Transgender Q&A

[blue eyed snake]

yes, but i think what Apech means is that there is some underlying 'something' that goes deeper then the culturally male/female structure. And I agree with him, imo the cultural thing is too thin to hold the weight of the identity.

 

I am born a girl but at three i asked my 10 year older brother when my peepee would start to grow, he laughed at me and said I would not grow a peepee. Thinking he was making fun of me I ran to mom to ask her.

She told me I would not grow a peepee because I am a girl, that troubled me deeply, as i was sure I was a boy.

 

 

at three, i did not have much knowledge about cultural things. I just  thought of myself as  a boy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Maddie]

39 minutes ago, blue eyed snake said:

yes, but i think what Apech means is that there is some underlying 'something' that goes deeper then the culturally male/female structure. And I agree with him, imo the cultural thing is too thin to hold the weight of the identity.

 

I am born a girl but at three i asked my 10 year older brother when my peepee would start to grow, he laughed at me and said I would not grow a peepee. Thinking he was making fun of me I ran to mom to ask her.

She told me I would not grow a peepee because I am a girl, that troubled me deeply, as i was sure I was a boy.

 

 

at three, i did not have much knowledge about cultural things. I just  thought of myself as  a boy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That is very interesting actually

 

 

[old3bob]

Does anyone think  TV and movies overdoing all the sexual variations of people on their shows, it seems kind of like sometimes when making it a big part of the show...then again I'm an old guy pretty set in my ways. 

[liminal_luke]

1 hour ago, old3bob said:

Does anyone think  TV and movies overdoing all the sexual variations of people on their shows, it seems kind of like sometimes when making it a big part of the show...then again I'm an old guy pretty set in my ways. 

 

I so rarely find myself vibing with any of your opinions on social issues, but reading the post above I feel like sitting next to you on a park bench and being old foggies together. Lets get Apech.  I´ll buy birdseed to feed the pigeons.

 

(To be honest, I enjoy sexually themed shows.  I liked Transparent.  Back in the day, my best friend used to throw weekly Queer as Folk parties; we´d all huddle around the TV, eager to watch a sexy soap featuring gays like us.  That was fun. But I do wonder if as a culture we´re overdoing the identity thing; are we a bit too quick to put ourselves and others into various ideologically bogged-down boxes?  Let´s have (consensual, ethical) sex with who we want to have sex with.  Let´s dress up in gowns or jeans or leather panties.  Whatever.  But do we have to make such a big deal about the name we give ourselves?  Maybe our labels aren´t so important.)

 

Edited April 13 by liminal_luke

[idiot_stimpy]

Maddie, if you are reborn as a human in the next life will you have attachment or aversion to the bodies sex at birth or just leave it be?

[Maddie]

1 hour ago, idiot_stimpy said:

Maddie, if you are reborn as a human in the next life will you have attachment or aversion to the bodies sex at birth or just leave it be?

 

I have absolutely no idea LOL 🤣 

[old3bob]

6 hours ago, liminal_luke said:

 

I so rarely find myself vibing with any of your opinions on social issues, but reading the post above I feel like sitting next to you on a park bench and being old foggies together. Lets get Apech.  I´ll buy birdseed to feed the pigeons.

 

(To be honest, I enjoy sexually themed shows.  I liked Transparent.  Back in the day, my best friend used to throw weekly Queer as Folk parties; we´d all huddle around the TV, eager to watch a sexy soap featuring gays like us.  That was fun. But I do wonder if as a culture we´re overdoing the identity thing; are we a bit too quick to put ourselves and others into various ideologically bogged-down boxes?  Let´s have (consensual, ethical) sex with who we want to have sex with.  Let´s dress up in gowns or jeans or leather panties.  Whatever.  But do we have to make such a big deal about the name we give ourselves?  Maybe our labels aren´t so important.)

 

 

Well I watch tv or movies looking for epic adventures, quests or action,  say "Lord of the Rings" type shows or something like "Bosch" the detective,  some informative historical documentaries, treasure hunting, an occasional survival episode  and quality Sci-Fi like "Dune",, so my bias is related to those. 

Edited April 13 by old3bob

[blue eyed snake]

15 hours ago, Maddie said:

 

Yin/Yang indeed lol. 

 

There have actually been a number of psychological changes that have occurred since I began transitioning. When I began my medical transition I was put on a combination of testosterone blockers and estrogen pills. This completely changed my body chemistry from male to female. This had a dramatic effect on my emotional life and perceptions. 

 

For one thing I cry much  easier. Before as a man I would rarely cry, maybe once every few years. It wasn't that I was not trying to, it just didn't happen. Now I cry easily several times a week, and often for not obvious reason. This was one of the first changes I noticed. 

 

My sense of smell has become more sensitive as well. While many years of cultivation has made me sexually indifferent I perceive men differently than I used to. I used to be completely indifferent to a man's appearance aside from the obvious of realizing a well groomed in shape man was better looking than an unwashed bum (no offense Dao Bums). Now I find attractive men catching my eye in a way that they had not before. I am still not sexually attracted to them (nor am I to women) but I find them more aesthetically pleasing. 

 

Now here's one that I don't care for but you take the bad with the good. I have lost significant amounts of muscle strength, especially upper body strength. When I was in college I did jujitsu and did not find sparing with men to be difficult on a strength level, but now I am significantly overpowered when sparring with men. I guess the plus side is this forces me to rely on technique more, which is how its supposed to be in jujitsu lol. 

 

Those are a few of the more obvious changes that I was able to think of off the top of my head.  

 from a physical point of view, the ease of crying and the acuteness of smell are estrogen related, when I became menopausal i experienced this in the other direction.

 

about the dimming of sexuality, I have never done anything ( hormones/surgery) about the femaleness of my body.

I remember being very horny the first year I practised my brand of chigung, like a teenager really. With teacher warning me not to indulge myself 

[blue eyed snake]

14 hours ago, Maddie said:

 

After meditating and realizing I was trans I had a bunch of repressed memories come back from when I was little. I showed tendencies back then and then I was forced to repressive them the point that I did not even consciously realize this for a long time.

 

 

yes, that is a story I've heard from several transpeople, like" oh, i always was like this but socieyl ( parents/sibs/peers) sort of pressured me to conform to the mold.

 

I think in that regard  I was lucky with the family i was born into

[blue eyed snake]

14 hours ago, liminal_luke said:

 

I´m so sorry to hear this.  My mom´s partner Skip has a child (well, an adult now) who is a transwoman.  Initially Skip had a very difficult time accepting his daughter Emily but my mom wasn´t having it.  She said that if he didn´t come around and accept his daughter that he wasn´t the man she thought he was and she would leave him.  He came round.

 

i think your mom is a good person 

[blue eyed snake]

12 hours ago, Apech said:

I wonder if this has to do with moving focus onto the heart centre - rather than head or belly (which is where most men dwell).

 

interesting question

[RobB]

I get the impression that half of the problem is people getting their categorisation systems challenged and not being able to work that through. We've tended to think in simple binaries which suit majority experience but don't adequately describe the whole data set at a certain level of detail.

 

I don't think about sex or gender much unless I'm forced to (working in Higher Ed makes it inevitable sometimes). Personally, I prefer an analogue model: sex and gender as a couple of sliders that can be at any point along a range and can change over time.

Edited April 13 by RobB
Speeling

[blue eyed snake]

12 hours ago, Apech said:

Yes.  Something deeper.  Spirit likes variety I think.  

 

I do not know why a minority of people does not feel at home in their bodies, but it is a deep-rooted feeling. And not, what is often thought, a psychological or psychiatric phenomena. Although I guess that currently with all the eyes that are on the alphabet people, some nutty people have gathered under that flag that are mislead ( or worse, misusing it). I would also not rule out that currently some youngsters walk that path just because they can. But at its core these people exist and are now in a same sort of "societal transition-time" as I have seen gays and lesbians go through.

 

Not being pushed into shame and unfit for society, but simply being accepted for having a different sexual attraction then the majority, not a psychiatric condition, no need to "cure" with conversion therapy, just accept us, as we are.

 

I think that there are differences in the fleshbody to be found, but not yet looked for.

 

looking at my own body as a young woman: hands and feet to big ( those feet have never fitted in girl or ladies shoes) too much musclemass ( and a joy to train) brain too analytical, all very unladylike and never have wanted to be that either. ( also hormone levels not fitting into the accepted levels for a female, allergic reaction to estrogens)

One day medical people will find physical differences between cis and trans people and as such, when you do want to make groups I guess we will fit in much better with intersex people. 

 

here in western society we've tended to make intersex people confirm to being male or female as babies. So as to let them fit in with society. So it is society that cuts humans in 2 different halves and you're not allowed to be different from the norm. But older societies could not do that and have different ways of looking at and integrating ( or not) people diverging from the norm.

 

the first part of my life I lived/masked as a boy/young man. During high-school that was problematic, but after that I became a mechanic and found the same sense of friendship and camaraderie I had with boys when still a child. Oh, they all knew I was a woman, but I was accepted as one of the guys, doing the same chores, and having the same joys.

 

the second part I have tried to live as a woman, it was not successful and it has made me unhappy, the best choice i have ever made was divorce after the kid was of age. That kid interestingly, much later told me: mom, when I was a kid you really were more of a dad then a mom.

 

I never had easy contact with girls, their interests were not mine and it was only deep into my forties that friendships with women developed.

I clearly remember the moment when a female friend had to have surgery because of a very high risk on hereditary breast-cancer, a double mastectomy, she told me it hurt her so much as her breasts were part of her female identity just like with all women. I never told her, but at that moment i found myself thinking. Having no breasts would make me happy.

 

Now during the third and last part of my life I am just human, the whole idea of man or woman, one way or the other, has left me.

 

-----

 

Obviously this whole subject has had my interest for a very long time, I know several trans-people that you would not be able to spot, as they blend so well in the picture we expect with a certain gender.

 

I guess most of us are just trying to blend in were we feel we belong and the portrayal of trans-people as pink and rainbowy dressed up people is cringy to me.

 

there is grumbling about the prides too, too much rainbows and things.

but I guess in essence what a pride is...the reversal of shame, I should be ashamed I do not fit in societal norms of what a girl should be, just as back in the days, gays should be ashamed to be attracted to a male, "that's unnatural"

 

I will never forget the teacher that left my primary school because he was a homosexual. Although it was never said out loud by the grownups, all the kids were blabbing about it. Looking back, he was a very feminine man for sure. That was in the sixties

 

lets not repeat such things.

 

 

 

 

[blue eyed snake]

9 hours ago, old3bob said:

Does anyone think  TV and movies overdoing all the sexual variations of people on their shows, it seems kind of like sometimes when making it a big part of the show...then again I'm an old guy pretty set in my ways. 

 

9 hours ago, liminal_luke said:

 

I so rarely find myself vibing with any of your opinions on social issues, but reading the post above I feel like sitting next to you on a park bench and being old foggies together. Lets get Apech.  I´ll buy birdseed to feed the pigeons.

 

 

Move over a bit, I would like a seat on the bench too, will get some cookies for us to share

[Apech]

9 hours ago, liminal_luke said:

 

I so rarely find myself vibing with any of your opinions on social issues, but reading the post above I feel like sitting next to you on a park bench and being old foggies together. Lets get Apech.  I´ll buy birdseed to feed the pigeons.

 

(To be honest, I enjoy sexually themed shows.  I liked Transparent.  Back in the day, my best friend used to throw weekly Queer as Folk parties; we´d all huddle around the TV, eager to watch a sexy soap featuring gays like us.  That was fun. But I do wonder if as a culture we´re overdoing the identity thing; are we a bit too quick to put ourselves and others into various ideologically bogged-down boxes?  Let´s have (consensual, ethical) sex with who we want to have sex with.  Let´s dress up in gowns or jeans or leather panties.  Whatever.  But do we have to make such a big deal about the name we give ourselves?  Maybe our labels aren´t so important.)

 

 

Hang on ... there's something about the formula 'old foggy = Apech' which I don't warm to. lol.

[liminal_luke]

2 hours ago, blue eyed snake said:

 

 

Move over a bit, I would like a seat on the bench too, will get some cookies for us to share

 

Welcome!  We´ll gladly accept you as one of the bench dudes.  As a former mechanic, I figure you´re more man than I´ll ever be. 

[Tommy]

Q&A?

My question, hopefully does not sound insensitive, is ... may be better I just shut up ... did transitioning change any desire to have family? Raising children? Having a partner? Or does this belong in that is too personal category?

 

I apologize for my ignorance in these matters.

Edited April 13 by Tommy

[old3bob]

3 hours ago, Apech said:

 

Hang on ... there's something about the formula 'old foggy = Apech' which I don't warm to. lol.

 

A term that it is probably not heard much anywhere else but Alaska is this:  "Pioneers who wandered the territory carrying sourdough starter in their packs became known as “sourdoughs”—a term that is now used to label an Alaskan old timer".  (and some who were or are pretty sour like in dealing with greenhorns)

[Maddie]

56 minutes ago, Tommy said:

Q&A?

My question, hopefully does not sound insensitive, is ... may be better I just shut up ... did transitioning change any desire to have family? Raising children? Having a partner? Or does this belong in that is too personal category?

 

I apologize for my ignorance in these matters.

 

Not insensitive at all, this is a Q&A after all lol. But no the act of transitioning did not change the desire for a family and such. I think the meditation that caused me to realize that I am trans in the first place did change that desire though. I have done a lot of Buddhist meditation and since Buddhism is focused on letting go of attachment I became asexual and have no desire for such things. 

[Maddie]

27 minutes ago, old3bob said:

 

A term that it is probably not heard much anywhere else but Alaska is this:  "Pioneers who wandered the territory carrying sourdough starter in their packs became known as “sourdoughs”—a term that is now used to label an Alaskan old timer".  (and some who were or are pretty sour like in dealing with greenhorns)

 

I went to college in Alaska :-)

[Maddie]

3 hours ago, blue eyed snake said:

 

I do not know why a minority of people does not feel at home in their bodies, but it is a deep-rooted feeling. And not, what is often thought, a psychological or psychiatric phenomena. Although I guess that currently with all the eyes that are on the alphabet people, some nutty people have gathered under that flag that are mislead ( or worse, misusing it). I would also not rule out that currently some youngsters walk that path just because they can. But at its core these people exist and are now in a same sort of "societal transition-time" as I have seen gays and lesbians go through.

 

Not being pushed into shame and unfit for society, but simply being accepted for having a different sexual attraction then the majority, not a psychiatric condition, no need to "cure" with conversion therapy, just accept us, as we are.

 

I think that there are differences in the fleshbody to be found, but not yet looked for.

 

looking at my own body as a young woman: hands and feet to big ( those feet have never fitted in girl or ladies shoes) too much musclemass ( and a joy to train) brain too analytical, all very unladylike and never have wanted to be that either. ( also hormone levels not fitting into the accepted levels for a female, allergic reaction to estrogens)

One day medical people will find physical differences between cis and trans people and as such, when you do want to make groups I guess we will fit in much better with intersex people. 

 

here in western society we've tended to make intersex people confirm to being male or female as babies. So as to let them fit in with society. So it is society that cuts humans in 2 different halves and you're not allowed to be different from the norm. But older societies could not do that and have different ways of looking at and integrating ( or not) people diverging from the norm.

 

the first part of my life I lived/masked as a boy/young man. During high-school that was problematic, but after that I became a mechanic and found the same sense of friendship and camaraderie I had with boys when still a child. Oh, they all knew I was a woman, but I was accepted as one of the guys, doing the same chores, and having the same joys.

 

the second part I have tried to live as a woman, it was not successful and it has made me unhappy, the best choice i have ever made was divorce after the kid was of age. That kid interestingly, much later told me: mom, when I was a kid you really were more of a dad then a mom.

 

I never had easy contact with girls, their interests were not mine and it was only deep into my forties that friendships with women developed.

I clearly remember the moment when a female friend had to have surgery because of a very high risk on hereditary breast-cancer, a double mastectomy, she told me it hurt her so much as her breasts were part of her female identity just like with all women. I never told her, but at that moment i found myself thinking. Having no breasts would make me happy.

 

Now during the third and last part of my life I am just human, the whole idea of man or woman, one way or the other, has left me.

 

-----

 

Obviously this whole subject has had my interest for a very long time, I know several trans-people that you would not be able to spot, as they blend so well in the picture we expect with a certain gender.

 

I guess most of us are just trying to blend in were we feel we belong and the portrayal of trans-people as pink and rainbowy dressed up people is cringy to me.

 

there is grumbling about the prides too, too much rainbows and things.

but I guess in essence what a pride is...the reversal of shame, I should be ashamed I do not fit in societal norms of what a girl should be, just as back in the days, gays should be ashamed to be attracted to a male, "that's unnatural"

 

I will never forget the teacher that left my primary school because he was a homosexual. Although it was never said out loud by the grownups, all the kids were blabbing about it. Looking back, he was a very feminine man for sure. That was in the sixties

 

lets not repeat such things.

 

 

 

 

 

Your experience sounds amazingly relatable!

[thelerner]

12 hours ago, idiot_stimpy said:

Maddie, if you are reborn as a human in the next life will you have attachment or aversion to the bodies sex at birth or just leave it be?

If I'm reborn as a human in the next life..

I will file a complaint.  I want some time off. 

 

 

for my good or bad behavior.  

[Maddie]

4 hours ago, RobB said:

I get the impression that half of the problem is people getting their categorisation systems challenged and not being able to work that through. We've tended to think in simple binaries which suit majority experience but don't adequately describe the whole data set at a certain level of detail.

 

I don't think about sex or gender much unless I'm forced to (working in Higher Ed makes it inevitable sometimes). Personally, I prefer an analogue model: sex and gender as a couple of sliders that can be at any point along a range and can change over time.

 

This is exactly the issue!

[Maddie]

3 minutes ago, thelerner said:

If I'm reborn as a human in the next life..

I will file a complaint.  I want some time off. 

 

 

for my good or bad behavior.  

 

For real, I think my actually reaction would be WTF?! again? lol

[liminal_luke]

4 hours ago, blue eyed snake said:

 

I guess most of us are just trying to blend in were we feel we belong and the portrayal of trans-people as pink and rainbowy dressed up people is cringy to me.

 

 

I think sometimes trans stuff gets thrown in, wrongly, with the over-the-top craziness of drag queens.  I gather there´s some overlap between the drag and trans communities but they´re fundamentally different.