderie  -- and that always bothered me.  What kind of spiritual forum is this with so little kindness?  Little did I realize that being insulted is actually a precursor to being accepted into a genuine "mystery school."  Turns out I´ve been in the right place all along.

 

That's funny.

 

For several years Marblehead and I got into conflicts.  It was just a chemistry thing.  I decided to rectify that, so I did a piece of 'found art' for his bar area.  It was this crazy thing made out of palm fibers but I attached a light so that when he turned it on it cast eerie shadows all over the room.  He was delighted to get it, and from that moment on we had a great rapport on The Bums.  Sometimes just a tiny action will make all the difference in the world.

 

This, IMO, is The Practice.  Realizing the oneness and just get along.  If we can do it here (somewhat anonymously) we're good to go anywhere else.  We get deeply into each other's psyches here, and it's a great testing ground for 'out there'.

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8 minutes ago, Earl Grey said:

 

Haha, naaaaah I think the details in that story of paying people for two years (should have written "only" to be clear) and then afterwards going to her was more than enough, and the point was made--no need to beat a dead horse. :) 

 

 

I agree.  We are now officially beating a dead horse...

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4 minutes ago, manitou said:

 

 

I agree.  We are now officially beating a dead horse...

 

Let's hope it's not this horse:

 

 

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12 minutes ago, manitou said:

 

That's funny.

 

For several years Marblehead and I got into conflicts.  It was just a chemistry thing.  I decided to rectify that, so I did a piece of 'found art' for his bar area.  It was this crazy thing made out of palm fibers but I attached a light so that when he turned it on it cast eerie shadows all over the room.  He was delighted to get it, and from that moment on we had a great rapport on The Bums.  Sometimes just a tiny action will make all the difference in the world.

 

This, IMO, is The Practice.  Realizing the oneness and just get along.  If we can do it here (somewhat anonymously) we're good to go anywhere else.  We get deeply into each other's psyches here, and it's a great testing ground for 'out there'.

 

That´s beautiful.  To my mind, your story with Marblehead exactly parallels the teaching parable Earl Grey presented: you responded to seeming conflict with crazy wisdom positivity, totally upsetting the usual pattern of escalating blah blah blah hostility.

 

I could make the point that there´s lots of conflict here by assembling a book of war quotes, but it´s also true that the conflict is in my own mind.  So much of how we react to things is us -- not the external world.  There´s lots of beautiful interaction here and whether or not I focus on the beauty or the beastliness is up to me.

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46 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

 

That´s beautiful.  To my mind, your story with Marblehead exactly parallels the teaching parable Earl Grey presented: you responded to seeming conflict with crazy wisdom positivity, totally upsetting the usual pattern of escalating blah blah blah hostility.

 

I could make the point that there´s lots of conflict here by assembling a book of war quotes, but it´s also true that the conflict is in my own mind.  So much of how we react to things is us -- not the external world.  There´s lots of beautiful interaction here and whether or not I focus on the beauty or the beastliness is up to me.

 

Remember Biff in the Back to the Future trilogy and how he would always get covered in shit?

 

When I was working in agriculture, I never knew there would be a day that I was going around a village asking people to let us have all the shit they had on their property from their cows, chickens, and mules. We needed it for fertilizer. 

 

Some people can't stand being around shit, but sometimes, you need shit to help grow what is needed, unexpectedly. 

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1 hour ago, liminal_luke said:

So much of how we react to things is us -- not the external world. 

Some say all

 

1 hour ago, liminal_luke said:

There´s lots of beautiful interaction here and whether or not I focus on the beauty or the beastliness is up to me.

Boop! 

 

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19 hours ago, Earl Grey said:


It is not a discrepancy—while I don’t remember the exact details, what I do remember was that was a discussion point for deliberately obfuscating details as to what is exactly “insulting”. :) 

 

I made the same observation too and the person who told me that story smiled.

 

PS:he didn’t pay her. He only paid for the two years before going to Athens, as per the story.

 

I like the Sufi story about the  'beggar' that got paid for being stupid .   His stupidity was " Oh no, thats too much money, give me less . " .    People thought it was funny to see a 'stupid' beggar ask for less money and not more .   So they would take their friends to watch hand him a large amount of money, then the beggar would complain and give most of it back , and everyone would laugh at him .

 

One day, a more compassionate fellow asked him why he did not just take the large amounts of money, and soon, he could  stop being a beggar  and establish himself in some business  or something . The beggar told the  man  " Oh no,  that sounds like I might have to do some hard work .  Also,  if I started accepting large amounts of money, people would soon stop offering it .   If I originally  just accepted the usual amount and never gave any back, I would be like every other beggar - poor and destitute . But by doing this, many rich people come here everyday and give me lots of money to show off in front of their friends how  stupid I am and how smart they are  .... by giving me their money .

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4 hours ago, manitou said:

 

 

There was no difference in any of the three insults.  He just chose not to pay her;  he chose to pay the other two.

 

Should we start a separate thread on this?  :lol:

 

I'll pay you to insult me .

 

It has to be a good one though .  

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3 hours ago, Earl Grey said:

 

Remember Biff in the Back to the Future trilogy and how he would always get covered in shit?

 

When I was working in agriculture, I never knew there would be a day that I was going around a village asking people to let us have all the shit they had on their property from their cows, chickens, and mules. We needed it for fertilizer. 

 

Some people can't stand being around shit, but sometimes, you need shit to help grow what is needed, unexpectedly. 

 

You should try making prep 500 in biodyamics , it requires one to fill up hollow cow horns with cow poop .  At work we had to make heaps of them , so we do 'an open day'  and 'teach'  people how to do it , FOR FREE !     :D 

 

Some guy converted an old sausage making machine , that worked like an evil Mr Whippy snow cone ( except the 'ice cream' was not vanilla 'flavour'  and the cone was  bone  )  occasionally air would get caught in it and the machine would fart .   Some times a big fart would spray out some  'cream'   and blat it  onto the 'helpers'  .    :D

 

(not me , I always positioned myself at the other side  as a 'filler'  )

Edited by Nungali
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2 hours ago, Nungali said:

 

I like the Sufi story about the  'beggar' that got paid for being stupid .   His stupidity was " Oh no, thats too much money, give me less . " .    People thought it was funny to see a 'stupid' beggar ask for less money and not more .   So they would take their friends to watch hand him a large amount of money, then the beggar would complain and give most of it back , and everyone would laugh at him .

 

One day, a more compassionate fellow asked him why he did not just take the large amounts of money, and soon, he could  stop being a beggar  and establish himself in some business  or something . The beggar told the  man  " Oh no,  that sounds like I might have to do some hard work .  Also,  if I started accepting large amounts of money, people would soon stop offering it .   If I originally  just accepted the usual amount and never gave any back, I would be like every other beggar - poor and destitute . But by doing this, many rich people come here everyday and give me lots of money to show off in front of their friends how  stupid I am and how smart they are  .... by giving me their money .

 

I've met beggars and muggers living in Phnom Penh before: they held my friend up on the street and asked for $5 each, and even when he had more to give, they just handed his wallet back as they only wanted the $5. 

 

On the bus, people have been held up and handed their wallets over before to see someone take out $2 and hand back the wallet too. 

 

Such is the mindset of the Khmer, but there are also the casino scams among other things in Cambodia. 

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2 hours ago, Nungali said:

 

You should try making prep 500 in biodyamics , it requires one to fill up hollow cow horns with cow poop .  At work we had to make heaps of them , so we do 'an open day'  and 'teach'  people how to do it , FOR FREE !     :D 

 

Some guy converted an old sausage making machine , that worked like an evil Mr Whippy snow cone ( except the 'ice cream' was not vanilla 'flavour'  and the cone was  bone  )  occasionally air would get caught in it and the machine would fart .   Some times a big fart would spray out some  'cream'   and blat it  onto the 'helpers'  .    :D

 

(not me , I always positioned myself at the other side  as a 'filler'  )

 

I think I'd love to be a filler! :D:D:D 

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4 hours ago, Earl Grey said:

 

I've met beggars and muggers living in Phnom Penh before: they held my friend up on the street and asked for $5 each, and even when he had more to give, they just handed his wallet back as they only wanted the $5. 

 

On the bus, people have been held up and handed their wallets over before to see someone take out $2 and hand back the wallet too. 

 

Such is the mindset of the Khmer, but there are also the casino scams among other things in Cambodia. 

 

a similar principle  - if you  take all the money , tourists numbers drop .   Lots of tourists  $5 each  ..... raking it in .

 

Spoiler

What is it with Kymer's ?   I  know one  , a very small tiny lady . She is married to an Englishman ,  he was telling me  that when they where on holidays 'back home ' (her home ) and when he  was alone  he got  attacked by 5 men and they where giving him a  beating ... then his wife turns up, screams something at them  in her lingo and runs at them  , one of the  gang  yells to the others .

"  Look out !  She's a Khmer  ! "   ... and they all ran off .

 

Thats some wife !  

 

Actually, I would marry her !   Nice person,  always busy,  making  wonderful  food and preserves , runs a food stall at markets , juggles and looks after multiple kids - no problems or issues ,   gardens , grows food ....   she was even on a huge  tree winch cranking it  when we where removing some tricky trees  ....   chainsaws and chops firewood  ....   :wub: 

 

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTQconY4W_QqIZD8lMp3D2

 

 

 

Spoiler

 @ 0:20

 


 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Nungali said:

 

a similar principle  - if you  take all the money , tourists numbers drop .   Lots of tourists  $5 each  ..... raking it in .

 

  Hide contents

What is it with Kymer's ?   I  know one  , a very small tiny lady . She is married to an Englishman ,  he was telling me  that when they where on holidays 'back home ' (her home ) and when he  was alone  he got  attacked by 5 men and they where giving him a  beating ... then his wife turns up, screams something at them  in her lingo and runs at them  , one of the  gang  yells to the others .

"  Look out !  She's a Khmer  ! "   ... and they all ran off .

 

Thats some wife !  

 

Actually, I would marry her !   Nice person,  always busy,  making  wonderful  food and preserves , runs a food stall at markets , juggles and looks after multiple kids - no problems or issues ,   gardens , grows food ....   she was even on a huge  tree winch cranking it  when we where removing some tricky trees  ....   chainsaws and chops firewood  ....   :wub: 

 

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTQconY4W_QqIZD8lMp3D2

 

 

 

  Hide contents

 @ 0:20

 


 

 

 

 

It's a locals thing for some cultures I've lived amongst. Whether it's Filipina wives for American husbands being threatened by taxi drivers, Masai herdsmen for Korean engineers being mugged by bandits, and Chinese mothers to merchants trying to rip off their foreign-born children, as soon as someone knows the local language, they must know people, and those people must at least know the police or someone scarier--usually someone the perpetrators know. 

 

Another similar thing, domestically when I used to live in Pittsburgh: when I would go into the 'hood, this is something that never would have happened in Compton or Oakland back in California. Someone would come up to me and say, "Hey homie! Do you know where you are?" and I'd say I was looking for the gallery around Garfield, and they would say in return, "Oh! Homeboy, you took a wrong turn--this ain't the kinda place you wanna be around. Go back two blocks and turn right, then when you get to the traffic light, it's on the left. Easy to miss." 

 

I was in gangland. 

 

Later, my friends explained that whatever happens in the hood, they go to county jail and usually come out shortly after, anywhere between a few days to a few weeks. Anything that happens among boyz in the hood was between them and only them. 

 

Now, as an outsider, they had every reason to make sure I was out, and especially if a white guy was there got hurt, it would be federal prison for them...

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The way weather magic works as the op practices it is by commanding some low level spirits to alter things within the range of their abilities. It's not a siddhi. It's also an exchange, although what you're giving away in return for bragging rights I wouldn't like to say.

 

It certainly can be a siddhi though when you reach a high level in practice. But by then you wouldn't need the elaborate rituals or garb. I'd also imagine that very few people have, or are able to reach that level.

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23 hours ago, Earl Grey said:

 

I think I'd love to be a filler! :D:D:D 

 

 

this is disturbing

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12 minutes ago, manitou said:

 

 

this is disturbing

 

"It is better to give than to receive" and I think you would agree you would not want to receive gifts for the soil? :D 

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