Global Revolution!

[Seth Ananda]

[voidisyinyang]

Hrm...f&f were at the forefront of this debacle since the homeownership craze began in the 90s. Asserting they were "followers that got in relatively late" in this merely underscores that a lot of the loans originated in private enterprises and had f&f types telling them "sell as many of these as you can, we'll buy all of them" and then basically wiped any risk assessment from them and sold them off - so many of the mechanizations simply wound up serving to obscure the loan risk from the buyer, which is part of the jist of the SEC complaint.

 

F&f aside, it was none other than congress that procured this big push to get anybody and everybody that wanted to own a home into one whether they could afford the mortgage or not. These "packagings" of the loans happened as a response to government action - when you start mandating race or income quotas and you have to fill them even if the people dont "qualify" for the loan - you are seriously bypassing all of the underwriting standards that had traditionally made very good assessments of whether or not a loan was a good idea. Put the "government backed guarantee" on it and you wind up with a free for all, as we saw. Mandate that these guys take on more risk, they came up with a mechanism to alleviate themselves of that risk, screw whomever it went to, because the gub will pick up the tab if it goes belly up - they told us we had to, after all!

 

Greedy? Yes...but.

 

Yeah my dad was a huge libertarian corporate conservative and even liked Ayn Rand via his NYU connections -- but then he admitted he wished Greenspan hadn't pushed everyone getting a second mortgage. haha. The big problem is that wall street turned 90% speculative -- I first learned this in the book "When Corporations Rule the World" by David Korten -- a great read. So I first made that public knowledge through protests against the speculative Cargill grain exchange scam in Minneapolis. I have researched Cargill -- the largest private corporation in the world makes billions in profit - -net - every year but also gets a huge amount in public subsidies because the purpose of Cargill is to make 100 foreign countries dependent on the U.S. for food. If you can control another controls food supply by DUMPING food that then wipes out the local farmers ability to be self-sufficient financially -- then you can control the countries resources and politics -- I have tons of research on this. Cargill is also destroying the Amazon by promoting and buying up all the soybeans possible that are grown on previous Amazon rainforest. The liberal Hubert Humphrey set up the Cargill scam -- Food for Peace it was called. So from agricultural deriatives then wall street turned into a deriative frenzy starting in the 1970s. I think it is based on petrodollars -- and the third world debt crisis originally -- pushing bad loans based on petrodollar inflation. Then the interest rate now makes the developing world the NET provider to the rich countries -- the poor countries pay more money then they have received in aid and the poor are starving to death -- so there goes any government subsidy B.S. The World Bank and IMF have set up this huge scam globally -- so now it is coming home to roost in the U.S.

[ralis]

Two brilliant quotes Informer

 

Any why did this thread get moved?

 

I would like to know why also. This topic concerns the welfare of the entire planet!

[Informer]

The only reason I could determine that the events of Joeblast being owned coinciding in both threads that got moved, so probably the mod that moved it is really JoeBlast. It wouldn't suprise me that misinformation agents would ooze their way here.

Edited January 3, 2012 by Informer

[Protector]

THE MODS ARE ILLUMINATI?

SHHHHHHHHHHHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

[steve]

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Mod Message

 

I decided to move this thread to Off Topic because it is simply political debate and discussion and unrelated to cultivation and spirituality and, as political discussion tends to be, it's been the source of multiple reports.

Political discussion is welcome but should be in the Off Topic section.

 

Mod Out

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[bowowtao]

My father was a loan officer for 50 years. I remember in 86' he commented on the high number of bad loans

being overlooked and saying that there would probably be an investigation and a few people jailed over it.

If I recall about a dozen officers were locked up for bad loans. He said that every year the Gov would 'look the other way' from bad loans to keep the market stable and that about every 20 years the market would bubble and Loan Officers would begin hiring employes to act as Loan Originators in order to keep up with market demand and increase their profits till the bubble burst. Apparently the trick was knowing when to stop cheating and not be one of the unlucky loan writers that got investigated. Again the Gov allowed a certain number of bad loans every year without investigation. In 91' he switched to brokering and said "the market is totally corrupt" " I know what they're doing, but I don't understand why they want riots ..everyone is going to be on the street"

 

NDAA. Sometimes I get caught up in fears and blinded by polarity. There are so many things happening this year sometimes it seems very difficult stay intuitive about where the big picture is headed.

Remeber George Bush before the end of hi term bought an island (Venezuela?) that has one of the largest natural fresh water spring in the world -good move. Cheny was busy stocking up on natural gas (recent earthquakes)

 

A lot of "retiring" CIA settled into south America at this time as well.

 

Here's a thought out of the Ether: the NDAA is actually for arresting War Criminals who because of their

tremendous wealth might other wise be able to re-establish elsewhere. NDAA stipulates 'US citizens' anywhere in the world and 'military?' doing the arresting.. Also, like I mentioned a lot of CIA, black ops and private armies like Black Water are housed off US soil to prevent investigation. It would take a bill like NDAA to round up the 1.2 million that either gave or followed orders during Rothschilds war on humanity. Being arrested by military means being tried under military law and sentences without reprieve. Rothchilds are now hold up in Israel.. Israel is the richest farm belt in the world ..Kinda makes sense with Roths owning that part of the world and the riots over foods prices. what they really needed to do was withhold all the food, just for a month or so..

 

What are the rules on this web site regarding the title 'General Discussion' ..?

 

GLOBAL REVOLUTION seems severely General to me!

 

Woof..

[Informer]

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Mod Message

 

I decided to move this thread to Off Topic because it is simply political debate and discussion and unrelated to cultivation and spirituality and, as political discussion tends to be, it's been the source of multiple reports.

Political discussion is welcome but should be in the Off Topic section.

 

Mod Out

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

THEN WHY DON'T YOU TAKE ACTION ON THE OFFENSIVE POSTS OR POSTERS RATHER THAN THE ENTIRE THREAD AS YOU HAVE DONE IN THE PAST?????????????????????????

 

wannabe.

[ralis]

THEN WHY DON'T YOU TAKE ACTION ON THE OFFENSIVE POSTS OR POSTERS RATHER THAN THE ENTIRE THREAD AS YOU HAVE DONE IN THE PAST?????????????????????????

 

wannabe.

 

Joe in another thread that was moved, wrote that I "had my head up my ass". I was banned for 1 week for less than that. Joe wasn't banned but the thread was moved. I thought insults were taboo here.

[joeblast]

Joe in another thread that was moved, wrote that I "had my head up my ass". I was banned for 1 week for less than that. Joe wasn't banned but the thread was moved. I thought insults were taboo here.

Oh did I? Please quote that so that I may show you your folly.

 

And yes, I did report this thread - I noted on about page 5 that this thread belonged in OT as this is not the focus of the forum and political threads tend toward shitstorm when you have many different people with many different beliefs.

 

Kyoto was political from the getgo, the shitstorm started when someone tried involving science

[bowowtao]

The rule of government and how it limits it people is

a topic of great spiritual concern.

 

" And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all of them who sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves,

 

And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves. "

 

and for the "spirited" Taoist

 

Lao Tzu (official head of this site and all Taoists -on Goverment:

 

GOVERNMENT

 

NOT exalting worth keeps the people from rivalry. Not prizing what is hard to procure keeps the people from theft. Not to show them what they may covet is the way to keep their minds from disorder.

 

Therefore the Sage, when he governs, empties their minds and fills their bellies, weakens their inclinations and strengthens their bones. His constant object is to keep the people without knowledge and without desire, or to prevent those who have knowledge from daring to act. He practises inaction, and nothing remains ungoverned.

 

He who respects the State as his own person is fit to govern it. He who loves the State as his own body is fit to be entrusted with it.

 

In the highest antiquity, the people did not know that they had rulers. In the next age they loved and praised them. In the next, they feared them. In the next, they despised them.

 

How cautious is the Sage, how sparing of his words! When his task is accomplished and affairs are prosperous, the people all say: "We have come to be as we are, naturally and of ourselves."

 

If any one desires to take the Empire in hand and govern it, I see that he will not succeed. The Empire is a divine utensil which may not be

 

p. 38

 

roughly handled. He who meddles, mars. He who holds it by force, loses it.

 

Fishes must not be taken from the water: the methods of government must not be exhibited to the people.

 

Use uprightness in ruling a State; employ stratagems in waging war; practise non-interference in order to win the Empire. Now this is how I know what I lay down:--

 

As restrictions and prohibitions are multiplied in the Empire, the people grow poorer and poorer. When the people are subjected to overmuch government, the land is thrown into confusion. When the people are skilled in many cunning arts, strange are the objects of luxury that appear.

 

The greater the number of laws and enactments, the more thieves and robbers there will be. Therefore the Sage says: "So long as I do nothing, the people will work out their own reformation. So long as I love calm, the people will right themselves. If only I keep from meddling, the people will grow rich. If only I am free from desire, the people will come naturally back to simplicity."

 

If the government is sluggish and tolerant, the people will be honest and free from guile. If the government is prying and meddling, there will be constant infraction of the law. Is the government corrupt? Then uprightness becomes rare, and goodness becomes strange. Verily, mankind have been under delusion for many a day!

 

Govern a great nation as you would cook a small fish. *

 

p. 39

 

If the Empire is governed according to Tao, disembodied spirits will not manifest supernatural powers. It is not that they lack supernatural power, but they will not use it to hurt mankind. Again, it is not that they are unable to hurt mankind, but they see that the Sage also does not hurt mankind. If then neither Sage nor spirits work harm, their virtue converges to one beneficent end.

 

In ancient times those who knew how to practise Tao did not use it to enlighten the people, but rather to keep them ignorant. The difficulty of governing the people arises from their having too much knowledge.

 

If the people do not fear the majesty of government, a reign of terror will ensue.

 

Do not confine them within too narrow bounds; do not make their lives too weary. For if you do not weary them of life, then they will not grow weary of you.

 

If the people do not fear death, what good is there in using death as a deterrent? But if the people are brought up in fear of death, and we can take and execute any man who has committed a monstrous crime, who will dare to follow his example?

 

Now, there is always one who presides over the infliction of death. He who would take the place of the magistrate and himself inflict death, is like one who should try to do the work of a master-carpenter. And of those who try the work of a master-carpenter there are few who do not cut their own hands.

 

The people starve because those in authority

 

p. 40

 

over them devour too many taxes; that is why they starve. The people are difficult to govern because those placed over them are meddlesome; that is why they are difficult to govern. The people despise death because of their excessive labour in seeking the means of life; that is why they despise death.

 

A Sage has said: "He who can take upon himself the nation's shame is fit to be lord of the land. He who can take upon himself the nation's calamities is fit to be ruler over the Empire."

 

Were I ruler of a little State with a small population, and only ten or a hundred men available as soldiers, I would not use them. I would have the people look on death as a grievous thing, and they should not travel to distant countries. Though they might possess boats and carriages, they should have no occasion to ride in them. Though they might own weapons and armour, they should have no need to use them. I would make the people return to the use of knotted cords. * They should find their plain food sweet, their rough garments fine. They should be content with their homes, and happy in their simple ways. If a neighbouring State was within sight of mine--nay, if we were close enough to hear the crowing of each other's cocks and the barking of each other's dogs--the two peoples should grow old and die without there ever having been any mutual intercourse.

[ralis]

Oh did I? Please quote that so that I may show you your folly.

 

And yes, I did report this thread - I noted on about page 5 that this thread belonged in OT as this is not the focus of the forum and political threads tend toward shitstorm when you have many different people with many different beliefs.

 

Kyoto was political from the getgo, the shitstorm started when someone tried involving science

 

 

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/21991-the-concept-of-stealing-ownership-possession-morality-in-a-capitalist-society/page__view__findpost__p__313249

 

"How's that one sitting with your conscience? Or is it easily enough ignored unless it actually happens, then in which case, oh well, the intention was good hearted. Sorry not good enough, it doesnt help having your heart beaming while your head is up your ass."

Edited January 4, 2012 by ralis

[gendao]

LMAO! Check out the Commy News Network censoring a self-informed soldier when he supports and explains Ron Paul's non-interventionist military policy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQKbxrO8LEQ

It's like uhhhh wrong answer....EEEEEEEE!!!! Cut! Cut! Next!

The MSM Old Boys Cult is scared sh*tless of him because RON PAUL is the only candidate who dares

!!! Edited January 4, 2012 by vortex

[Informer]

[Informer]

I wrote that even before the occupy movement, 10 months ago.

 

We are angry with our leaders.

#14016310 - 02/23/11 09:47 PM (10 months, 4 days ago)

 

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/14016310/fpart/1/vc/1

 

There was a "JoeBlast" (Icelander) in that thread as well, intent to derail it. It seems like a common theme.

[Informer]

Icelander also cried to the mod and got the thread deleted. De Ja Vu.

[TzuJanLi]

Greetings..

 

What is NOT Tao? Why do people not make their cases with their peers, and a democratic result be obtained.. so, even in a forum based on Taoist understandings, special interests 'lobby' for their unfair share of attention? why do they bypass the court public opinion, unless their case is too weak.. Global Revolution is Tao in action, rebalancing the disproportionately distributed resources, and.. that is not to suggest there is not reward, positive and negative, proportionate to a person's willingness to contribute, further to the actuality of their contribution.. but, that it is without any ethical justification that anyone would take their excess from those that have contributed by being fitted into the social mechanism, and whose earning rates are controlled by the same social mechanism to favor an elite minority who pay and hire elected officials and public servants to insure that their elite social status, their power, and their wealth are secure from those whom they have manipulated to believe they have no recourse other than to beg for mercy..

 

History is clear, the elite and wealthy power-brokers conspire among themselves to control the global economies to their own advantage, at the expense of those that produce the goods and services from which wealth and influence are derived.. the elite power-brokers exploit the most valuable natural resource, people, and they extract the fair earnings of the people through corrupt and unscrupulous relationships with the representatives of those same people, representatives who, generally, create the illusion they are performing their duty to the people and the nation consistent with the laws they are sworn to uphold.. Their have been more people freed from death-row due to DNA evidence and recanted testimony citing government sponsored coercion, than have been arrested for contributing to the organized plundering of the US economy resulting in the severe and continuing recession that became public knowledge in late 2008, and has seen more than a half of the US liquidity vanish into the secrecy of of the elite power structure.. and, that elite power structure is so well funded and well connected, that it persuaded the government backed relief of the collapsing economy to given to them without enforceable guarantee or stipulation..

 

The continuing Great Recession which was revealed to the public in late 2008, became the vehicle through which the criminal acts of a public/private sectors conspiracy were cleverly marketed to the US and Global uninformed public, such that the thieves who caused the recession (by not acting sooner and with aggressive self-control), those same thieves were the recipients of more than a Trillion dollars of unsecured and unstipulated public (you and me, our) funds, other than to lend it back into the US market to stimulate growth and investment.. so, when your child tells you the baby-sitter was abusive and violent, and the nanny-cam substantiates the claim, why would invite the baby-sitter back AND give them a raise?

 

Be well..

[voidisyinyang]

 

Global revolution in a spiritual perspective....or not? haha.

[Spirit of the Tiger]

My friend and I are not sure of this Occupy movement. He really seems to think it's another front of the "Illuminati" and in the end anything that falls short of a REAL uprising perhaps violent but needing strategy of course, mass enlightenment and boycotting, it'll all really fall into the hands of the "evil powers that be" or the "illuminati".

 

The best things for us to do is try to Live Off the Grid. What that means is not just physically but even being spiritual, cultivating, practicing brahmacharya, yoga, living vegan, living self sustainably are all steps to living off the grid and boycotting, etc.

 

In his opinion protesting doesn't do anything, but neither does total peace like Ghandhi. I mean these are not In and Of themselves THE things that will stop anything. Need to look at it holistically. The whole "namaste" crowd of higher than thou folks, so high that also they won't act if necessary to "keep the peace".. and also to judge those who aren't part of the "in" crowd of the "light and love" they claim. That's also part of the illusion, just as much as being on the other end of the extreme. Don't get me wrong though it's all done in love and love still is "all we need"

 

Anyway... onto my point... my friend thinks the occupy movement seems to be a front for Obama to further his socialist/communist agenda without letting people know. It can also end up in violence and martial law but it seems to have died down in intensity. I even saw.. people within the socialist/communist party and white supremacists and KKK all supported this Occupy movement. Obama himself made the statement that the American people need to mobilize. So Obama seems to be in on this. Maybe one day.. as a "result" of the chaos either Obama or the next coming president will set things up for the future development of the New World Order just before the shit hits the fan.

 

At least thats the "theory"...

Edited January 4, 2012 by Spirit of the Tiger

[Aetherous]

Spirit of the Tiger,

 

Apparently the notion of Liberty was actually a big part of the Illuminati (the link isn't an historical branch of the Order, of course).

 

That single idea of Liberty sparked the French Revolution, and led to the creation of the United States of America.

 

 

To live in a country where liberty is the law would not be anything devious...in fact, just the opposite. This is what America was supposed to be about...your freedom!

 

(On an immediately practical note, it's what presidential candidate Ron Paul stands for)

 

It's our duty to fight for that ideal, so long as we value it for ourselves and others. If we value our freedom, yet don't fight for it out of laziness or whatever else, then it will be snatched away from us.

 

Kind of like what recently happened with the National Defense Authorization Act being signed into effect on New Year's Eve, by the current administration.

 

Living "off the grid" physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually...that has its place. But there's a word for it: escapism.

 

Coming back into the world and making positive changes is the other half of the equation, and is equally important. Don't worry about what others do (like the supposed Illuminati)...do what you know in your heart to be most right!

[Spirit of the Tiger]

Spirit of the Tiger,

 

Apparently the notion of Liberty was actually a big part of the Illuminati (the link isn't an historical branch of the Order, of course).

 

That single idea of Liberty sparked the French Revolution, and led to the creation of the United States of America.

 

 

To live in a country where liberty is the law would not be anything devious...in fact, just the opposite. This is what America was supposed to be about...your freedom!

 

(On an immediately practical note, it's what presidential candidate Ron Paul stands for)

 

It's our duty to fight for that ideal, so long as we value it for ourselves and others. If we value our freedom, yet don't fight for it out of laziness or whatever else, then it will be snatched away from us.

 

Kind of like what recently happened with the National Defense Authorization Act being signed into effect on New Year's Eve, by the current administration.

 

Living "off the grid" physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually...that has its place. But there's a word for it: escapism.

 

Coming back into the world and making positive changes is the other half of the equation, and is equally important. Don't worry about what others do (like the supposed Illuminati)...do what you know in your heart to be most right!

 

Well... you may be right about the liberty thing. Actually my friendo says anything that is built upon the desire for material things (which the country really IS about) is going to become corrupt and that's why we have capitalism vs communism where ideally they should work out in theory but then they don't. Nothing else has come up as much as capitalism vs communism. He says if we were to all be "jnanis", only then the right "ism" rise. Maybe even totalitarianism, who knows any "ism" might even work if everyone were jnanis. In fact the only thing we should really be "seeking" is "internal change". But even seeking anything might lead to disappointment. Seeking any kind of pleasure even if "spiritual pleasure", it's all still part of the illusion.

 

Of course someone can say that we are here because of "ALIEMS" that came and abducted us, or we also have loopholes that let these "aliems" come and do their thing with us. We still have to work on ourselves.

 

Now onto what I think...

 

To be honest with you.. I was a high school drop out and I don't know anything about how this current government works nor any other kind of government and I don't know how to get the things "done" which you speak of. In fact anything social or formal about this society I don't really have a knack for either due to my upbringing. I think that anything done "within" the system is eventually not going to go anywhere because "they" set it up so nobody with a real purpose can succeed. If it hasn't been done yet it's because the only real way is the unconventional way. So when people tell me or the rest of Americans that we're ALL just lazy, and we conjure up all these emotions and feelings with a call to "JUST GET UP AND DO IT".. I have to ask "well do what?" and of course the answer then will be "just get up off your ass!"

 

Hahaha. So what I'm trying to say then.. is an speech that is just a message to get any americans to "get up off their asses and do WHATEVER" is not going to help very many of them. Just because I, like many Americans don't know how to get things done within this judicial system. Now I may be a special case and I don't have any "common sense", but that may just be me. Or what, the whole society is just waiting on little ol me to do everything.

 

We are all kept on a hamster wheel of jobs, taking care of all the expenses this life would give us and more, just because of money. We work for money not for survival. It's not a natural way of life. And yea most Americans don't care, but many don't even have the time to care.

 

So... is there really a way to get the right things done within our current system? and if so how? Do we have to go to law school, do we have to read through all the JUNK our government gives us to confuse us in all their documents, don't we have to go through some bureaucracy?

Edited January 4, 2012 by Spirit of the Tiger

[skydog]

solutions:

 

Transformation of consciousness- whatever ways most effective- drugs, brainwave entrainment, meditation centers that are free and open to everyone,

 

Opportunities to fairly distribute wealth- eg projects to build homes, organic food, vegetarian food, pure water, technology makes education free for all, chances to travel and experience other cultures whilst helping

 

Potentially no other way but of harming the elite into giving up their resources, fighting to overthrow the rulers I dont see as unspiritual

 

no advertising everywhere

 

Hemp clothes, materials, homes

[skydog]

[Jetsun]

also I dont want to go political here, but I am finding those middle eastern protests/uprising irritate me as they are both a mixture of american governments trying to overthrow governments by installing a puppet dictator that gives them what they want, and the people not being happy.

 

That's not true in Egypt, the previous regime was American backed and it is a real problem now for the US that the people have stood up because the Muslim Brotherhood are likely to gain power on an anti Israeli platform, which is why the US trained and funded Egyptian army are delaying the elections as much as possible so they can try to ensure someone else favourable can take power.

[skydog]

That's not true in Egypt, the previous regime was American backed and it is a real problem now for the US that the people have stood up because the Muslim Brotherhood are likely to gain power on an anti Israeli platform, which is why the US trained and funded Egyptian army are delaying the elections as much as possible so they can try to ensure someone else favourable can take power.

 

fair enough