"what is against Tao..."

[Stosh]

 

In either perspective , one never really knows the ultimate ramifications of our actions , nor all the causes for them. 

Whether you can be said to have responsibility for the death of the snake, birds ,dog , is debatable . 

The non-dual valuation , which you do know ,

didn't weigh as heavily as your concern for the dog, self , wife and birds.

You chose what you ultimately considered the greatest- summed up -virtue to be.  

So really all there is to consider, is something which all must wrestle with, who are interested in this non-duality idea. 

And that is , when push comes to shove , do you kill the snakes or leave them alone. 

Since we live as people , and have the corporeal world to deal with , I think we can justify taking action. 

Those actions, literally,  are our existence.

You can't know if killing the snake , or feeding the birds , would ultimately be bad 

and while non-duality and non-action can potentially enhance our rapport with the world , mitigate problems , 

its not a perspective that people can really live up to totally , and remain. 

The most devout Jain , still begrudges the worms his flesh. 

Give yourself a break. 

[roger]

12 hours ago, 3bob said:

"what is against Tao will soon cease to be"  (Chapter 30 last line)

 

Does this saying raise multiple questions for you? For instance if such will soon cease to be then how does it keep arising and btw. how can it arise in the first place under the overall Tao?  Thus does one come to ask if such is really against the Tao from the perspective of the Tao which is far beyond just our human related concerns and definitions as to what qualifies as being against the Tao....?  

 

 

 

I take the view that 'all is as it should be'. All is as God/Self/love/Tao wills it. Everything is happening perfectly. Everything that happens is the highest good.

 

There's a book called 'When Bad Things Happen to Good People,' in which the author argues against this. He experienced a tragedy and took no comfort in believing it was God's plan.

 

Others DO take comfort in believing everything is part of a divine plan.

 

If everything is happening as it should, then Harold Kushner's (the author) beliefs and book were right for him. He believed what he was supposed to believe.

 

The thing is that the divine plan wants All possible experience, it wants to FULLY experience life, love, and all things.

 

Without all 'bad' things, there couldn't be all good things. Just as without anger, there couldn't be forgiveness; without sickness, there couldn't be healing; without ignorance, there couldn't be learning or growth.

Edited July 29, 2017 by roger

[roger]

sorry accidentally posted

Edited July 29, 2017 by roger

[Wu Ming Jen]

Physical manifestation of Tao is nature.Going against nature one is surely to perish.

 

We have our own nature as well. Go against our own nature. Not a lot of benefit in that either. 

 

The best part of itis  nature always wins, we are nature and their is nothing to oppose in the natural world.

 

Then along came man separate from nature this new species, the dead skin and dandruff of the immortals decided to get confused.

[RiverSnake]

IMO nothing is "against" the Tao...but you can be in or out of harmony with the Tao. 

[Marblehead]

Perhaps the more important concept here is the difference between the way of man and the Way of Dao.

 

[morning dew]

3 hours ago, Marblehead said:

Perhaps the more important concept here is the difference between the way of man and the Way of Dao.

 

 

Do birds and snakes and dogs have their own way/dao?

[Brian]

51 minutes ago, morning dew said:

 

Do birds and snakes and dogs have their own way/dao?

Their de are different.

[Marblehead]

1 hour ago, morning dew said:

 

Do birds and snakes and dogs have their own way/dao?

Brian's statement is valid.  I look at it more as they have their own Tzujan - way of becoming what they are.  Birds don't slither, snakes don't fly, dogs do neither.