[Aetherous]

Radiating the love that you are isn't as important as expressing it through action.

[Aaron]

From my position on the planet that we live, I see the conditions of love and hate as sensory delusions. Unconditional Love does not have an opposite, like say, Christian love. For example, Christian love is often considered the highest love, but that too is merely a conditional love. To better understand this type of love, simply consider the Great Love Chapter of Christendom, Corinthians 13; for example, "love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things", 1 Cor 13:7. Although this form of love, that is, bearing, believing, hoping and enduring is more commitment orientated then fleeting, it isn't Unconditional Love, but the submission, devotion, expectation and suffering to the conditions of their religions brewed beliefs.

 

Unconditional Love is beyond beliefs,...and beyond the conditions of opposites.

 

I agree, that floating in imaginary wisdom can delight the senses in a myrad of personal imagry,...and those who cling to such imagry will fight to the death to protect it, killing everything and anything that could shine light upon their beliefs,...which ultimately isn't who they are. People are not their beliefs,...they merely think they are.

 

Compassion is a key. An authentic compassionate person would never attempt to "send love or hope." In fact, any intention to "send love or hope" is a clear indication that compassion is void in the sender. Compassion is a level of understanding that suffering is the consequence of the desire for things to be other than they are. And by understanding that last sentence, Siddhartha uncovered Buddha,...nothing more, nothing less,...understand that sentence and you are Buddha,....it is the Great Noble Truth of Buddhism.

 

Everytime one attempts to "send love or hope", thet deny what is.

 

V

 

 

Hello VMarco,

 

So taking this all into consideration, do you tell your son that you love him, or since love is a sensory delusion, do you instead say, I have great compassion for you. Some of the things you say make absolutely no sense. I don't know of anyone, except for the VERY SMALL percent of fundamentalist Christians that actually believe someone can send "Love". The phrase is meant to be an expression of care from one person to another, not a statement that I am psychically sending you love. In my opinion, you have a deluded sense of this topic and I would recommend that you gather a clearer understanding of the concepts of love and compassion in Buddhist philosophy before you share your ideas with others and misinform them regarding those premises. Perhaps you might benefit from looking at the Compassion and Taoism thread, it was discussed quite deeply there and it might help to shed some light on some of your own misinterpretations.

 

With love,

 

Aaron

[Informer]

I wouldn't consider radiating love, as sending. Radiating the love you are is quite natural,...and the more that the barriers of love, like hope, fear, beliefs, etc., are dissolved, the more Love radiates. The person who truly radiates love, is the one with few beliefs,...those with beliefs are operating within a dualist construct, which obscures love.

 

V

 

 

Natural for who?

[suninmyeyes]

 

 

I agree, that floating in imaginary wisdom can delight the senses in a myrad of personal imagry,...and those who cling to such imagry will fight to the death to protect it, killing everything and anything that could shine light upon their beliefs,...which ultimately isn't who they are. People are not their beliefs,...they merely think they are.

 

 

V

Maybe try and embody that wisdom than, instead of floating.

'Walking the talk is the key to the door that doesent exist.'-suninmyeyes

:lol:

(by the way in case you havent noticed I am full of glorious kaaa kaaa)

Love is beyond beliefs,yes.But it undeniable that we humans are not tuned into it with our minds always,or shall I say more correctly think that we are not tuned into it.This is my point about being real in this dimension of being,becouse as long as we live on earth and have a body we need to practise being human.

Conditions beyond love and hate are delusions yes,but what are you going to do if your child wants to put his hand into the fire?Lets not deny the human aspect of our being is what I am saying.

I dont know if I am making myself clear,but I have to go out now ,meet my man and make some passionate loooooooooooooooove!

[Vmarco]

Hello VMarco,

 

So taking this all into consideration, do you tell your son that you love him, or since love is a sensory delusion, do you instead say, I have great compassion for you. Some of the things you say make absolutely no sense. I don't know of anyone, except for the VERY SMALL percent of fundamentalist Christians that actually believe someone can send "Love". The phrase is meant to be an expression of care from one person to another, not a statement that I am psychically sending you love. In my opinion, you have a deluded sense of this topic and I would recommend that you gather a clearer understanding of the concepts of love and compassion in Buddhist philosophy before you share your ideas with others and misinform them regarding those premises. Perhaps you might benefit from looking at the Compassion and Taoism thread, it was discussed quite deeply there and it might help to shed some light on some of your own misinterpretations.

 

With love,

 

Aaron

 

 

My son's are fully aware of my feeling of them.

 

Perhaps through EJ Gold's description of Real Emotion, you could see my point about Real Love.

 

"Real emotions are communicated by outward radiation of the mood, and originate through an awakened emotional center, which has no reverberational effects in other parts of the body, and is not necessary to verbally communicate the emotion.

Positive and negative emotion are subjective mental states occuring in reflex, and must be verbalized and elaborately described, explained, rationalized and mentally communicated and understood.

Those who can produce real emotions in themselves never communicate about emotional states in mental language; they just radiate the emotions, allowing the emotion to speak for itself.

In the presence of someone who is able to produce real emotion, we experience feelings - perhaps for the first time. Very often, someone who has awakened the higher Emotional Body and who has learned to radiate emotions becomes a celebrity-guru, and people gather like cattle to bathe in the higher emotions. These higher emotions are often mistaken for some mysterious cosmic force or interpreted in some pseudo-religious way, but really they are just emotions.

What a pity that human beings are so unaccustomed to emotion that they feel compelled to submissively huddle together in the warmth of the emotional radiation of someone just as mechanical as they are, but who happened to have activated, by accident, the higher Emotional Body." EJ Gold

[Vmarco]

Natural for who?

 

Natural for those who have shed a sufficient amount of beliefs so that love is less obscure.

 

V

[Informer]

Natural for those who have shed a sufficient amount of beliefs so that love is less obscure.

 

V

 

With that comes compassion which allows one to relate to those who haven't.

 

So by saying that it is or is not natural is wrong view, imo.

[Informer]

 

"Real emotions are communicated by outward radiation of the mood, and originate through an awakened emotional center, which has no reverberational effects in other parts of the body, and is not necessary to verbally communicate the emotion.

Positive and negative emotion are subjective mental states occuring in reflex, and must be verbalized and elaborately described, explained, rationalized and mentally communicated and understood.

Those who can produce real emotions in themselves never communicate about emotional states in mental language; they just radiate the emotions, allowing the emotion to speak for itself.

In the presence of someone who is able to produce real emotion, we experience feelings - perhaps for the first time. Very often, someone who has awakened the higher Emotional Body and who has learned to radiate emotions becomes a celebrity-guru, and people gather like cattle to bathe in the higher emotions. These higher emotions are often mistaken for some mysterious cosmic force or interpreted in some pseudo-religious way, but really they are just emotions.

What a pity that human beings are so unaccustomed to emotion that they feel compelled to submissively huddle together in the warmth of the emotional radiation of someone just as mechanical as they are, but who happened to have activated, by accident, the higher Emotional Body." EJ Gold

 

Here you are proving the point that it is going, which could be equated to sending.

 

It's just not necessarily you making it to do it. It is the nature of it.

Edited August 14, 2011 by Informer

[Sunya]

I'm still waiting for some examples of where I or others have threatened to maim or injure you, vmarco. You've made some pretty serious accusations here and have threatened to call "the authorities" on us. Where are the examples? Quote the specific posts.

 

vmarco, you haven't posted any examples of anyone threatening you. I take it none exist. You on the other hand have threatened us with calling the authorities and launching an investigating to prosecute us.

 

An investigation is becoming likely. Internet laws allowing redress from people like you are becoming more popular, and the Government are looking for more cases to prosecute. People all over are getting fed-up with bullies like you. At the moment you feel you have the upper hand with your TROLL GROUPIES backing you up, giving the impression that I somehow sabbotaged my own thread, and all you decent Trolls had to save the TB forum from such debauchery.

 

You are simply BULLIES,...and BULLIES like to travel in gangs. BULLIES like to destroy things. Right from your first post on this thread, it was all about destroying,...ad hominem and diatribe, progressing to inappropriate harassment, intimidation, suggestions to mame, mental/emotional assault, stalking, etc.

 

You're flirting with serious crimes boys. Haven't your heard the term IP address.

 

V

 

You have made serious accusations and threatened to call the authorities. Please apologize.

[Small Fur]

Oh!

 

And here I thought the biggest oxymoron to hinder awakening is that we are all on a forum trying to name all sorts of parts of the 'unnamable' one.

 

(there isn't an emoticon big enough to express my hilarious joy of this!)

 

Oh what fun it is to ride on the dharma wheel of life!

Edited August 15, 2011 by Small Fur

[Vmarco]

Here you are proving the point that it is going, which could be equated to sending.

 

It's just not necessarily you making it to do it. It is the nature of it.

 

The natural, organic if you will, radiating of the love you are, is not an INTENT to send love or hope. As the previous posts stresssed, the act/intention of sending is fundamentaling an intrusion or attack upon another, no matter what the presumed good intentions of the sender.

 

I must assume that your failure to see this is my failure to communicate it.

 

The intentional sending of love or hope is premeditated rape. Just because society accepts it, doesn't make not so,...just as physical rape in totalitarian or feudal places were accepted.

 

V

[Vmarco]

With that comes compassion which allows one to relate to those who haven't.

 

Just because compassion can relate to those who haven't, doesn't mean that those who haven't can recognize compassion. For example, I just posted a related story of compassion on post #46

 

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/19943-disinformation-campaign/page__st__32

 

V

[Informer]

The natural, organic if you will, radiating of the love you are, is not an INTENT to send love or hope. As the previous posts stresssed, the act/intention of sending is fundamentaling an intrusion or attack upon another, no matter what the presumed good intentions of the sender.

 

I must assume that your failure to see this is my failure to communicate it.

 

The intentional sending of love or hope is premeditated rape. Just because society accepts it, doesn't make not so,...just as physical rape in totalitarian or feudal places were accepted.

 

V

 

I disagree. Love doesn't have this polarity to which you have even exclaimed.

 

What is hope to do with love? Love or hope ?

[Vmarco]

I disagree. Love doesn't have this polarity to which you have even exclaimed.

 

What is hope to do with love? Love or hope ?

 

I'm quite sure I articulated that Unconditional Love is not dual, or has an opposite,...for example post #251.

 

The connection with love and hope arose in much earlier dialogues where someone was continuously SENDING love ans hopes with various intents. In any authentic spiritual reality, love and hope would never intermingle, because hope is a condition fully associated with duality.

 

People can believe they can SEND love and hope,...yet no one can send Love,...the instant someone even thought that they could send love, the radiation of love would be veiled.

 

V

[C T]

hope is a condition fully associated with duality.

 

Try getting lost in the desert, and see if hope is associated with duality. Or suddenly pushed into a stream filled with ferocious alligators.

 

Are you stuck simply in one-dimensional delusion, i wonder.

 

Just going around in circles, repeating the same worn message over and over, like a broken gramophone.

[Vmarco]

Try getting lost in the desert, and see if hope is associated with duality. Or suddenly pushed into a stream filled with ferocious alligators.

 

Are you stuck simply in one-dimensional delusion, i wonder.

 

Just going around in circles, repeating the same worn message over and over, like a broken gramophone.

 

If you ever develop an interest in the Fourth Stream of Buddhism, you should consider:

 

"The highest goal is being devoid of hope and fear.

When all hopes and fears have died, the Goal is reached." Tilopa

 

That goal, in this context, is called Mahamudra.

 

"The clear light of Mahamudra cannot be revealed

By the canonical scriptures or metaphysical treatises

Of the Mantravada, the Paramitas or the Tripitaka;

The clear light is veiled by concepts and ideals."

 

V

[Vmarco]

I find this a very ugly statement.

 

Curious. Do you see the sentence any different if "hope" is removed? "The intentional sending of love is premeditated rape."

 

Yes, I certainly understand that it is difficult to accept that something we were indoctrinated to believe is meaningful, may be meaningless.

 

It appears that you may have arrived at the end of an attempt to discuss what is the INTENTION of SENDING,...I would refer you to posts #248 and #212.

 

As for any difference if hope was removed,...yes, I surely see a difference,...not in the intrusion of SENDING, but that hope is a pernicious word, whereas Love, that is, the Love beyond duality's concepts of Love, is something else.

 

V

[Owledge]

Vmarco, there's an interesting disharmony between the content of your message and your own mindset. Shouldn't we be careful to only advocate things we embody? Right now, there are a lot of huge concepts mentioned in this thread, but they're nothing more. You are sending quite a lot of stuff, and you have a lot of 'war' in you. ( Might apply to me, too, but I'm not acting like I'm on a mission. )

Why don't you try to replace the sending outwards in this internet forum with a living inwards of the ideas you advocate? The outwards part applies to so many of your concepts, like "peace force" being war and such. A part of you (rooted in pain/fear of some sorts) is asking for conflict, and thus manifests it.

 

You know, as an example, when a guy claims to have abandoned all attachments to life, but tells everybody about it and tries to help others achieve the same, he hasn't really abandoned all attachments ... far from that. It's a bit like with the Dao: If you can talk about it, it ain't Dao.

 

Do my words help in any way?

Edited October 4, 2011 by Hardyg

[Aetherous]

"Spiritual warrior"

[Protector]

"Spiritual warrior"

 

What about them?

 

Oh! this! nah, man, nah

[Birch]

Well I liked them.

I was going to say I've been trying to stop telling people who I am and hope to rely more or what I do, but I think I just comitted an oxymoron.

[Z3N]

Oh vmaro if only you can free yourself from the fish bowl allowing oneself to speak from direct experience, keeping it simple so there is no science or religious dogma.

 

Here lies the problem. You have a acquired skill at gathering and sourcing out information that is quite impressive. But your desire to be the answer to all things have over shadowed the reality of spiritual essence and experience. It's is impossible for anyone to know the source. Not even buddha, Lao tzu, Christ etc could know. There is no one that knows cause to know is to employ the self. The knowing is the left over byproduct of knowledge, which is the direct experience of truth which can not be known. Hence the wise. So to be wise you must not over complicate things, this is not there intention.

 

The puzzle already has a hundred and fifty thousand pieces add infinity all caught up in a fish bowl of complications. So out of compassion let's come together and make it a three piece puzzle so the experience is direct and pure.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Z3N