old3bob Posted August 2, 2023 there is only one true auto and its a Ford, that is until Chevy came up with the Corvette, that is until Dodge or Chrysler came up with the Viper, that is until Ford came back up with the new Shelby 500, anyway they are all vehicles that get somewhere...just ask Burt, an early and once well known master who had a hot Pontiac. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted August 2, 2023 25 minutes ago, Bindi said: Argument from inconsistent revelations The argument from inconsistent revelations is an argument that aims to show that one cannot choose one religion over another since their revelations are inconsistent with each other and that any two religions cannot be true.[61] The argument appears, among other places, in Voltaire's Candide and Philosophical Dictionary. It is also manifested in Denis Diderot's statement in response to Pascal's wager that, whatever proofs are offered for the existence of God in Christianity or any other religion, "an Imam can reason the same way". argument for consistent revelation : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_revelation_(Baháʼí) ... it can work , I have seen and experienced it myself ; different people from different ethnic cultural and religious backgrounds, sitting in temple together and reading out ;'their' sacred scriptures from the 9 different sources . . . and the resultant great 'social impact' from that as well . Now there is an unpopular opinion ! ( In Iran that is .... https://www.bic.org/news/archives-chronicle-decades-bahai-persecution-iran Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted August 2, 2023 16 minutes ago, Bindi said: I think the Indian parable of the 5 blind men each holding a different part of the elephant is spot on, I also find some truth in a variety of different systems. Mulla Nasruddin's answer to the riddle : Spoiler " Guys .... I really hope I am holding the trunk ." 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Posted August 2, 2023 27 minutes ago, Bindi said: I think the Indian parable of the 5 blind men each holding a different part of the elephant is spot on, I also find some truth in a variety of different systems. Agreed 100%. I almost posted it, but I said to myself, "nope, it's too popular". 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Posted August 2, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Nungali said: Or consider the Hebrew ; 'Torah'. ... teaching ... https://www.sefaria.org/Klein_Dictionary%2C_תּוֹרָה.1?lang=bi&with=all&lang2=en 1 hour ago, Nungali said: There is no Hebrew word for religion. kinda... it would be emunah ( faith ) + betach ( to trust ). Generally this is an idea ( there is no religion ) put forward by, ummm, a somewhat radical group of rationalists. It first arrived on the scene in around 1200 CE ish, and there was quite a bit of push back from the mystical community. Naturally, I'm not a huge fan of that movement. But, there's a lot of different people in the world, and it's good that these rational approaches exist along side with the more imaginative approaches. Edited August 2, 2023 by Daniel 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michael Sternbach Posted August 2, 2023 8 hours ago, Bindi said: Yes, the definition of original sin would have to be majorly reworked. Taking an innocent happy child and indoctrinating them with a belief that something is fundamentally wrong with them and that they're in need of redemption is the actual 'sin'. More of a crime, in fact... 🤮 3 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
old3bob Posted August 2, 2023 (edited) Christianity is and has been very heavily co-opted by worldly forces for power and control over people since about it's first day, including centuries of "Manifest destiny" resulting in genocide against many native peoples in its name ...but that does not mean the co-opting that has been done is the truth about it. Same thing happens in many religions. (which should surprise no one at this late date) Edited August 2, 2023 by old3bob 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted August 2, 2023 13 hours ago, Bindi said: Couldn’t karma be referred to as original sin, that which we are born with though not entangled with some weird god belief? I don't think the two can be equated since karma involves all action - good, bad, indifferent - as cause and effect. While a sin, as I understand it is specifically an act in contradiction to God's law/commandments. If original sin derives from the 'fall' i.e. Adam and Eve eating the prohibited apple and being thrown out of Eden - then I suppose you could argue that any baby born to a human after the fall has the mark of that act upon them and thus has this capacity to disobey God. Not being able to disobey God would make us like slaves or machines coded to behave ina certain way instead of free beings. 3 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted August 2, 2023 14 hours ago, Bindi said: I think effectively and ultimately divided. In terms of Shakti/Shiva, posit Shiva as the higher Self, undivided in himself, but undeniably divided from kundalini until kundalini is awakened and raised to the right place and in the right time to join with Shiva. If you allow some relation between Shiva and Shakti then they cannot be ultimately divided. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted August 2, 2023 14 hours ago, Nungali said: Apech and Mark Foote discussing Buddhism . Nungali suffers shock after disagreeing with himself: 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Taoist Texts Posted August 2, 2023 5 hours ago, Michael Sternbach said: Taking an innocent happy child and indoctrinating them with a belief that something is fundamentally wrong with them and that they're in need of redemption is the actual 'sin'. More of a crime, in fact... 🤮 it is a heinous crime indeed. although it is a recent development. not christian but satanic. 14 hours ago, Bindi said: Couldn’t karma be referred to as original sin, that which we are born with not quite. there is only one kind of sin - a bad one. while the karma can be either good or bad. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
whocoulditbe? Posted August 2, 2023 3 minutes ago, Taoist Texts said: it is a heinous crime indeed. although it is a recent development. not christian but satanic. What are you hinting at? Gender transition? Quote 14 hours ago, Bindi said: Couldn’t karma be referred to as original sin, that which we are born with not quite. there is only one kind of sin - a bad one. while the karma can be either good or bad. Maybe the assertion that we're made in God's image posits a kind of good karma in contrast with original sin. On the other hand, you see it used to indicate the inadequacy of a given action as much as to justify human dominance over the earth. But is good karma usually understood in terms of adequacy (i.e. dharma)? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Posted August 2, 2023 5 hours ago, Michael Sternbach said: Taking an innocent happy child and indoctrinating them with a belief that something is fundamentally wrong with them and that they're in need of redemption is the actual 'sin'. More of a crime, in fact... 🤮 Especially when the text actually says if there is a flaw "you can be its master!" Gen 4:7. There's multiple crimes involved, if I start getting technical. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Posted August 2, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Apech said: then I suppose you could argue that any baby born to a human after the fall has the mark of that act upon them "... any baby born has the mark of that act upon them ..." The only, kinda-sorta, analogy I can come up with, and I'm not saying it's good, is: What if the harm caused to the mother during childbirth is a karmic debt on each and every child? Edited August 2, 2023 by Daniel Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
old3bob Posted August 2, 2023 (edited) it's somewhat of a mind bender to think that soul would want to be involved in bad karma so it could also gain experience of that and overcome it... actors on a stage who forgot they were actors? Edited August 2, 2023 by old3bob Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oak Posted August 2, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Apech said: I don't think the two can be equated since karma involves all action - good, bad, indifferent - as cause and effect. While a sin, as I understand it is specifically an act in contradiction to God's law/commandments. If original sin derives from the 'fall' i.e. Adam and Eve eating the prohibited apple and being thrown out of Eden - then I suppose you could argue that any baby born to a human after the fall has the mark of that act upon them and thus has this capacity to disobey God. Not being able to disobey God would make us like slaves or machines coded to behave ina certain way instead of free beings. I think that it helps to know that the hebrew word for sin is "khata" which means "to miss the target". That brings a new prespective on things. At least to me. Edited August 2, 2023 by oak 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Posted August 2, 2023 Unpopular opinion inspired by the comments about so-called "sin" and the so-called "fall": life is simply-complicated Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oak Posted August 2, 2023 Unpopular opinion: There are no humans, there are only hominoid machines. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
old3bob Posted August 2, 2023 well it does have nice humanoid teeth... 2 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oak Posted August 2, 2023 7 minutes ago, old3bob said: well it does have nice humanoid teeth... Sorry wrong smiley. Should be 😁 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Posted August 2, 2023 3 hours ago, Taoist Texts said: not christian but satanic. 8 hours ago, old3bob said: Christianity is and has been very heavily co-opted by worldly forces for power and control over people since about it's first day, Like a moth to a flame... *sigh*. Gratefully a lot of good lessons can be learned from that moth and the way it operates. As long as the lessons learned are inverted and interpretted in reverse. Unpopular opinion: "also this is for the good". https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nachum_Ish_Gamzu#:~:text=Nachum Ish Gamzu's name is,("גמ זו"%2C meaning Nachum Ish Gamzu's name is described in the Talmud as having grown colloquially from Nachum's tendency to react to misfortune with unyielding optimism, in each case uttering a phrase that became famously attached to him: "gam zu le-tovah" ( literal translation above ). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Posted August 2, 2023 54 minutes ago, oak said: There are no humans, there are only hominoid machines. Unpopular opinion: I am not a slave! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oak Posted August 2, 2023 18 minutes ago, Daniel said: Unpopular opinion: I am not a slave! Well, I am 🥳🥳🥳 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Posted August 2, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, oak said: Well, I am 🥳🥳🥳 So. Within a few seconds of declaring my independence, zzzzzzap. The power goes out. Lol. Like immediately. The battery backups start beeping. I go to the window and look. The power company is outside with their trucks. I head out to have a chat, friendly, I promise, with the crew-supervisor, feeling a bit like an American version of Arthur Dent in The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. The divine comedy continues... Edited August 2, 2023 by Daniel 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
