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About Zhongyongdaoist

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  1. taoism and sufism

    Thanks for posting this. You're Welcome. Thank you both for you posts. This weekend and through midweek will be very busy for me and i will not be able to give much serious thought to the issues raised much less organize a response until later in the week or next weekend. I have managed to squeeze in Izutxu's preface, which clarified the background of the book in a very useful way. ZYD
  2. taoism and sufism

    I need to preface this post by saying that I am a very busy person and can't see spending the time needed to make long contributions to this topic at this time. I have spent sometime since its appearance thinking about it, reviewing some aspects of previous research and wondering how I might be able to contribute to it. Here is the first thing that I wanted to add: Since this is the "classic" in the field, then this link to a downloadable PdF would seem to be in order: Toshihiko Izutsu Sufism And Taoism I have not had time to read all of this, though i do have some ideas about its proper use and potential abuse, but i will have to do more reading to see if my first impressions are accurate. As for this: I am in complete disagreement with the notion that "Daoism is a religion". As far as I am concerned as a practitioner of what is usually referred to as "Relitigous Daoism", that it is a complete misnomer to call it such foisted on it by Western scholars of "religions", that it would be more properly referred ti as "Ritual Daoism" and its structure would be better modeled by something like Freemasonry. Basically Ritual Daosim was developed by Fangshi for Fangshi, as a combination of professional guild and teaching hall and has nothing to do with the "worship" of gods in the sense of a grovelling submission to such beings motivated by threats of punishment and promises of rewards for such behavior. It's all about learning and practicing magic, which involves a great deal of time and study as anyone who has read and studied the works of Professor Jerry Alan Johnson can amply justify. This is all I have time for today, and all that I can say is that I will try to respond to any comments in a timely fashion, but I cannot guarantee that what I consider to be a timely fashion will be the same as yours. As for what I might like to see here, these would be of interest to me: Zhonyongdaoist usually ZYD for short
  3. Morality

    In the topic Animal Morality Brian posted this: I replied with this: That moral-like behavior would evolve among social animals is more or less taken for granted at this time. None of this involves outside "supernatural" intervention or planning, it just turns out that cooperative behavior has survival value, which is perfectly in line with Darwinian theory. My own worldview provides a larger context for this, but it is not necessary to the notion that "morality" evolves from successful cooperative behavior and would within a completely reductive materialist view of reality. ZYD
  4. Vedic Christianity

    Do you mean posting a map like this: or something else? ZYD
  5. Vedic Christianity

    The problem with the posts here is that they search far afield for a source for the teaching of Jesus when nearer sources are available and not considered at all. As I noted here: I hope people will consider this possibility with an open mind, there are a lot of links in this which should be followed in order to get the full force of the post. ZYD
  6. Gan Mai Da Zao Tang

    This is available in pill form from several sources online, just search for GAN MA! DA ZAO WAN. For the sake of your privacy I have sent you a private message with the information from Jake Fratkin's Chinese Hebal Patent Medicines, which is basically the Chinese Herbal Medicine equivalent of the Phycian's Desk Reference. This particular discussion is of Plum Flower Brands version, which is a very well respected brand. Taking it in pill form is the simplest and easiest way to benefit from these herbs. ZYD
  7. Acting on your true will

    Well, its a long tradition that winds its way through many manifestations and NOT original to Crowley . But going back to the topic at hand , ie, the concept ( forgetting Crowley for a moment .... if that is possible for a moment ) what do you think about my comparisons to the concept of Khvarenah ? (Emphasis mine, ZYD) I had already looked up your posts on Khvarenah and read some when you asked this, but I have been to busy to squeeze in a reply. In general I find them an interesting and potentially useful addition to the discourse on the subject. If I can make more time, I may reply in more detail. ZYD
  8. Acting on your true will

    with because, in marked contrast to Augustine, Crowley stated that love is secondary to will. It's not my mistake to conflate them, it is your mistake to think that I intended to do so. All I did was provide the originating context, about which Crowley, being raised in the fundamentalist Christian sect, the Plymouth Brethren, probably knew nothing, however, he was quite familiar with Rabelais from whom he, oh sorry, I forgot, Aiwass, "borrowed" quite a bit, including the very term thelema. I am quite familiar with Crowley and his writings, as I made clear nine years ago here: When and at what age did you buy your copy of Magick in Theory and Practice, oh all wise one? I have read, about, studied and practiced magic for decades, and I don't care to waste further time with you, so as far as I am concerned we are done here. As far as Crowley goes, there is not much reason, except possibly historical, to pay attention to him. I have posted about him and my reasons for thinking so in various places on Dao Bums over the years and anyone who wishes can find them with a search or two. It should be noted that part of my criticism of Crowley is also a criticism of what I call neo-magic, magic as practiced based on the Nineteenth Century revival of magic. My posts in Eliphas Levi, whom Crowley loved to consider his previous incarnation, dealt with the magical revival and my criticism of it to a certain extent. As a final note just in case someone makes the mistake of thinking that because I emphasis Magick in Theory and Practice above, that it is is all that I read of Crosley's work, which it was not, however, during the early Sixties it was practically all that was readily available. I did read a great deal more of Crowley as it appeared through the later Sixties and early Seventies. Humorously, among other things, I was probably the only thirteen year old in the U.S. to get a copy of The Equinox of the Gods for Christmas in 1963, but that is another story, and I don't have time for that now. ZYD
  9. Acting on your true will

    Want to know what the original context of "Do what you will" was? Here you go: Check it out at: Christianity So much for Aiwass and other nonsense. ZYD
  10. What exactly is stored in the LDT?

    I really don't like it when people start to argue about the meaning of unaccented Pinyin, such as the discussions of "jing" in this thread. If we go to a nice Chinese/English dictionary like: MDBG and enter "jing" we come to this page: Gosh, can "jing" really mean all these things? To which the answer is, yes it can. If we go down far enough we will find this entry: 精 jīng essence / extract / vitality / energy / semen / sperm / mythical goblin spirit / highly perfected / elite / the pick of sth / proficient (refined ability) / extremely (fine) / selected rice (archaic) First of all notice that "jing" should be accented like this jīng in order to differentiate it from all of the other "jings" in the list. Second notice that pretty much all of the "real, true and exclusive" meanings about which people have been arguing here are included in the list above, so that they are all "right", and the sensible thing to do is to stop pointing fingers at each other and see if there is some higher conceptual level which put those possible meanings in a context that will allow us to understand, and hopefully avoid wasting time on arguing. It is useful to think of words like jīng as syllables which make up larger words like "astro" can be used in words like astronomy, astrology, and astronaut. In order to do this use your pointer to hover over the three vertical dots and a sub-menu will open and you will see this, *精*, and if you click on it you will come here: A long page with all of the common words containing "jīng" used like it is a syllable Some of which may help to understand what jīng may mean in a context of esoteric physiology and its relation to medicine and meditation. Among other things you will find this: 精气神 jīng qì shén the three energies of Chinese medicine: 精[jing1], 氣|气[qi4], and 神[shen2] And what are "energies" in this context? Let's not go there now, but also let's not argue either and instead put our heads together and see if we can better understand all of this. Disclaimer: I am not at all fluent in Chinese, but I am good at conceptual analysis and using a dictionary. The above is put forward with the intention of ending arguments and providing material for discussion, for which purpose I hope it is helpful. ZYD
  11. See my post and the discussion here: There was a great deal of activity related to his teacher, Mak Tin Si, and Chi in Nature, when I started on Dao Bums nine years ago. So searching under Mak Tin Si, and Chi in Nature would be the way to research this. I also seem to remember that this fellow, who seems to be in charge of teaching magic now, posted in the past year or so on Dao Bums to invite people to learn Daoist magic with him. I don't think he got much of a response, as really not many here are interested in Daoist magic to begin with, though there are a small number of Dao Bums that are. As a forum, the Dao Bums has no opinion about this group, we only post the opinions and experiences of our members about it. Our members opinions have varied, but if you follow the link in the post of mine that I quoted, you can get an overview, and more of our members may weigh in here about them. I did some research on their site when I first joined here, and as far as I can tell they do not represent a lineal descent from a specific school, but that the founders do represent some authentic aspects of Chinese magical tradition, and that they believe they were authorized in visions by the highest level of the Daoist Pantheon to teach. I would suggest a lot of "due diligence" in regard to any association with them, but that is my personal opinion as a person with a good familiarity with Daoist Ritual and magic, and should not be confused with any official position of the Dao Bums, even though I am a moderator here. As I have said the Dao Bums does not have an official position on this school. I hope other members who remember past interactions with this group will join in with the discussion. ZYD
  12. Confucianism for beginners (and dummies too)

    I'm sorry to be so long in posting, but last week was unexpectedly busy and while I have some lovely notes about why the Tang dynasty was so important to Confucian Revival of the Song dynasty and they are almost ready to be posted, they need a little more work to be up to my standards and I hope to by able to post them in two days. I also have to be honest and say that I had to talk myself out of covering a lot of fascinating, to me at least, information about the early Han dynasty consolidation of Imperial Power under a Confucian/Legalist system, and the banishment of Daoism as a political alternative. Maybe I can do that somewhere down the road. ZYD
  13. Confucianism for beginners (and dummies too)

    Wang Fengyi comments on his books that the viewpoints differ because of their emphasis either on original mind (Mencius) or acquired mind (Xunzi). The original mind preserves the spontaneous ethical purity, while the acquired mind easily accumulates selfish traits. Surely, the former points to ethical ideals and what people can hope to aspire for in their self-cultivation, and the latter teaches discerning eye for statesmen. I don't want to get to distracted by this, but rather to continue to develop an introduction for beginner's. I don't want to get into any discussion of Wang Fengyi and his opinions, though the fundamental observation is good, but if Xunzi concentrated on acquired mind, it was because as a thoroughgoing materialist, that is all he believed existed, and the notion of original mind would have just been a fantasy to him. These matters can be discussed later, and I welcome them at that time, as it is writing this is taking up a lot of time and I want to get back to dealing with beginner's topics. ZYD
  14. Confucianism for beginners (and dummies too)

    You're certainly welcome, I try to shed a little light on things when I can, and sometimes I even succeed. I will do my best to follow through, and help explicate the Mystery of Confucius as best as I can. In order to understand more of the Mystery of Confucius you need to become familiar with two people, who are the most important exponents and developers of Confucian thought in the Waring States period, they are: Our Hero: Mèng Kē, Mengzi, Mencius and our Villain: Xun Kuang, Xunzi Now in one sense I am being as unfair to Xunzi, as I have been to the Analects, but the reason for characterizing him as a villain comes from this oversimplification about his and Mencius view on Human Nature. For Mencius Human Nature was fundamentally good, and the purpose of Confucian teaching was to help people fully realize that fundamental goodness, however for Xunzi human nature was bad, and the purpose of Confucian teaching was to train them to overcome that bad nature and become good. So that Mencius was all about Confucianism as Self Realization and Xunzi was all about Confucianism as Animal Training. It is helpful to an understanding of Xunzi, when you realize that his most influential student, Hanfei, one of the most famous advocates of Chinese "Legalist" thought, and as such, a resolute enemy of Confucianism. In the History of Confucianism in China it is important to realize that Xunzi, with Hanfei in the background dominated Confucian thought by sometime around 200 BCE, and was pretty much the basis of the State Confucianism of China from the Han Dynasty until the development of what is usually called Neo-Confucianism in the Tang Dynasty. One important aspect of which was the replacement of Xunzi as the great Confucian interpreter with Mencius. Which is why we have three Chinese Philosophers whose names have been Latinized with the "us" suffix, Confucius, Laocius (AKA, Laozi), and Mencius, because these were the philosophers that the Jesuit Missionaries read after their arrival in China around 1600, Xunzi had dropped into almost complete, and in my opinion well deserved, obscurity. More on this as I have time. ZYD
  15. Confucianism for beginners (and dummies too)

    Starting to study Confucius by reading the Analects only leads to what I have humorously called: The Mystery of Confucius Which is, why would the author of such a boring and pedantic work as the Analects inspire his last patron, Duke Ai of Yu to do this: Yep, this is it guys and gals: ain't it Grand? What kind of person must Confucius have been to inspire such an action on the part of a Spring and Autumn period Feudal Lord? A useful place to start to answer that question might be in this text: 儒行 - Ru Xing The purported record of a session in which Confucius expounds on "The Nature of the Scholar" to Duke Ai. It is important enough to be part of the Liji, the Book of Rites along with two other texts the 中庸 - Zhong Yong (Does that title sound at all familiar? ZYD) and 大學 - Da Xue Which are much better Places to go to get some insight into Confucianism. It is also a good idea to study the concept of Ren, 仁, meaning, usually reduced to "humaneness", and in particular this etymology of it: For now with these little hints, I leave the reader to contemplate: The Mystery of Confucius While I try to find time to write more. ZYD