Nikolai1

Being a spiritual teacher

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So say you're a maths teacher at high school. Your students all know the basic arithmetic that we use in everyday life already. You're now teaching them the higher stuff: algebra, geometry, calculus. This is the stuff that is needed in specific careers like computer science, statistics, aeronautics.

 

So you, the teacher are teaching them in the hope that they do what you are NOT doing. You wish them to apply it outside of the classroom in the world of science and technology.

 

How does it go with the spiritual teacher? Is the person who spends all their time teaching the highest example? Or are there higher practitioners who are the one time pupils and the justification for the teacher' s life spent in teaching?

 

Are any of us encountering clearly awakened individuals who themselves aren't teaching, but doing other activities?

 

Thanks for your views on this!

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My feeling is that everything is simply Consciousness in manifestation. Sometimes Consciousness, (Tao, Oneness, Totality, whichever term you prefer to use when trying to talk about the Tao that cannot be spoken),... sometimes Tao manifests as a butcher, sometimes a baker, sometimes a candlestick maker. Then again, sometimes the body /mind mechanism it manifests through looks like a spiritual teacher, sometimes it produces a Buddha, sometimes a charlatan and a fraud. Sometimes a stick insect, sometimes a rock. They all come from the same Source; they're all exactly the same nature, even though we cannot see it.

Any idea of any one of them being a 'higher example' than another, is simply a notion that arises in the mind of one or more of these body/mind mechanisms. It has no more, (or no less) meaning than the similarly ephemeral thoughts, "I'm hungry", or , "It's cold, I think I'll get up and close the window."

Here's a more eloquent quote on these ideas by Nathan Gill. He claims to 'know' this stuff from personal experience. I merely read books. Nevertheless,  I do often find the ideas expressed in them very compelling. Perhaps some of them might titillate your grey cells as well.

Perhaps not. Who knows ?

*


"There is no mind. The term ‚Äėmind‚Äô is used in a somewhat confusing way to represent the thoughts appearing and disappearing presently in awareness, and so seeming to constitute a stream of thoughts.

This apparent stream of thoughts ‚Äď when seen objectively as single images appearing and disappearing ‚Äď is not problematic. But when labelled ‚Äėmind‚Äô, it is presumed to constitute an actual entity.

However,‚Ķ.. it is purely a chimera. No thought can understand anything. Thoughts are merely inert images ‚Äď message balloons. They don‚Äôt actually do anything. "

Edited by ThisLife
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Yes good point. And some people get very obviously called to be a teacher. Others set themselves up very deliberately and wilfully because conceptually they understand the basics. Maybe the first type will be better than the second at producing future 'spiritual mathemeticians'

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Believe it or not . . . it's possible to stay outside the typical teacher/student paradigm.

 

If you look around, you can find knowledgeable people that will willingly interact with you on a peer basis.  Some of them (not necessarily all) may also be "teachers", but they'll drop that dynamic if you show yourself worthy (basically: sincere and polite).

 

In fact, they welcome it as a change of pace from the usual stuff they have to do.

 

It's not for everyone, but it's an alternative that's not often appreciated . . .

Edited by Lataif
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another aspect for consideration, "cast your bread upon the waters..."

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I think all "teaching" is derived from the model of a family and the way children learn with their parents.

 

When families are demised and special non-living "training" is "required" (such as modern concept of "job"), then this model is abstracted and will feature specialized "teacher" as parent surrogate.

 

Parent is good model too, because parent is also living their own life while caring for and teaching children. In the old world there was no conflict, no going away to build Microsoft for Bill Gates and just toss kids into public holding tank school to be trained to do the same.

 

Also - children are seeing spirit in parents, and this is also revealing ancestors, and spiritual growth is happening all day and every day as normal aspect of living. Old way was living in physical and spiritual the same.

 

Professional teacher can be good, but is not really as functional or altruistic as parent, and not so revealing of life as it really is.

 

 

-VonKrankenhaus

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So say you're a maths teacher at high school. Your students all know the basic arithmetic that we use in everyday life already. You're now teaching them the higher stuff: algebra, geometry, calculus. This is the stuff that is needed in specific careers like computer science, statistics, aeronautics.

 

So you, the teacher are teaching them in the hope that they do what you are NOT doing. You wish them to apply it outside of the classroom in the world of science and technology.

 

How does it go with the spiritual teacher? Is the person who spends all their time teaching the highest example? Or are there higher practitioners who are the one time pupils and the justification for the teacher' s life spent in teaching?

 

Are any of us encountering clearly awakened individuals who themselves aren't teaching, but doing other activities?

 

Thanks for your views on this!

 

 

 

In a sense, you miss the entire point of spirituality in your very premise; to compare spirit to mundane is to compare red dwarf stars to the wsensation of finishing level 3-4 in super mario bros.  ... :huh:

 

But in the parameters of your inquiry: the very act of exemplifying a spiritual virtue is in and of itself a spiritual application and the very act of teaching is a high example, indeed, but there is no "highest" in infinity, only ascending, stagnating, and declining. there is a fourth state for those who pursue the omnitude of infinity.

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Thanks Vanir, I guess what you saying is that there is no comparison between a maths teacher and a spiritual teacher. Maybe the term teacher is misleading. There are just people who are spiritually realised and their presence sets an example.

 

Do you think that some kind of teaching or transmission automatically ensues upon realisation?

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Of course there are awakened people who are not teaching. What does awakening have to do with teaching? There are awakened photographers, awakened doctors, awakened scientists, awakened biologists, awakened musicians, awakened writers, awakened engineers, awakened poets, etc. There are quiet humble monks in the Thai forests and there are people in high level corporate jobs and there are travelers and there are stay at home mothers.

 

Many people wake up and realize they don't care in the least about awakening anymore. Like, as a topic, if you really look at it, it's pretty goddamned uninteresting, so I'm not surprised that a mind that is suddenly free of its former shackles would find something else to do than dote on its own illumination.

 

And producing an excellent pupil in no way "justifies" a master's life. A life is a life and has value on terms we don't define, and which certainly don't conform to the ideal the seeker holds of the spiritual path.

 

When people get caught up in idolatry (of the 'master') and think there's nothing to life but their path, they're way off the path, imo. Acting like a child who needs a superior to lead you through life is infantile, and imo involves a serious neglection of personal responsibility and personal strength as they pertain to the extroverted dimension of our lives.

 

I have respect for masters, but never idolatry, and I never think of them as higher than or lower than anyone else. Inferiority complex/superiority complex will always look for hierarchies of value among people. Holism sees infinite interconnection and endlessly functional utility to all organisms, big and small. Nothing greater or lesser than anything else. A perfect blend of order and chaos.

 

I met this dude at an ashram, he was a lawyer, cursed like a fucking sailor, but every time he opened his mouth (which was basically always) everyone would shut up and listen, because the man was totally batshit awake and it was obvious as soon as he started talking.

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I never meet people like your lawyer. Maybe I should hang out in ashrams more.

Edited by Nikolai1

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So say you're a maths teacher at high school. Your students all know the basic arithmetic that we use in everyday life already. You're now teaching them the higher stuff: algebra, geometry, calculus. This is the stuff that is needed in specific careers like computer science, statistics, aeronautics.

 

So you, the teacher are teaching them in the hope that they do what you are NOT doing. You wish them to apply it outside of the classroom in the world of science and technology.

 

How does it go with the spiritual teacher? Is the person who spends all their time teaching the highest example? Or are there higher practitioners who are the one time pupils and the justification for the teacher' s life spent in teaching?

 

There are many approaches to spiritual teaching, but we might say that ultimately they all lead to a realization of oneness. So in comparison to a teacher of science, who's students may go on to contribute in highly refined specialized niches, a teacher of spiritual oneness may lead students to dissolve any attachment to specialized niches.

 

And, as we are all inherently special already, part of this path is in learning how to understand the ways in which we are special, so we may come to find one-ness through perfectly embracing this specialness from the outside in.

 

There are many facets, layers, levels to this dance of balance, before one returns to one-ness. And so different teachers will have unique approaches that deal with these. Some teachers may not be fully mastered themselves, but have deep insight into specific layers, and students drawn to them will likely need to work on these layers, and may later move on - should this be their path.

 

Though we all may focus on returning to one-ness, the road we follow is not linear. It is natural for there to be many forward and backward steps, and sometimes spending a long time on a particular stage is necessary for balancing the momentum we have created.

 

Some teachers who have gone all the way may be invisible, working unseen, and some may have students, and cater to the level their students are able to work at. The following quote comes to mind:

 

Zhuangzi, 7e, tl Brook Ziporyn:

There was a shaman in Zheng named Jixian who could discern whether people would live or die, survive or perish. He knew how long their lives would be and what turns their fortunes would take, giving the exact year, month, week, and date for each event like some kind of god. When the people of Zheng caught sight of him, they would turn and run. Liezi went to see him, and his mind became quite intoxicated. He returned and told Huzi about it, saying, "I used to  think your Course was the ultimate, but now I see that there is something beyond it."

 

Huzi said, "I have only finished showing you its outward ornament, not yet its inner reality. Have you really mastered this Course? A multitude of hens with no rooster can produce no chicks. You use the Course to browbeat the world, insisting that people believe in it. Because you try to control others, you have allowed yourself to be controlled. That is why this man was able to read your fortune on your face. Bring him here, and I will show myself to him."

 

The next day, Liezi brought the shaman to see Huzi. He came out and said to Liezi, "Alas! Your master is as good as dead! That is not a living being in there! He has at most a few weeks left. I saw something very strange in him, something resembling wet ashes."

 

Liezi went in, his collar drenched with tears, and reported these words to Huzi. Huzi said, "Just now I showed him the patterns of the earth, sprouting forth without any strenuous rumblings and without straightening themselves out. He must have seen in me the incipient impulse of the Virtuosity that blocks everything out. Try bringing him again."

 

The next day, Liezi brought the shaman once more. He came out and said, "Your master is lucky to have met me! He's recovering; there are healthy signs of life! I could see his blockage moving into balance."

 

Liezi went in and reported this to HUzi, who said, "Just now I showed him Heaven's soil. Impervious to both names and realities, renown and profit, the incipient impulse nonetheless comes forth from the heels. He must have seen in me the incipient impulse of all that flourishes. Try bringing him again."

 

The next day, he brought the shaman yet again to see Huzi. He came out and told Liezi, "Your master is an incoherent mess, I have no way to read his face. Have him get himself together, then I'll come back to do a reading."

 

Liezi went in and reported this to Huzi, who said, "Just now I showed him the vast gushing surge in which no one thing wins out. He must have seen in me the incipient impulse that balances all energies. The frothing of a salamander's swirl is the reservoir. The frothing of still water is the reservoir. The frothing of flowing water is the reservoir. The reservoir has nine names, nine aspects, and I have showin him three of them. Try bringing him again."

 

The next day, Liezi brought him to see Huzi again. But before the shaman had even come to a halt before him, he lost control of himself and bolted out the door. Huzi said, "Go after him!" But Liezi could not catch up with him. He returned and reported to Huzi, "He's gone! I cannot catch him!"

 

Huzi said, "Just now I showed him what I am when not yet emerged from my source -- something empty and serpentine in its twistings, admitting of no understanding of who or what. So he saw it as something endlessly collapsing and scattering, something flowing away with every wave. This is why he fled."

 

That was when Liezi realized he had not yet learned anything. He returned to his home and did not emerge for three years, cooking for his wife, feeding the pigs as if he were serving guests, remaining remote from all endeavors and letting all the chiseled carvings of his character return to an unhewn blockishness. Solitary like a clump of soil, he planted his physical form there in its place, a mass of chaos and confusion. And that is how he remained to the end of his days.

 

Huzi here is believed to be showing the various 8 extraordinary vessels, and demonstrating the point that understanding cannot simply come from study, but must be realized deep within. The further one goes to the heart of one-ness, the more one is able to display whatever one wishes for the benefit of others - be it for teaching, for cultivating harmony, etc.

 

Are any of us encountering clearly awakened individuals who themselves aren't teaching, but doing other activities?

 

Undoubtedly, but do we know them when we see them? They may be engaged in all manner of mundane pursuits on the surface, while on a subtler level, who can say...

 

This reminded me of the story of Nieh Shih-Tao (from Tales of Inner Meaning, Cleary):

 

 

Nieh Shih-tao was styled One Who Had Penetrated the Subtle. He was a brilliant man, yet simple and straightforward. Modest and prudent in his speech and behavior, he was known for taking care of his parents well in their old age, and wa highly respected in his community. When he was young, he became the student of one of those beyond convention. At the age of thirteen, he was ordained as a Taoist priest, and at the age of fifteen received an esoteric symbol of a method ofr cultivating reality.

 

According to his own account, once when he was reading Taoit books he came across a prescription for eating pine sap and decided to climb Hundred Fathoms Mountain with a Taoist colleague to gather some sap.

 

This mountain was very steep and high, and from its peak one had a view of all four directions. At night the two Taoists rested under the pines on the summit of the mountain; the sky was clear, the moon was bright. Suddenly they heard immortal music coming from Purple Cloud Mountain to the southeast, far far away, slowly passing Stone and Metal Mountain, which was the same height as Hundred Fathoms Mountain and, though ten miles away on the surface of the earth, seemed very close from peak to peak.

 

When they heard the immortal music reach them, it stopped a while; then there were three beats of a small drum, and a whole orchestra was clearly heard to play again. Though percussion instruments kept a beat, it was impossible to determine the melody. The sounds were high and clear, not like the music of the human world. It continued from midnight until dawn, finally stopping at cock crow.

 

Later they heard from the villagers who lived at the foot of the mountain that they had all heard it. Nieh's colleague said, "When we were gathering mystic medicine, we suddenly heard immortal music. This must mean that our intentions have been felt in the other world. I also regard it as a sign that you will attain the Tao."

 

After that Nieh traveled around, then went to Nanyue, the southern Holy Mountain, where he prostrated himself before the altars of Jade Purity and Blue Jade of the Heaven of Light. Subsequently he stayed at the Immortal Summoning Observatory and entered the Wellspring of the Spirit of Open Clarity.

 

Now it was springtime, and he heard that the old hermitage of Real Human Ts'ai (Cai), a famous adept of centuries past, was not far away. He also heard there were strange flowers and trees around there, and that woodcutters sometimes saw Real Human Ts'ai.

 

Nieh Shih-tao, delighted at the prospect of possibly getting to see Real Human Ts'ai, fasted for seven days to purify himself, then rose early one morning and went alone into the mountains.

 

As he went along, he smelled an unusual floral fragrance. Before he realized it, it was already evening, and he found himself by a large valley stream. He saw a woodcutter sitting on the sand, facing the water. Nieh quickened his steps, heading over toward the woodcutter, who now picked up his bundle and began to go down the valley.

 

The woodcutter turned around and looked at Nieh, then put his bundle back down and asked, "Where are you going, all alone?"

 

Nieh replied, "I'm doing my best to learn the Tao and find the immortals. Ive heard Real Human Ts'ai is hidden in these mountains, and I just want to meet him once."

 

The woodcutter said, "Master Ts'ai's abode is extremely deep -- people can't go there."

 

Nieh said, "I've already come this far, climbing vines up cliffs -- if there are mountains to cross, what does distance matter?"

 

The woodcutter said, "Anyway, its getting late, almost nightfall; for now, go past this mountain, and to the east you'll find a home where you can stay."

 

Nieh wanted to go along with the woodcutter, but the woodcutter quickly stepped into the stream. It seemed quite shallow when the woodcutter walked in, but the moment Nieh stepped in the stream turned out to be extremely deep, with a swift current. So Nieh did not dare try to wade across.

 

The woodcutter said, "You'll be able to cross this stream fifty years from now."

 

Nieh watches as the woodcutter walked across the water and disappeared out of sight on the farther shore.

 

Nieh then went several miles around the mountain and saw in the distance a rustic cottage with a fenced yard, chickens, and dogs. Approaching nearer, he saw a pale man who looked like a farmer, about thirty years old, living alone.

 

When this man saw Nieh, he thought it very odd that anyone would be traveling alone deep in the mountains. Suddenly he said, "The troubles of the family come out together; who is in charge?" And he asked Nieh, "Where are you going?"

 

Nieh said, "I'm looking for the hermitage of Real Human Ts'ai."

 

The man said, "Did you see a woodcutter on the way here?"

 

Nieh said that he had.

 

The man said, "That was the Taoist adept Ts'ai, who just passed by."

 

When Nieh heard this, he prostrated himself in prayer and said, "When an ordinary ignoramus meets an immortal sage and does not recognize him that too is in the order of things."

 

It was already nightfall, and the mountain forest was pitch black. Nieh had no place to stay.

 

The man asked him, "Where do you come from?"

 

In reply, Nieh told him of his beginnings and his journey in search of reality. Then the man allowed him into the house and even had him sit on the platform near the fireplace.

 

The man said, "I happen to be out of provisions here in the mountains."

 

Nieh said, I've been fasting a long time, and I'm not hungry." He saw beside the fire a kettle of hot water and several covered yellow porcelain bowls.

 

The host said, "You can drink what's in the bowls -- feel free to take what you want."

 

Nieh then took the cover off one of the blowls and found that there was tea in it. The hols told him to pour hot water on it and drink.

 

Drinking the tea, Nieh found that its energy and savor were far different from ordinary tea. After a time he again wanted some tea and went to take the cover off another bowl, but found that he could not do so. He tried all the bowls, but found that he could not uncover any of them. Realizing with some diffidence that this was not an ordinary villager's house, he did not dare say anything.

 

The host, who slept in another room, did not get up the next morning event though the sun was high in the sky. And there was no fire in the hearth. In his sleep, the host said, "In this solitary and desolate place, suddenly I am concerned that I have nothing to offer you. There are a lot of homes in the village up ahead -- you should go there."

 

Nieh went a couple of miles, but didn't see any houses, nothing but cliffs and defiles. When he turned around and looked back, he found that he had lost the way to where he had stayed the night. He went about ten miles, when he suddenly saw an old man.

 

Nieh and the old man sat on a flat rock to talk, and the old man asked him about why he had ventured into the mountains. Nieh told him all that had happened. The old man said, "Master Ts'ai and his son both hide in these mountains. Last night you stayed with his son."

 

The old man also told Nieh, "You have a rich air of the Tao about you, but your immortal bones are not yet complete. You will starve and thirst in the mountains -- how can you stay here long?"

 

Then the old man sudde nly broke off a stalk of a plant and handed it to Nieh. It was shaped like a ginger sprout and was over a foot long. Nieh chewed it and found it sweet and delicious. The old man also had him drink some spring water.

 

When Nieh raised his head after drinking from the spring, he found the old man had already disappeared.

 

Now Nieh was very disappointed, but after having taken the tea and eaten the herb, he flet stronger and lighter than when he had come. He wanted to follow the mountain trail to look for a place to stay, but the trail was already covered and blocked by brambles and vines, impossible to get through.

 

So Nieh returned to the Immortal Summoning Observatory, where the Taoist priests there exclaimed with surprise, "This observatory is near the spiritual crags, but there are many poisonous creatures and wild beasts, so people are rarely able to go alone. We were wondering why you suddenly left over a month ago, and we've been worrying about you for a long time."

 

Nieh said, "I just left yesterday, and only stayed overnight."

 

He then told all about seeing the woodcutter, the cottage where he spent the night, and also about meeting the old man. The priests were impressed. They said, "While we have been living in this observatory, we have just been studying Taoism; we knew of the existence of Real Human Ts'ai, but haven't had any opportunities to see him. You must have the Tao in you already, because you've now seen both Master Ts'ai and his son. And as for the old man, in the past it has been said that Real Human P'eng is hidden in these mountains; maybe the old man was this Master P'eng. As soon as you go into the mountains, you meet three immortals, and spend a day and a night there that is over a month long in the human world. In reality, this is what accumulated practice has led you to.

 

Nieh himself was amazed. He stayed at Immortal Summoning Observatory for years. Later he decided to return to his native place because his parents were getting old; he went back to the mountain hermitage near his home, where he had stayed as a youth.

 

When he went into the mountains to gather firewood and herbs, if he ran into tigers or leopards, when they saw Nieh they would let their ears droop and wag their tails, crouching down to the ground. Nieh would pet and talk to them, and they would get up and follow him. Sometimes he would fasten kindling or herbs on their backs; they would carry it home for him and then leave.

 

There are many similar examples of how people of the Way could influence wild animals. There was a mountain nearby where Nieh lived that was notorious for being inhabited by many fierce animals that didn't harm people; this was attributed  to Nieh's influence.

 

His parents asked him how he had benefited from his traveling studies, and he told them the whole story. His parents were very happy because not only did they receive his care on the ordinary plane, they were also enriched by the all-embracing Tao through him. They considered themselves very fortunate to be the parents of Nieh.

 

Later he went traveling again, having heard that Real Human Mei and Administrator Siao were hiding on Jade Tube Mountain, and that many people of the time had seen them. Mei was Mei Fu, and had been an official; Siao was a prince of the Liang dynasty (sixth century C.E.), Siao Tzu-yun. When the governor of their district fled the rebellion of the infamous Hou Ching, whole families went into the mountains, and these two had both attained the Tao here.

 

Nieh, staying for a while at the Observatory of Pure Space on Jade Tube Mountain, wanted to look for Mei and Siao, so he made a special trip in hopes of seeing them. He set off with determination and went very deep into the mountains. Suddenly he saw a man dressed in muslin, with a blacksilk cap. By his face, he appeared to be about fifty years old.

 

Nieh paid his respects to this man and asked him who he was. At first the man said he was a worder and asked Nieh where he was going. Nieh told him he was looking for Mei and Siao. The worker said, "We have heard you are very diligent in your quest for the Tao, traveling to all the famous mountains. This is not easy at all. If you want to see those two masters, I can take you there. Your past deeds are very pure, already worthy of a name on the Jade Register; though you will not go on the ultimate flight right away, you will still cross over the world."

 

The workman also said, "I am Hsieh T'ung-hsiu (Xie Tongxiu). You may not know me, so I introduce myself. I have been living in seclusion in the mountains with the immortals P'eng and Ts'ai for three hundred years now. I know you have traveled to the Spring of Clear Awareness; I happen to have been ordered by the Master of the Eastern Flower to take charge of the mountain, forest, and earth immortals on Jade Tube Mountain, and am also in charge of the sanctuary shrines of the Observatory of Pure Space, so you and I have a spiritual connection already. That is why we have been able to meet. As for Master Mei and Master Siao, during the day they were called by the king of Heaven of Little Existence, and I doubt that they will be back soon, so there is no use in waiting for them."

 

Nieh now bowed respectfully and said, "Mortals in the ordinary world search for the Tao in the wrong way, freezing their spirits and concentrating their thoughts from morning to night without yet knowing the essential wonder. They are like people adrift in a shoreless ocean. This unexpected meeting with you today is really a rare bit of good luck for me, as I have gotten to see a master of the Tao."

 

T'ung-hsiu said, "Your sincere devotion is very touching. You haven't finished your tasks in the world, so I am going to show you a way out of the mountains. We'll go to where I stay."

 

Nieh followed T'ung-hsiu for a couple of miles, when suddenly he saw a two-room reed house, very new and clean. Inside were low platform seats and a little kettle over a fire, with water boiling in it. It looked like a scholar's studio, with no one there.

 

Tung-hsiu had Nieh come in and sit on a wooden horse, while T'ung-hsiu himself sat on a white stone deer. Suddenly a child came in and gave Nieh a cup of hot water. When he drank it, Nieh felt very clear and refreshed.

 

T'ung-hsiu also had him take a book from the shelf. He said, "This is the Basic Book. Be diligent in learning it, and you will attain the essence of reality."

 

Nieh wanted to stay there and learn from T'ung-hsiu, but before he said anything, T'ung-hsiu, aware of what Nieh was thinking, said, "You have parents who are getting old, and though you have an older brother who can take care of them, I cannot tell you to stay, in case you may want to travel to study more. I have a disciple living on a certain mountain; if you go see him, give him a message for me, and also show him the Basic Book. Then you will be able to find out what it means. If you don't see him, just throw the Basic Book in the cave above a certain ravine, and scratch my message on a rock there. Then my disciple will teach you the essential Way himself."

 

After he had said this much, T'ung-hsiu sent Nieh back. All of a sudden Nieh found that T'ung-hsiu had disappeared, and he himself was near the place he had started from. He went back to the Observatory of Pure Space, where the Taoist priests said in astonishment that he had been gone for seven days. Where did he go?

 

Nieh told them the whole storey, and two of the priests were so excited that they begged to go back with him. They did go, and when they reached the place where Nieh had been, the rock formations and vegetation were as he had seen them, but they could not find the reed house. They looked around all day in dismay and finally returned to the observatory.

 

Anyway, Nieh had the Basic Book, which was written in readable characters, telling about the true secret of the esoteric essentials used by the Queen Mother of the Celestial Court to order and educate the Community of Immortals. When those immortals put it into practice, they should attain the ability to ascend to heaven; when mortals in the world receive it, while on earth they participate in the Inner Government. There were some points, however, whose meaning eluded him, so he later went ot the Observatory of Reality and stayed there for a month l ooking for traces of Hsieh T'ung-hsiu's disciple.

 

Some people said there was a hermit who lived around the ravine T'ung-hsiu had mentioned, but no one knew his name, though sometimes people saw him. Nieh went into the mountains time and time again looking for him, but did not see him. At length he did as T'ung-hsiu had told him, throwing the book into the cave and scratching the message on a rock face. After that he dreamed that a spiritual man named Purple Sacred Mushroom, the disciple of T'ung-hsiu, taught him in such a way that his mental blocks melted away. Then he awoke.

 

A year or more later, he again returned to his original hermitage on the mountain near his hometown, and lived there for over twenty years. He regarded the Real Humans T'sai, P'eng, and Hsieh as his occult mentors, and personally oversaw the collection of tales about these immortals from among the Taoist priests and the general populace.

 

Eventually Nieh Shih-tao was recognized as a Taoist adept of great powers, respected by all. His prayers were always answered, and he had over five hundred disciples, at least fifteen of whom also attained adepthood and graced the Mystic School. People came from all around to study with him, and he taught them according to their natures and perceptions. He died at the age of sixty-eight, but like many of the Real People was seen from time to time for years and years afterwards.

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it seems my own point was overlooked, but i will try to say it literally:

It's not about being "awakened" or being a teacher, but about setting forth a correct and righteous example of life's unobtrusive maintenance.

Much like working with children, you also must learn to exemplify and appreciate the good and right examples while borderline ignoring the bad ones and avoid even acknowledging them by mention and help drive focus toward the positive and beneficial ways of behaving.

There is a right and wrong way to do all things and this has no regard on correct or incorrect.

The correct way to rocket to the moon is in no way bearing the "right" way - as it is inherently wrong to rocket to the moon, given the level of necessity that it be done.



Necessity is the majority objective measurment of right and wrong.

Right is always and/or only necessary and there are correct and incorrect ways of exemplifying righteousness.

Wrongfulness, however, is the majority leading example, and the majority, in their stupidity and ignorance, want ought keep it that way, shun and even squelch righteous examples...

There are many "correct" ways of doing wrongful things, and the focus is mutated from right and wrong to correct and incorrect, while using the titles of right and wrong to describe your relation to the acts.

Suddenly it becomes "wrong" (read as incorrect, spoken as "wrong") to take food without paying for it, and the "right" (read as correct, spoken as "right") thing to do is "earn" money to "pay" for your sustinence.

When the whole of that scenario is in and of itself inherently wrongful, but the model of power derrives from the misleading verbiage of the exchange that in order to retain a wrongful (and inherently thusly harmful) way of life, is to subconsciously convince people that it is "right".

This is largely accomplished by misinterpreting the definitions of such words as, but  not limited to: "right and correct" , "wrong and incorrect", and "ignorant and stupid".


Exemplifying correct righteousness is what makes for spiritual.
Exemplification makes for teaching, correct righteousness makes for spirit.

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Teachers are students, students are teachers. There is a lot more that can be asked about this dynamic but this is more about conscious dichotomy.

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Not sure what a spiritual teacher is as all knowledge and experience is spiritual.

 

It should be titled esoteric teacher  :D

 

But

 

To go along with the OP

 

The best spiritual teacher is life experience.

 

Having an actual teacher is someone who helps you to be aware feel and consider what you seen felt and observed from life experiences.

 

Life is truth and understanding it and following it makes you a master.

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The question is who is really there other than a chain of thoughts, sensations and so on compounded to a person?

 

So no right, no wrong, life happens spontaneously with no controllers at all.

 

Highest example is a conceptual designation of activity marked by the mind as 'good'.

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I never meet people like your lawyer. Maybe I should hang out in ashrams more.

I don't do yoga, but I've hung out at the Sivananda Ashram on Paradise Island because A. its in the Caribbean, Great food, good meditation and you meet some fascinating spiritual types.  <who are also ditching early morning yoga class for Starbucks.  >

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The question is who is really there other than a chain of thoughts, sensations and so on compounded to a person?

 

So no right, no wrong, life happens spontaneously with no controllers at all.

 

Highest example is a conceptual designation of activity marked by the mind as 'good'.

 

The infinite omnitude of infinity is never "other than" or "just such".

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