My Opinion of Something of This Entire Subject As a Newcomer Looking In

[Nungali]

15 hours ago, NoOne said:

This is sure to go well considering I'm journeying into a group of Daoist enthusiasts and probably questioning the fundamentals of the belief system itself  

 

I've been at this for about 1.5 days, but these are my thoughts so far as someone just coming into this; although I saw the John Chan/Mo Pai footage several years ago, I became more interested this time around when I saw it again 2 days ago.

 

I can actually believe that it might be possible to cultivate and project chi as we see in his video. For example:

 

• We have the participation/observation effect in quantum mechanics
• We have scientists like Dean Radin that, assuming the studies are completely genuine, have shown beyond a statistical doubt that intention can skew randomness (such as influencing a random number generator)
• The group from metaportal seem to have the Guinness world record for most people to successfully learn telekinesis
• The construction of the pyramids and gobelki tepe, according to the likes of Graham Hancock, could suggest an alternative, lateral science (e.g. telekinesis, bio-energy, etc) from the one we find ourselves in today (modern physics)
• Clandestine US/Russia official Gov groups using telepaths aka remote viewing for information gathering
• Propaganda (false information, information diversion, information suppression) currently working very well to shape general public opinion on any matter despite being in the information age
• Science being subject to corruption the same as anything else is (e.g. as was seen in spades in the past couple years)
• We also probably really know nothing about who we are and what are purpose here is

 

That is a typical list of missapplied misunderstandings and false info  that are somehow supposed to prove or demonstrate .... whatever trip the current raver is on . 

 

You may as well say  'chi works because of 'the quantum stuff'  - or ESP  has been proven by 'multiple universe theory .

 And the best one , which deserves  a throne of **** is that  (according to Graham Handcock )  telekinesis built the great pyramid

 

since it was so much rubbish !    I stopped reading  here .

 

Besides , I know where this is going ..... MR 'One point  five days  experience . ' 

 

 

[Barnaby]

13 minutes ago, MetaDao said:

Think about how recent the internet is. It’s only a matter of time before there’s a revolution in how spiritual practices are spread. It’s already begun

 

The way I see it, after the initial libertarian period, the internet has basically transformed everything into a commodity. Doesn't make me very optimistic.

[MetaDao]

10 minutes ago, Pak_Satrio said:

Yes and the revolution should be safe for all. Who is going to fix and take care of the people who do damage to themselves? 

The natural increase in medical qigong practioners

[MetaDao]

2 minutes ago, Barnaby said:

 

The way I see it, after the initial libertarian period, the internet has basically transformed everything into a commodity. Doesn't make me very optimistic.

The next evolution of that is de-commoditizing it.

 

That serves a purpose of first making everyone hate the fact that people are profiting off these practices that many should have access to. Then, as more and more people realize the issues, it becomes free over time.

Edited December 20, 2022 by MetaDao

[MetaDao]

You can learn all form and structure from video easy enough. The state of emptiness is much more difficult and takes years and years to continually improve in. I think it is achievable without transmission though 

 

Errors in form could be corrected through A.I analysis that analyzes differences between original video and practitioner.

 

Use something like chatgpt to basically hold all the knowledge of the masters and answer all questions. Totally possible. Would curate diet plans, answer questions around theory, in-person training would be available for those who reach certain attainments.

 

My thoughts on it..

Edited December 20, 2022 by MetaDao

[Shadow_self]

3 hours ago, mcoolio said:

 

Never heard about that mo pai prostate cancer thing. Is that actually true?  I wanna believe, but I'll need more info

Yes, and more too

 

See this post

 

Quote

 

I can understand how in the past, secrecy used to be a necessity. The big question is, is it still a necessity?

 

There is a difference between secrecy and screening.

 

No teacher gives anyone extremely potent methods from the get go.

 

If you are lucky, its a case of giving someone enough to know whats happening isn't imagined or fake, and slowly bringing them deeper and deeper. If you're unlucky, its even worse

 

Normally there's things like character tests involved along the way, and markers that need to be met

 

The weeding out process is required

 

This is why, in over a decade, there are still people out there clinging to misunderstandings  and partial instruction from a certain tradition.

 

They've already failed the first character test

Edited December 20, 2022 by Shadow_self

[MetaDao]

14 minutes ago, Shadow_self said:

Yes, and more too

 

See this post

 

 

There is a difference between secrecy and screening.

 

No teacher gives anyone extremely potent methods from the get go.

 

If you are lucky, its a case of giving someone enough to know whats happening isn't imagined or fake, and slowly bringing them deeper and deeper. If you're unlucky, its even worse

 

Normally there's things like character tests involved along the way, and markers that need to be met

 

The weeding out process is required

 

This is why, in over a decade, there are still people out there clinging to misunderstandings  and partial instruction from a certain tradition.

 

They've already failed the first character test

More bullshit. Any understanding of karma or divine law and you’d know these things take care of themselves on their own.

 

Character tests? Please. I wouldn’t teach Damo Mitchell due to character issues yet he’s way further along than many who deserve it more.

 

People with character issues that do nothing to change them will naturally be weeded out by themselves. Reality won’t allow them to succeed. There’s no need for teachers to revoke access due to ‘character tests.’ All of this is bullshit meant to keep you thinking there’s a reason for so much secrecy. It’s just a way to silence people and instill fear into them that they won’t be able to access the teachings of the immortals.

 

Until there are convincing reasons on why the teachings are so secretive, I call bullshit

Edited December 20, 2022 by MetaDao

[Shadow_self]

35 minutes ago, MetaDao said:

More bullshit. Any understanding of karma or divine law and you’d know these things take care of themselves on their own.

 

Character tests? Please. I wouldn’t teach Damo Mitchell due to character issues yet he’s way further along than many who deserve it more

@MetaDao

 

There are people who PM me a lot, asking for  beginners advice, or opinions or that they missed my posts. 

 

In this case, given the important nature of the opening post, I felt obliged. 

 

This needs to be said clearly: It is for them that I am posting, not for you. 

 

I would  honestly prefer if you don't try to engage in discussion with me.  I really don't appreciate your tone or manner

 

It will go nowhere and just derail a thread, mods will come, problems will happen.

 

There are plenty of other members here who are happy to engage and talk to you. So I'm sure it should not be a problem

 

Please respect that. Its going to be my only say and response on the matter

Edited December 20, 2022 by Shadow_self

[NoOne]

5 hours ago, Shadow_self said:

 

#2 There's a concerted effort via mainstream science, and the  to dismiss all this as woowoo. That's a deliberate lie, and I know this be true having worked with these people. Their philosophical position  doesn't allow for it by default, and that's only the tip of the iceberg sadly

 

You've touched on these points in your post, about your suspicions about science, or rather "scientism" shaping public opinion, and I am deliberately posting this to confirm your suspicions. This absolutely is happening, and there are reasons we could discuss, but are beyond the scope of this thread

 

if you want to figure it out...there are some nice people here who will be more than willing to direct you to someone who can show you first hand

 

I  do sincerely hope this helps you, because im breaking a promise to myself to provide that post (mostly because saying this is more important than my own somewhat distorted, unimportant feelings on participation here.)

 

Sure, I would like to be directed to someone who can show me first hand. How might I get in touch with them?

[MetaDao]

16 minutes ago, Shadow_self said:

@MetaDao

 

There are people who PM me a lot, asking for  beginners advice, or opinions or that they missed my posts. 

 

In this case, given the important nature of the opening post, I felt obliged. 

 

This needs to be said clearly: It is for them that I am posting, not for you. 

 

I would  honestly prefer if you don't try to engage in discussion with me.  I really don't appreciate your tone or manner

 

It will go nowhere and just derail a thread, mods will come, problems will happen.

 

There are plenty of other members here who are happy to engage and talk to you. So I'm sure it should not be a problem

 

Please respect that. Its going to be my only say and response on the matter

Sure! My tone is used to incite people into seeing past the bullshit to the truth. Not aimed at angering you  

[MetaDao]

11 minutes ago, NoOne said:

 

Sure, I would like to be directed to someone who can show me first hand. How might I get in touch with them?

And, herein lies the problem  

[MetaDao]

You all should be angry. Be mad at how these arts are locked away.
 

How reality has fallen to such a state that it is this difficult to find real, authentic arts that take you to a place of spiritual transformation without paying exorbitant amounts. This is why my tone sounds the way it is. I know how impactful these arts can be. And, I can see through the bullshit that surrounds them.

[Shadow_self]

19 minutes ago, NoOne said:

 

Sure, I would like to be directed to someone who can show me first hand. How might I get in touch with them?

 

Is it the electrical stuff you need proof of?

 

Or just practices that will make you feel qi?

[Cobie]

4 hours ago, MetaDao said:

… I can promise you, if I manage to reach the level of Earth Immortal and don’t see glaring reasons to withhold information or the practices, I will reveal them for free. …

Imo: exactly, you are sane and honest and will wait - forever, as it doesn’t exist. Imo, only the deluded and the con artists can present themselves as “immortal”.
 

 

Edited December 20, 2022 by Cobie

[-ꦥꦏ꧀ ꦱꦠꦿꦶꦪꦺꦴ-]

9 minutes ago, MetaDao said:

You all should be angry. Be mad at how these arts are locked away.
 

How reality has fallen to such a state that it is this difficult to find real, authentic arts that take you to a place of spiritual transformation without paying exorbitant amounts. This is why my tone sounds the way it is. I know how impactful these arts can be. And, I can see through the bullshit that surrounds them.

Why should we be angry? There are plenty of authentic arts available for a reasonable price if you look hard enough, and relatively easy to find too. Just from this site alone I found three good teachers that I’m learning from, two who can faqi. Plus I found a TCM doctor who can faqi in my parents country that I can see when I visit them. We are blessed to have this site but we spend too much time arguing with each other about nonsense instead of working together and pushing things forward. 

[Hannes]

8 minutes ago, Shadow_self said:

 

Is it the electrical stuff you need proof of?

 

Or just practices that will make you feel qi?

I can't speak for others but I'd like an understanding that goes beyond the mind and linguistics. More of a being or becoming.

Something that clicks with my path through life.

 

[MetaDao]

4 minutes ago, Pak_Satrio said:

Why should we be angry? There are plenty of authentic arts available for a reasonable price if you look hard enough, and relatively easy to find too. Just from this site alone I found three good teachers that I’m learning from, two who can faqi. Plus I found a TCM doctor who can faqi in my parents country that I can see when I visit them. We are blessed to have this site but we spend too much time arguing with each other about nonsense instead of working together and pushing things forward. 

Indeed. I can see your point, but there could be many more available for a lot cheaper.
 

Also, the arts you are mentioning are not the deepest spiritual arts. You can’t find authentic Neidan teachers very easily.
 

We should be grateful for what we have but work together and push things forward to make reality even better  

[Shadow_self]

3 minutes ago, Pak_Satrio said:

There are plenty of authentic arts available for a reasonable price if you look hard enough, and relatively easy to find too.

 

Reading the archives here is really worth anyones time

 

When it costed 1000's to even learn a basic standing and seated practice - people complained

Then it became available at a cost- People still complained

Then it became available at a reasonable cost - people still complained

Some of these are now available for free to get a start - people are still complaining

 

Theres a pattern here. You give an inch, a large amount of people want a mile. Almost all of the time 

 

This is why character tests are important. Even when a foot in the door is available, a lot of people just still aren't happy

 

I have one teacher who I get free training from, whatever I choose to give is fine (including nothing)

 

There is another I pay a reasonable amount.

 

I see them no differently, and they treat me no differently, with the exception that one is exceptionally busy and yet still finds time to do something if I asked and a senior couldn't help.

 

Honestly, people should be grateful things have opened up how they have. The running narrative from people I know a long time in this game is " I wish this was available when I started out" and "I nearly had to remortgage my house"

 

3 minutes ago, Pak_Satrio said:

Just from this site alone I found three good teachers that I’m learning from, two who can faqi. Plus I found a TCM doctor who can faqi in my parents country that I can see when I visit them. We are blessed to have this site but we spend too much time arguing with each other about nonsense instead of working together and pushing things forward. 

 

I had thought to open a thread listing teachers people could reach out too. Im aware some of them are mainstream, but there are others that aren't as "out there" yet still have plenty worth learning

[MetaDao]

5 minutes ago, Shadow_self said:

Honestly, people should be grateful things have opened up how they have. The running narrative from people I know a long time in this game is " I wish this was available when I started out" and "I nearly had to remortgage my house"

Lol. Exactly why you should be angry then and still angry now.

 

This is the equivalent of saying in the 1940s, you should be grateful because blacks used to be slaves, now you just don’t have rights.

[Shadow_self]

40 minutes ago, Hannes said:

I can't speak for others but I'd like an understanding that goes beyond the mind and linguistics. More of a being or becoming.

Something that clicks with my path through life.

 

 

Feeling Qi didnt do that for me unfortunately. I had some far weirder experiences that really did it for me.

 

The strangest thing of all is many of them don't happen during practice.

 

One happened in the middle of a park, in broad daylight and involved a most unusual, but kind of observation of and insight into dependant origination (according to my  Buddhist teacher). I believe the term would be rupa-kalapa

 

Important to note this was an experience, not an attainment...but fairly mind-breaking nonetheless

 

(I should probably shut up now )

Edited December 21, 2022 by Shadow_self

[Lairg]

2 hours ago, Hannes said:

I'd like an understanding that goes beyond the mind and linguistics.

 

To understand is to see what stands under.  

 

The first stage beyond the mind is heart knowledge.   It occurs without any mental process - being direct knowing.

 

As the human learns to control its mind, it progressively becomes aware in the flow of heart/buddhic energies and therefore intuitionally operational.  This allows much more direct interface with entities on the higher inner planes

 

Women may find intuition easier than men. 

[NoOne]

3 hours ago, Shadow_self said:

 

Is it the electrical stuff you need proof of?

 

Or just practices that will make you feel qi?

 

Honestly, both would be great. I certainly would like the practices.

[Barnaby]

Anger and hate...

 

Been there, done that.

 

For me, they're precisely what these practices should be leading us away from.

[mcoolio]

9 hours ago, Pak_Satrio said:

We are blessed to have this site but we spend too much time arguing with each other about nonsense instead of working together and pushing things forward. 

 

9 hours ago, Shadow_self said:

Honestly, people should be grateful things have opened up how they have. The running narrative from people I know a long time in this game is " I wish this was available when I started out" and "I nearly had to remortgage my house"

 

It's not about being ungrateful. I don't have much issue with spending money to progress my practice. As much as it takes. I expect the same of MetaDao. It's true that those who search hard enough, can and will find ways. In that sense, the practice has opened up. I think a true seeker of the way has holes in his pockets

 

About the people who are complaining about how expensive it is, or those who need to see burning paper or feel faqi before they can get themselves to practice/search for a practice. For those who might fall in that category, they probably don't have the dedication to go through with the practice anyway!

 

 

I simply question the need for extreme secrecy in this subject. Why on what is probably the biggest forum on daoism is there almost no discussion/sharing of actual methods? It's taboo. Many of us probably know some very good practices and would be perfectly capable to explain them. We could share and discuss and experiment. That would be real exchange! But instead, most discussions here are about theoretical and philosophical ramblings. Why do we do this?

 

And yes ... I have heard teachers say all these things:

 

But what would you do if you get injured

But you cannot mix practices

But these methods are to powerful and could be used for bad things

...

Bla bla bla. It's like being 10 years old again.

 

So be honest guys , anyone else who feels at least a little bit like this?

 

Note that I have huge respect for the old traditions and teachers. This information is some of the most valuable things you can get hold of. If somebody asks me not to share, I will respect it. But I do think these are important questions that should be asked all the time. Why is it like this? Is it still valid? If one day, I have a teacher to asks these questions, I will ask them.

Edited December 21, 2022 by mcoolio

[Taoist Texts]

53 minutes ago, mcoolio said:

Why on what is probably the biggest forum on daoism is there almost no discussion/sharing of actual methods? It's taboo.

you seem to be observing a taboo by not specifying what you mean. methods to do what exactly? try to be specific and you will get your answer.