ŗ•źDominicusŗ•ź

Shouldn't Acupuncture be able to lead to Enlightenment by opening things up?

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Considering the history of acupuncture and its ties with traditional chinese medicine including chi, meridians, chakras, dan tians, taoism, martial arts, etc...

 

......so considering all the ties, couldn't you technically open up all the dan tians, central channel, and hasten your Enlightenment through the use of hitting certain acupuncture points?

 

I ask cause this has been popping up via intuition as a methodology that should technically work, plus I'm going in for a session for some lower back pain and was just reconsidering these ties all over again.

 

What say you Bums?

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Okay, so two yes's so far. So who's out there doing this, or has tried this, or any further leads.

 

What specific points should be hit with the needles/moxi?of cou

 

of course i was already assuming that this would enhance all other practices of meditation, tai chi, yoga, etc

Edited by ॐDominicusॐ

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It depends on your diagnosis and a lot of knowledge of Chinese medicine theory...best to see the professionals. That which has the power to greatly heal also has the power to greatly harm when not used properly.

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Unfortunately there's no acupuncture sessions for which to tame the mind.

 

Haven't been convinced so far that 'enlightenment' can result from having all meridians and channels opened.

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Unfortunately there's no acupuncture sessions for which to tame the mind.

 

Haven't been convinced so far that 'enlightenment' can result from having all meridians and channels opened.

You can have an already tamed mind from all your other practices, but still not be merged completely in the ocean via the central channel that gives access to the other dan tians.

 

I've found that certain herbs/spices/foods, yogic exercises, etc...seem to have an influence on more vs less mind as well opening all the channels more or less...so yes, it would seem that theoretically acupuncture should have effect on your practices towards enlightenment, especially since mind also uses a certain channel (see ramana maharshi) to arise into the head space upon the body waking in the morning

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Yes I believe it is possible, but the treatment modality has to be high level (virtue level of practitioner + acu technique) combined with a patient who has already accomplished some degree of inner work and attainment. There are different meridian levels, some beneath the skin, some on the surface, and others that spread out into the finest levels which feed the weiqi fields. TCM refers to the finest qi lines as collaterals, but doesn't tend to discuss them at length. The finest collaterals are the ones that feed the field, and in turn the consciousness and intentional activities of the field feed back into the meridian system. The stream feeds the river feeds the ocean, and then back again.

 

It's possible with some needling techniques and energy work done by the practitioner to beneficially manipulate the finest level fields just outside of the body, which is where the consciousness activities are taking place. Some people call this field the aura. The geometry and complexity of the aura ultimately relates to the lifetime culmination of consciousness activities. Someone with a really bright aura, high particle density, and high individual particle dynamism will naturally be someone who is higher on the "ladder" to enlightenment. You can affect the geometry of this field through acupuncture, if you know how. In TCM it's called a shen level treatment, which is just a fancy way of saying you are working on a much lighter density. The lighter the density, the more can be accomplished. If you're just working on the dense physical body then the person will not evolve.

 

You can redirect the field flow into patterns that are more stable and useful to higher psychospiritual levels of being, which in turn trickles down to the denser levels of qi and affects the physical body / perceptual mind. Just like certain molecular arrangements make elixirs, medicines, and other adjuvants, there are field configuations which are more conducive to various activities.

 

The problem is that you can't just use a top down approach like this and expect the person to change forever. Work also has to be happening at the origin, which is where the mind and some degree of free will are taking place. Qi is extremely sensitive to intention, that's because at the finer levels qi is just consciousness in motion. You can expand and open a person's field over and over again and increase their higher awareness, but if they leave the treatment and go back to the same old lifestyle, then the qi will just follow that pattern of living again.

 

So... the short answer is... yes it's possible, if you approach it at both ends. But this kind of acupuncture and lifestyle don't really exist broadly in the modern world. I think if someone opened up a retreat centre somewhere that screened high level candidates and then implemented a lifestyle protocol combined with daily fine field work, people could make major progress in a single lifetime. But, as a general trend, the vast majority of the TCM world does not see acupuncture in this way. They see it as medical intervention and not a spiritual evolutionary tool; or if they do, they are boxed in by the world and its stagnantly functional medical views.

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Okay, so two yes's so far. So who's out there doing this, or has tried this, or any further leads.

 

What specific points should be hit with the needles/moxi?of cou

 

of course i was already assuming that this would enhance all other practices of meditation, tai chi, yoga, etc

 

I most definitely wouldn't want this from a not so enlightened acupuncturist though, even if it *is* possible...

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My friend, even mowing the lawn leads to enlightenment. The method is unimportant. It's all about what you and your intelligence make out of it. Wasted time or great opportunity practicing insight with such a apparent dulling work?

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There is no just a coincidence that John Chang was actually an acupuncturist doctor.

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If it were possible, you can bet there'd be scores of acupuncturists enlightening one another. But there aren't. Believing in the theoretical possibilities of such an approach leading to 'enlightenment' can be quite a delusional past-time which many do enjoy. You know why? Because enlightenment is a highly seductive aspiration. Incidentally, those who do achieve it actually do not even concentrate on getting it. Its a fruition of virtuous cultivation, usually a result of years of devotion to perfecting the Paramitas.

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Bringing disharmony into balance helps to bring forth the true nature, as well as calm the mind to some extent.

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If it were possible, you can bet there'd be scores of acupuncturists enlightening one another. But there aren't. Believing in the theoretical possibilities of such an approach leading to 'enlightenment' can be quite a delusional past-time which many do enjoy. You know why? Because enlightenment is a highly seductive aspiration. Incidentally, those who do achieve it actually do not even concentrate on getting it. Its a fruition of virtuous cultivation, usually a result of years of devotion to perfecting the Paramitas.

 

You may be right on this, but I thought I would mention, like most healers, most acupuncturists suck. But then once in awhile you get the odd one... who can create some amazing change.

 

Of course no one can enlighten us for us, but perhaps help remove a blockage or two to help us with greater realizations, or open things up.

 

I have definitely had sessions where meditation was 1000x times stronger and easier for a solid few days afterwards, which allowed me to get some work done. A far cry from enlightenment, but still interesting that it can do anything like that really.

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Seems like there's more to enlightenment than opening channels. The right lifestyle with the right mind will open them. Opening them with acupuncture, but then maintaining a less than spiritual lifestyle, along with a monkey mind, would just cause all the old blockages to reappear, would it not?

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You may be right on this, but I thought I would mention, like most healers, most acupuncturists suck. But then once in awhile you get the odd one... who can create some amazing change.

 

Of course no one can enlighten us for us, but perhaps help remove a blockage or two to help us with greater realizations, or open things up.

 

I have definitely had sessions where meditation was 1000x times stronger and easier for a solid few days afterwards, which allowed me to get some work done. A far cry from enlightenment, but still interesting that it can do anything like that really.

:)

 

Acupuncture as a healing modality is superb. I use it too from time to time, and i do not doubt its functions. Call me cynical, but what i have reservations about is its efficaciousness in bringing about causes of enlightenment. Please do not waste energy in speculating/entertaining such an impossible notion.

 

Im not trying to deflate hopes and dampen spirits here, what i am trying to put forth is the truth of right effort on the path of liberation in case people reading this thread begin to get eager by imagining the possibility of fast-tracking their way to 'enlightenment'.

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Yep. The fastest fast track is you, and your inner cultivation. No amount short cuts will help.

 

But if you're doing your work on yourself, I'm sure a little outside influence here and there is a huge help.

 

I just don't see it working the other way around...lots of external "do this to me" methods without much inner work.

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The pipes can be opened in an instant. But if the water is dirty, there is no benefit. The pipes will just get clogged again.

Edited by thetaoiseasy
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:)

 

Acupuncture as a healing modality is superb. I use it too from time to time, and i do not doubt its functions. Call me cynical, but what i have reservations about is its efficaciousness in bringing about causes of enlightenment. Please do not waste energy in speculating/entertaining such an impossible notion.

 

Im not trying to deflate hopes and dampen spirits here, what i am trying to put forth is the truth of right effort on the path of liberation in case people reading this thread begin to get eager by imagining the possibility of fast-tracking their way to 'enlightenment'.

no matter the path, it seems its the same function that leads to enlightenment which-ever path you use, and thats detachment from mind, which opens the central channel. The observer/awareness then descends via that channel and merges with Oneness in the heart, and eventually the absolute beingness in the belly (all three dan tians)...just dif names in dif branches.

 

Now in my experience, being around a variety of teachers/masters in different paths has all helped me to glimpse, and then remain in longer and longer periods of these realities, including getting hands on transmissions to open things up (certain aspects which I've read take 5 years in kriya to open, I've gotten in one day transmissions)...so yes, BOOM, short cuts exist (just ask the dzogchen masters who are all about this)

 

So same thing goes for acupuncture. Since a large number of paths agree that the central channel joins together all the chakras/dan tians, which are accessed as part of Enlightenment, then there is an equivalent point that is connected to all the main channel, consciousness and its source, and all three dan tians.

 

By the way, this all came up intuitively during a sitting meditation, that yes, there are acupuncture points that can hasten a practitioners enlightenment.

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Something to consider...

 

There is the Buddhist teaching of the two obstructions to enlightenment. The first obstruction is simply negative emotions, and the second obstruction is conceptual thought (particularly dualistic thought, regarding the notion of oneself). The reason the latter is an obstruction is because it's the root cause of the first obstruction.

 

Anything that lessens negative emotions (suffering) is a practice of reducing suffering and making room for the enlightened nature, is it not?

 

This is also why the paramitas work...because they get rid of the two obstructions.

 

At least this is according to my understanding.

Edited by Aetherous
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Well I'd say you have the answer to your now-rephrased question.

 

There's no reason why acupuncture, when added to an already correct practice and mind, couldn't help with enlightenment.

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In the model I work in the acupuncture channels are just one level of channel in your body, there are all sorts of other channels and other blockages than meridian blockages. There are nadis, divine lines, Jin Shin pathways and nodes, psychic and karmic channels and knots and all sorts of conditioning held in different areas and levels of the body like the tissues, genetics, fascia which may not automatically be released through clearing the acupuncture meridians.

 

I have been taught that even if you clear all of this out completely whether you awaken is still down to grace or divine will, there is nothing you can actually do to make it happen, which is why it happens to some people who have never done a days energy work in their lives; yet doing all of this energetic stuff is like preparing for an interview and making yourself the best candidate for it to happen, it makes it more likely but it still not any sort of guarantee for anything except improved health.

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:)

 

Acupuncture as a healing modality is superb. I use it too from time to time, and i do not doubt its functions. Call me cynical, but what i have reservations about is its efficaciousness in bringing about causes of enlightenment. Please do not waste energy in speculating/entertaining such an impossible notion.

 

Im not trying to deflate hopes and dampen spirits here, what i am trying to put forth is the truth of right effort on the path of liberation in case people reading this thread begin to get eager by imagining the possibility of fast-tracking their way to 'enlightenment'.

 

For me personally, I get it for health, but hey if it just so happened to have that side affect (enlightenment) I'm good with that too :D. I already know how to fast track to enlightenment.... Spend more time meditating and cultivating instead of on the internet! lololol

Edited by BaguaKicksAss
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no matter the path, it seems its the same function that leads to enlightenment which-ever path you use, and thats detachment from mind, which opens the central channel. The observer/awareness then descends via that channel and merges with Oneness in the heart, and eventually the absolute beingness in the belly (all three dan tians)...just dif names in dif branches.

 

Now in my experience, being around a variety of teachers/masters in different paths has all helped me to glimpse, and then remain in longer and longer periods of these realities, including getting hands on transmissions to open things up (certain aspects which I've read take 5 years in kriya to open, I've gotten in one day transmissions)...so yes, BOOM, short cuts exist (just ask the dzogchen masters who are all about this)

 

So same thing goes for acupuncture. Since a large number of paths agree that the central channel joins together all the chakras/dan tians, which are accessed as part of Enlightenment, then there is an equivalent point that is connected to all the main channel, consciousness and its source, and all three dan tians.

 

By the way, this all came up intuitively during a sitting meditation, that yes, there are acupuncture points that can hasten a practitioners enlightenment.

Name one Dzogchen master who asserts that there are shortcuts to enlightenment?

 

In its most ideal condition, practicing Dzogchen may enable the adept to attain enlightenment in one lifetime, as compared to other vehicles which will take many more. Yet, there are no guarantees as the determining factors are simply too complex.

 

The claim that you received transmission which apparently reduced practice time by 5 years makes it sound as if the path to awakening is so 'boom' easy. It may be simple, but never that easy. If it was, fledgling Dzogchenpas need not have to attend numerous long term retreats, and having to undergo arduous training to facilitate stability of mind nature, of which its recognition is only the first step on a long, lonely road.

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