Transgender Q&A

[Maddie]

48 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

That's because it took you 15 times to realize and admit that it actually makes sense. 

Ok 🙂 . Thank you for explaining my experience to me so that I can understand it. 😌

 

* One of the fun things about being a girl is I get mansplained to now lol.

Edited May 10 by Maddie

[Salvijus]

7 minutes ago, Maddie said:

Ok 🙂 

There's no need to pretend you agree

 

Edit. Oh you edited and added more. Didn't see. 

Edited May 10 by Salvijus

[Maddie]

Just now, Salvijus said:

There's no need to pretend you agree

Ok 🙂

[Salvijus]

10 minutes ago, Maddie said:

Ok 🙂 . Thank you for explaining my experience to me so that I can understand it. 😌

 

* One of the fun things about being a girl is I get mansplained to now lol.

It was not your experience. It was shared experience. Hence I get to share my perspective why it took so long to arrive at some conclusion over then. 

 

If you don't like my perspective then cool. No need to pretend you agree. No one buys it anyway lol

[Salvijus]

I have to go for now 

Tcare 👋

 

[Maddie]

3 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

It was not your experience. It was shared experience. Hence I get to share my perspective why it took so long to arrive at some conclusion over then. 

 

If you don't like my perspective then cool. No need to pretend you agree. No one buys it anyway lol

 

I have a sincere question that I mean respectfully, but are you on the spectrum for autism? 

 

The reason I ask is because the only time I've ever really gotten into a circular argument with somebody that makes up their own term and then insists that it be used is with people that are on the spectrum. 

 

I'm just wondering so I would have a better understanding of where you're coming from?

[surrogate corpse]

@Salvijus

 

Your replies to me are full of basic misunderstandings of what I am saying. I have reread my posts to see if they are unclear; I am satisfied they are not. So I encourage you to reread them again and again until you understand what they are actually saying. Until then, it is not worth engaging with you further.

[Mark Foote]

14 hours ago, Salvijus said:

 

Reason is not an ally to fear. Reason serves and protects whatever you think is most valuable to you. And what you value most in life is a choice. 
 

About reason, and choice.

 

Relax your mind, relax your mind
Make you feel so fine sometime
Sometime you got to relax your mind

When the light turns green
Put your foot down on the gasoline
Sometime you got to relax your mind

Chorus

When the light turns red
Put your foot down on the brake instead
Sometime you got to relax your mind

Chorus

When the light turns blue
What in the world are you gonna do
Sometime you got to relax your mind

 

(Jim Kweskin, "Relax Your Mind")
 

 

That' the problem, with reason, with truth, and with choice--the light that turns blue.
 

 

 

[Nungali]

16 hours ago, Salvijus said:

I have one more insight to share but it's so brutal I fear you guys will go completly nuts over this. But on behalf of exploring truth with an open mind I will share this. 

 

It's based on the previous insight that to change your identity you need to become enlightened. That's what would actually cause the shift in identity. And then it got me thinking... What else can cause the shift in identity? And then I realized something scary.....

 

There are only two ways to transidentity. To become enlightened or, pardon my language, to become delusional....

 

That was hard pill to swollow for me. 

 

I would spit it out if I where you .

 

What if ;    your previous identity was the delusion ?

 

Of course, this comes back to your definition of what enlightenment means . It could mean more than finding your true identity  ( but maybe it doesnt      .

[Maddie]

1 hour ago, surrogate corpse said:

@Salvijus

 

Your replies to me are full of basic misunderstandings of what I am saying. I have reread my posts to see if they are unclear; I am satisfied they are not. So I encourage you to reread them again and again until you understand what they are actually saying. Until then, it is not worth engaging with you further.

 

I'm starting to think he's playing dumb and just trying to be a slick troll. 

[Maddie]

1 minute ago, Nungali said:

 

 

What if ;    your previous identity was the delusion ?

 

 

 

^this^ !!!

[Nungali]

12 hours ago, Maddie said:

 

That's actually an offensive word.

 

Yeah, he is strange one .... look what he wrote here about kosher ... and his follow up

 

 

[Salvijus]

On 2024-05-10 at 5:20 PM, Maddie said:

The reason I ask is because the only time I've ever really gotten into a circular argument with somebody that makes up their own term and then insists that it be used is with people that are on the spectrum. 

 

I was not trying to invent new terms. My point was that the current terms people use today are not very logical or accurate when you look carefully at what the words mean and what is actually happening. And I think I was able to show it how successfully. 

 

I don’t see what me being autistic or not autistic has to do with anything here. And I find very difficult to believe you actually have genuine concern that I might be autistic lol... But for the record, no, I'm not autistic. 

Edited May 11 by Salvijus

[Salvijus]

17 hours ago, surrogate corpse said:

@Salvijus

 

Your replies to me are full of basic misunderstandings of what I am saying. I have reread my posts to see if they are unclear; I am satisfied they are not. So I encourage you to reread them again and again until you understand what they are actually saying. Until then, it is not worth engaging with you further.

 

I was under the impression I understood your point well. 

 

You were saying that fear keeps transpeople from transitioning and being authentic. Fear keeps people from being who they really want to be deep in their heart. And fear uses reason in a form of doubt to prevent people from following their heart's desire. Reason is being used by fear to suppress their heart's desire. And i'm the guy who resources fear because what I say, even if it is reasonable, it will be used by fear for transpeople to inhibit following their authenticity. 

 

I feel that was the gist of it. I got the message the first time. And it is very beautiful message I would say. Very beautiful insight indeed. However my replies were not based on misunderstandings. They was based on insights where there are flaws in your logic. And I believe it flew over your head unfortunately... 

Edited May 11 by Salvijus

[Salvijus]

On 2024-05-09 at 9:26 AM, surrogate corpse said:

the single best thing you can do is set the fear at ease.

 

That was another beautiful point made aswell. I believe I've addressed it before already when I sayed. Only truth can set you free and transcend fear. Many deep implications and revelations come if we consider what that means.

 

This is where the flaw is in your logic when you say, reason will only furnish fear. But it's not true. Reason itself is innocent. Reason can be used both by fear and by genuine desire to be authentic.

 

The only way fear can use reason for its own benefit is if you value it more than love. It depends what you value more in life. Fear or love. Truth or illusion. Accordingly your reason will function to serve that. 

 

So you saying I'm furnishing fear is incorrect in my perception because in fact I do nothing but encourage people to value truth above all else. And that's the only way out of fear. And that's how you prevent reason to be used by fear aswell. You see... Isn’t that beautiful? 

 

Reason and truth are synonymous. That alone should make you question your position when you say reason will harm you.

Edited May 11 by Salvijus

[liminal_luke]

@Salvijus

 

I´ll try one more time.  This is why it´s not "transappearance" when a transgender person transitions....

 

First off, you do have a point about identity staying the same -- it´s possible to look at it that way. Although Maddie refers to the time before she transitions as "when I was a boy", some transwomen would posit that they´d always been women, before and after transition.  So, in this sense, identity per se doesn´t always change.  But what does change at the transition point is one´s relationship to identity.  This is all important.  Before transition one may be unaware of one´s true identity, in denial of one´s identity, or unwilling to face the social consequences of embodying one´s identity, among other possibilities.  At the point of transition, the transgender person is in effect saying "I´m going to embrace what I know to be true about myself even if that truth is not embraced by the world.  I´m going to put my own understanding first."  This is a huge step.  Before a transwoman first puts on lipstick or a ribbon in her hair, before any changes are made to appearance whatsoever, a change occurs in her relationship to her own identity.  It´s this inner shift that marks a person as transgender, more than any outward changes in appearance that may come later.

Edited May 11 by liminal_luke

[Salvijus]

10 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

@Salvijus

 

I´ll try one more time.  This is why it´s not "transappearance" when a transgender person transitions....

 

First off, you do have a point about identity staying the same -- it´s possible to look at it that way. Although Maddie refers to the time before she transitions as "when I was a boy", but some transwomen would posit that they´d always been women, before and after transition.  So, in this sense, identity per se doesn´t always change.  But what does change at the transition point is one´s relationship to identity.  This is all important.  Before transition one is either may be unaware of one´s true identity, in denial of one´s identity, or unwilling to face the social consequences of embodying one´s identity, among other possibilities.  At the point of transition, the transgender person is in effect saying "I´m going to embrace what I know to be true about myself even if that truth is not embraced by the world.  I´m going to put my own understanding first."  This is a huge step.  Before a transwoman first puts on lipstick or a ribbon in her hair, before any changes are made to appearance whatsoever, a change occurs in her relationship to her own identity.  It´s this inner shift that marks a person as transgender, more than any outward changes in appearance that may come later.

Hmmm.. Okay. I think i follow what you're saying. 

 

So it is that new self-acceptance that causes all the change of appearance to happen right? 

 

Edited May 11 by Salvijus

[Salvijus]

So why would you call "new level of self acceptance" - "transformation of identity"? 

 

No transformation of identity is happening when you accept your identity fully.

 

The term trans need not be used at all then

Edited May 11 by Salvijus

[liminal_luke]

3 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Hmmm.. Okay. I think i follow what you're saying. 

 

So it is that new self-acceptance that causes all the change of appearance to happen right? 

 

 

I, of all people, should probably not speak for the transgender community, so I won´t.  Except to say that I believe the change in one´s relationship to identity is the main thing.  After transition, a person outwardly embraces what they know on the inside to be true.  This change in relationship to self is often, but not always, accompanied by changes in appearance.  That is my understanding.

[Salvijus]

Oh wait.... I got it. 

 

Hehe. Lol

 

Omg. It's such a beautiful insight. 

 

When a you accept yourself fully, identity indeed changes. It changes from trying to be what you're not, to being what you are. That's quite a shift in identity indeed. So technically you can call self-acceptance as transidentity phenomena. 

 

Edited May 11 by Salvijus

[Salvijus]

Lol. I got another insight. 

 

Basically if you take this insight further. Based on what Luke sayed. Everyone who on some level has accomplished self-acceptance is transgender.

Edited May 11 by Salvijus

[liminal_luke]

Seems to me, @Salvijus, that you are under the impression that language -- and life -- should make sense.  I foresee many online arguments in your future.  

Edited May 11 by liminal_luke

[Salvijus]

1 minute ago, liminal_luke said:

 I foresee many online arguments in your future.  

Yea me too. But I don't mind. It's like a game to me. Mental jujitsu or smth

1 minute ago, liminal_luke said:

Seems to me, @Salvijus, that you are under the impression that language -- and life -- should make sense.  It can´t.  It won´t.  It doesn´t. 

I could debate this aswell. But l will let it pass this time haha

[Salvijus]

The beauty of playing mental jujitsu is that the one who is more true, wins. In the meantime of going back and forth. There are so many opportunities to practice honesty, forgiveness, equanimity. Especially watching your triggers and surrendering them. Practicing being vulnerable(truth) rather then defensive(ego). Learning to observe your own ego and other people's ego. All the tricks it plays. All the mechanics of it etc. 

 

Tons of benefit in it. And because one who is more true, wins. Everyone participating in it is basically chasing after truth. So everyone wins. And in a sense even if you lose you win. Because you learn something from it. 

 

Edited May 11 by Salvijus

[Nintendao]

15 hours ago, Maddie said:

I'm starting to think he's playing dumb and just trying to be a slick troll. 

 

or at least a well-meaning sea lion (but only in appearance, of course) 😇