SiliconValley Posted March 10, 2008 Drew, I have a basic question about reverse breathing. Whether it simply brings in more energy or chi into the lower tan tien or does it also open the microcosmic orbit? I read in a book (cannot recollect which one!) that reverse breathing, practiced seriously without the channels open, leads to problems. Thanks in advance for your inputs.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeform Posted March 10, 2008 I'm in no way an authority on reverse breathing, and would be interested to read Drew's reply. I discovered reverse breathing internally before having read about it. It was during a period when I was doing a lot of breath development - 3 dimensional breathing, slowing down the breath etc. The dangers I suspect come about when full, relaxed, natural 3d breathing (belly, lower back, sides etc.) is not yet developed, and you end up adding more tension to the system. I discovered the reverse breath when doing extensive pauses after the exhale. Eventually I would get a very powerful, expanding pulse on the end of the out breath and a vacuum-like contraction at the top of the in breath. If you pay attention to only the physical aspect of breathing, you'll notice the opposite effect - the in breath brings in a surge of oxygen and you feel expansive - the out breath then contracts inwards. So the energetic were moving like an opposite harmonic wave (expanding when the physical contracts and visa versa) - breathing this way for a while and allowing the body to time it perfectly, I would get submerged in a very powerful energetic pulse. The power would build and I found myself having orgasmic-like reactions with my breath involuntarily reversing (belly contracts on the in breath and expands and the out breath) - the belly follows the energetic wave pattern rather than the normal physical one... Now when I do the reverse breathing from the start, I can activate that pulsing very quickly, without hours of preliminary breathwork. I'm guessing that this is what reverse breathing is actually meant to do (?) Drew, I have a basic question about reverse breathing. Whether it simply brings in more energy or chi into the lower tan tien or does it also open the microcosmic orbit? I read in a book (cannot recollect which one!) that reverse breathing, practiced seriously without the channels open, leads to problems. Thanks in advance for your inputs.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
voidisyinyang Posted March 10, 2008 Yeah qigong master Chunyi Lin doesn't emphasize breathing -- he just teaches to use reverse breathing in a mild manner and then he emphasizes the small universe practice -- which opens up the energy channels. The mind has to guide the energy of course so the body should never be forced. For example you're not supposed to be able to hold your breath till you pass out -- supposedly the anterior cingulate gyrus (whatever that is) takes over your cerebral cortex intention of holding your breath, not enabling you to pass out. In fact in first grade we had a breath holding contest on the way to the bathroom at the other end of the school. I won easily -- holding my breath long after the others were breathing. My friend woke me up after I had hit the two cement corner walls and the cement floor and then I bawled all the way back to my room, leaving a trail of blood. Apparently the Sherpas were similarly tested -- only those who could hold their breath till passing out were allowed to guide the first Western climb of Mt. Everest. My book buddy Bert got this from a "Rituals of the Sherpa" book he came across. Also Ramana Maharshi said to practice breathing exerices but he warned against Kundalini yoga since it caused too much fixation on the body -- so again the mind has to guide the breath. The real mind though is not our thoughts -- so that's the "emotion of the mysterious" that Einstein was always trying to get at but never really figured out. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SiliconValley Posted March 10, 2008 Yeah qigong master Chunyi Lin doesn't emphasize breathing -- he just teaches to use reverse breathing in a mild manner and then he emphasizes the small universe practice -- which opens up the energy channels. The mind has to guide the energy of course so the body should never be forced. Wow, thats exactly what I was planning to ask. Master Lin does not seem to specify what breathing needs to be employed during Small universe, or does he and I missed it? During the active exercises he does teach reverse breathing but in Small Universe, it is assumed that normal breathing has to be followed? Appreciate your inputs, as always.....Thanks... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
voidisyinyang Posted March 11, 2008 Well he emphasizes "keeping the mouth shut" during the exercises. haha. That's what he told me: Keep your mouth shut! haha. That's basic yoga breathing - the nose filters and warms the air coming in (especially here in Minnesota). He states that he breathes like 3 times a minute or less for meditation so.... He states 20 minutes of full-lotus is worth 4 hours of any other excercise but small universe can also take you to the most advanced level. the "embryo" is actually when the energy moves to the middle tan tien and is surrounded by light -- that's really nirvikapli samadhi -- what Sri Yukteswar calls BREATHLESS ECSTASY You need to create strong electromagnetic fields first so the whole body is filled with them. Technically meditation doesn't start until after nirvikalpi samadhi is achieved. It's what Taoists call "the emptiness" -- but, as Master Nan, Huai-chin states most modern meditators don't even make it to this level before "falling back into worldliness" and here we are! haha. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wun Yuen Gong Posted March 11, 2008 Awesome Drew, since i have had a serious injury i cannot do full lotus would that mean it would be half the time to full lotus if i did half lotus? regards WYG Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
exorcist_1699 Posted March 11, 2008 (edited) The best way is the natural way , so ,any deliberate manipulating of your breath can hardly be a correct thing we should do . Similarly , embryonic breathing is a natural phenomena definitely will appear when your practice reach certain level [/b] Edited March 11, 2008 by exorcist_1699 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KoHsuan Posted March 12, 2008 Anyone reading this book lately? Seems like a treasure trove. Have been reading for the past few days but could not get past few chapters. There are various breathing practices, or probably one with slight modifications. Any pointers on how to go about this book would be greatly appreciated. the best explanation is on preface for volume 2 by Michael Wurmbrand... also when do you find reverse breathing in those volumes? can't remember any mention of it.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jadespear Posted October 17, 2013 It is a strange paradox to me ..... to attempt to see the tao as the way of nature while also attempting to overcome it. How does breathing in a certain way make one physically immortal? ... for we are all "spiritually immortal".... there is no mention in the tao te ching that I have read of any sort of physical immortality. Biologically, I see multiple forms of life changing at the cellular level to transform at the physical level over the course of millions of years..... even if you live for 1,000 + years "you" as far as I can see cannot live forever in the same physical state.... I think it is important to see and realize that taoist masters that some of us cite as references lived in a time of primordial existential preference... the standard lifetime of someone before the year 1800 was less than 30 years simply because of the poor scientific intelligence that we know possess, healthcare was at a very limited understanding. I'm not saying "natural" ways of living and healing ourselves and one another work or could even possibly enact a sort of physical immortality. But what I am saying is what is the point? Why would someone want to live forever? As far as I can tell, taoist teachings, point specifically to living "long, healthy, happy, and wise"... a physical immortality is not included, nor should be.... as "the way" or the "tao" is one of eternal change and transformation on all levels... Please feel free to rebuttle or dispute... I'm working with my own logic and limited teachings from age old sages...I believe anything is possible... the logic of physical immortality makes sense...as the physical plane exists before we can remember and probably will continue after we can see...just as we are physical. BUT, show me some evidence man....against the probabilities and majority. We of course don't need them to "believe", but it would help direct us to a more thorough understanding of ourselves. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
h.uriahr Posted October 17, 2013 Physical immortality is a lie or misunderstanding. No matter how hard you try, death is inescapable. It's the one thing you can't outrun. Death is a graduation. It's shedding this temporary vehicle to enter the next level. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
silent thunder Posted October 17, 2013 Have any of you guys read Yang Jwing Ming's Embryonic Breathing? I thought it was very good, I also bought the DVD which is ~hour and a half lecture. The best thing I liked about the book though was the translations of ancient docs he has in there. A significant portion of the book is dedicated to it. Many subtle road signs. Time for me to get this book. Dr Yang resonates deeply, love his style. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tsunami_MAPUA Posted October 17, 2013 just a question. I'll be starting with BK Frantzis' Longevity Breathing, especially his material from Opening the Energy Gates of your Body and his Taoist Breathing CDs. Is it worth it to get Dr. Yang's EB material at a later date, or should I just stick with LB and not bother at all with EB? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joeblast Posted October 17, 2013 Slightly different focus. EB is a piece of work that imho should be on the shelf of anyone who meditates. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted October 17, 2013 (edited) Physical immortality is a lie or misunderstanding. No matter how hard you try, death is inescapable. It's the one thing you can't outrun. Death is a graduation. It's shedding this temporary vehicle to enter the next level. According to Taoism, there is no reincarnation, no immortal soul and no afterlife. Your chi breaks apart after death, your conscious personality ceases to exist. Your chi will be recycled and used by Tao to create other beings. Read Waysun Liao's "Tao - The Way Of God" if you don't believe me. Liao is pretty clear about this fact. I can quote if you want. Edited October 17, 2013 by Dorian Black Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted October 17, 2013 (edited) Btw, I should add that this position is THE ONLY ONE which is congruent with today's position of SCIENCE! And therefore it's the most probable of all possible positions! All these beliefs of reincarnation, karma, going to heaven, an immortal soul etc. are only evidence that all those people are simply too weak in the mind to cope with the scary and butt-ugly fact that we all will face total destruction by death! This had to be said! Edited October 17, 2013 by Dorian Black Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brian Posted October 17, 2013 Why so loud? I think it's like supercalifragilisticexpialidocious, r v. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted October 17, 2013 (edited) Why so loud? I was so dumb to take the red pill. Edited October 17, 2013 by Dorian Black Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted October 17, 2013 Maybe I should have better taken the blue pill... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted October 17, 2013 “It is sometimes an appropriate response to reality to go insane.”― Philip K. Dick, VALIS 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted October 17, 2013 “We do not have to visit a madhouse to find disordered minds; our planet is the mental institution of the universe.”― Johann Wolfgang von Goethe Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joeblast Posted October 17, 2013 Btw, I should add that this position is THE ONLY ONE which is congruent with today's position of SCIENCE! And therefore it's the most probable of all possible positions! All these beliefs of reincarnation, karma, going to heaven, an immortal soul etc. are only evidence that all those people are simply too weak in the mind to cope with the scary and butt-ugly fact that we all will face total destruction by death! This had to be said! were today's iteration of "science" complete and comprehensive, I might listen to it. but I only listen to it where its expertise is concerned. outside those bounds, it has little more than what religion has to offer on it. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joeblast Posted October 17, 2013 “It is sometimes an appropriate response to reality to go insane.”― Philip K. Dick, VALIS no tv and no beer make homer somethin somethin Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brian Posted October 17, 2013 This oughta get us back on track, r v? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
