Feeling like a jerk

[CrunchyChocolate555]

In recent years I've really been trying to become a better person, and embody the qualities of someone who lives in service of others, who genuinely loves and cares for others and tries to better humanity and planet earth.

 

Especially since my what-I-believe-to-be "K" awakening in December, I have strived to make this my primary focus.. should my body transform or decay, I felt these guiding principles would at least keep me afloat and on the right path.

 

More recently though, as I have started to explore and open up to my "dark side", and exploring my "inner raskal" as Alan Watts would put it, I have found that part of me is a genuine asshole and has no remorse about it. There is a part of me that could care less what happens to others or to planet earth and that even bad things, which are just a manifestation of the collective unconscious and that it's OK to just watch things unfold without needing to bust my ass to make a positive change.

 

As a tangent, what is to be said about wu-wei and the collective unconscious? Action through non-action? How does one not harbour any guilt by passively sitting through all the bad things going on in the world?

 

I think this sort of inner exploration into one's dark side is a very healthy and necessary thing, but I think I'm going about it in a wrong way, as a sort of rebellion from trying too hard to be a "good guy" or a "saint" and utterly failing, because I was going nowhere in life and was simply giving all my power away in my social relations and not doing anyone any good by doing so.

 

So I am seeking honesty and balance, but I am quite disturbed by what I am finding inside myself. It is in seeking to be honest with myself that I have found that I am not a saint, and I am leaning towards no longer feeling guilty about this, and this is where there seems to be an inner conflict.

 

So this is where I'm torn. I no longer know where or how to draw the line. I don't know if what I wrote made any sense, but perhaps some of you can (hopefully) relate and we can spark a meaningful discussion.

[Maddie]

In recent years I've really been trying to become a better person, and embody the qualities of someone who lives in service of others, who genuinely loves and cares for others and tries to better humanity and planet earth.

 

Especially since my what-I-believe-to-be "K" awakening in December, I have strived to make this my primary focus.. should my body transform or decay, I felt these guiding principles would at least keep me afloat and on the right path.

 

More recently though, as I have started to explore and open up to my "dark side", and exploring my "inner raskal" as Alan Watts would put it, I have found that part of me is a genuine asshole and has no remorse about it. There is a part of me that could care less what happens to others or to planet earth and that even bad things, which are just a manifestation of the collective unconscious and that it's OK to just watch things unfold without needing to bust my ass to make a positive change.

 

As a tangent, what is to be said about wu-wei and the collective unconscious? Action through non-action? How does one not harbour any guilt by passively sitting through all the bad things going on in the world?

 

I think this sort of inner exploration into one's dark side is a very healthy and necessary thing, but I think I'm going about it in a wrong way, as a sort of rebellion from trying too hard to be a "good guy" or a "saint" and utterly failing, because I was going nowhere in life and was simply giving all my power away in my social relations and not doing anyone any good by doing so.

 

So I am seeking honesty and balance, but I am quite disturbed by what I am finding inside myself. It is in seeking to be honest with myself that I have found that I am not a saint, and I am leaning towards no longer feeling guilty about this, and this is where there seems to be an inner conflict.

 

So this is where I'm torn. I no longer know where or how to draw the line. I don't know if what I wrote made any sense, but perhaps some of you can (hopefully) relate and we can spark a meaningful discussion.

Well the key when doing mindfulness meditation is to observe what is in your mind but with out judgment. Also since some or many of the things that you do find make up your conditioning (not your true self) are not always very flattering you need to have a lot of loving-kindness and compassion for yourself, as you observer your thoughts.

 

Detachment is the key, and if you can't detach enough then self compassion.

[Stosh]

Being totally fine with both sides of your personality, is great wisdom, I am not there yet either.

It is only then that you have real choice in the matter, and so then it is the speaking of a true heart..

I believe in the depths of the true soul we each are happiest at harmony but that harmony still can meet sword with sword .

[voidisyinyang]

instead of focusing on morality I would focus on truth.

 

You say you are this or that - but who are you to say anything?

 

Just repeat I-I-I in the mind and any thoughts that arise are based on your I-thought and so search what is the source of the I-thought. Repeat I-I-I more and more to find out the real you.

 

And so who thinks about goodness or whatever - the I-thought but where does it come from? Keep repeating I-I-I and hold onto the I-thought and listen to the source of it.

 

Then what you experience will give you the answers you need since what you experience is the real you beyond any dualities of thought.

[CrunchyChocolate555]

But what if my truth, to others, might come across as being indifferent or even mean or hateful?

 

 

 

 

 

instead of focusing on morality I would focus on truth.

 

You say you are this or that - but who are you to say anything?

 

Just repeat I-I-I in the mind and any thoughts that arise are based on your I-thought and so search what is the source of the I-thought. Repeat I-I-I more and more to find out the real you.

 

And so who thinks about goodness or whatever - the I-thought but where does it come from? Keep repeating I-I-I and hold onto the I-thought and listen to the source of it.

 

Then what you experience will give you the answers you need since what you experience is the real you beyond any dualities of thought.

Edited May 12, 2013 by CrunchyChocolate555

[voidisyinyang]

But what if my truth, to others, might come across as being indifferent or even mean or hateful?

 

See that is your mind saying that but where does your mind come from?

 

If you really take your thoughts seriously then the truth is that the only thought that is the source of all your thoughts is the I-thought -- but when you are in deep dreamless sleep you're I-thought is also gone.

 

So the real you is the bliss love you experience in deep dreamless sleep. That is the truth.

 

So you just need to be honest with yourself - truly honest - with your mind -- don't be fooled by thoughts since they are not the real you.

 

haha.

[eye_of_the_storm]

I don't really believe in the "dark side" ( at a personal level... unless you are a demon lol)

No doubt I have flaws and am a work in progress... the "shadow" side meh.

I remember coming across such thinking... and asking myself shadow side? hmm?

So people start looking for a shadow side...

You start looking for it you will create it... a few actors have gone a little loopy after playing some dark roles? as you think so you become...like attracts like?

I believe anyhow...

Aim for the best... observe yourself + emotions + reactions + situations and how things can be better addressed...

Really just about being cool, calm, collected... a thoughtful responding... not getting dragged into things / STUCK etc... ideally? hhaha

I guess, you know.

Edited May 12, 2013 by White Wolf Running On Air

[Guest munky]

But when you say truth it is not actual truth as are everyone else's "truth" because all concepts of morality are ultimately not real. All of it depends on your mind and current state of being and so aim to go past mind and into simpleness and virtue.
I think its necessary to be honest with yourself but at the same time as you notice the dark side in yourself you can begin to stop having it control you whereas previously you may not have realised. I know what you mean when say it is a rebellion, but actually it is not either dark or light side, one or the other. It is about having both work together so you act from your light side, not letting the dark control your actions and thoughts while at the same time, the dark side supports the light as you begin to transform the darker energies inside yourself to the positive by continuously working on virtue as you have already being doing, only now you have more to work on.
You can watch your mind when you have negative thoughts and emotions beginning to stir up, like guilt for instance and aim to stay positive.
Another thing is to stop thinking about what annoys you or what you really like not to mention verbalising it to someone else as these are sort of attachments and the more you reinforce them, the more it will serve as a filter in your perception of the world. Stay neutral or false thinking develops, say for example everytime you see a child in the street the more your mind believes they are annoying then you instantly judge them as being annoying..

You probably dont need to strive too hard to be a saint or good guy to the point of unnaturalness but if you work on improving the darker aspects of yourself by being aware and discplined throughout everyday life, i would think you would begin to do genuine good effortlessly and begin to wu wei a little bit more. Good comes out of being pure, but if we are being ruled by heavier emotions and energies, trying to do good will be difficult and will seem very contrived.

Edited May 12, 2013 by munky

[Maddie]

But what if my truth, to others, might come across as being indifferent or even mean or hateful?

 

No matter what you do in life there will always be those who agree with you, disagree with you, and who don't care. "Truth" more often than naught is a point of view.

 

The meth addict on the corner may think your mean when he asks you for meth money if you don't give it to him.

 

If you were to give it to him, someone else might think you were bad for supporting his habit.

 

Of course you shouldn't try to go out of your way to be mean to others, but ultimately you need to find your own way, and thus the irony of me telling you to find your own way (the tao that can be named is not the tao) lol.

[eye_of_the_storm]

Naturalness

Naturalness (Chinese: 自然; pinyin: zìrán; Wade–Giles: tzu-jan; lit. "self-such") is regarded as a central value in Taoism.^[55] It describes the "primordial state" of all things^[56] as well as a basic character of the Tao^[57], and is usually associated with spontaneity and creativity.^[58][57] To attain naturalness, one has to identify with the Tao^[57]; this involves freeing oneself from selfishness and desire, and appreciating simplicity.^[55]

 

An often cited metaphor for naturalness is pu (simplified Chinese: 朴; traditional Chinese: 樸; pinyin: pǔ, pú; Wade–Giles: p'u; lit. "uncut wood"), the "uncarved block", which represents the "original nature... prior to the imprint of culture" of an individual.^[59] It is usually referred to as a state one returns to.^[60]

 

Three Treasures

The Three Treasures or Three Jewels (simplified Chinese: 三宝; traditional Chinese: 三寶; pinyin: sānbǎo) are basic virtues in Taoism comprising Compassion, Moderation, and Humility. They are also translated as kindness, simplicity (or the absence of excess), and modesty. Arthur Waley describes them as "[t]he three rules that formed the practical, political side of the author's teaching". He correlated the Three Treasures with "abstention from aggressive war and capital punishment", "absolute simplicity of living", and "refusal to assert active authority".^[61]

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taoism

 

good ole wiki haha

Edited May 12, 2013 by White Wolf Running On Air

[Jetsun]

Sounds like you are on the path to genuine maturity and truth, in my experience "negative" aspects of yourself are just parts of your psyche at their own legitimate relative levels of maturity, so they are not bad or evil or anything they are completely appropriate for the level they are at. For example its not bad for a child to be narcissistic, or for a teenager to be angry and self absorbed, and we all have these aspects of ourselves inside of us which all need love and acceptance.

 

The key I think is to keep integrating those aspects of yourself by just accepting them as they are while simultaneously keep growing by expanding your identity so it isn't dominated by more immature aspects.

[RiverSnake]

The best way I think to help others is by expanding are consciousness and raising our vibration. This effects everyone we come in contact with and you don't have to deal with the stickiness and confusion of "morality". The Intellect and Emotions are flawed and will steer us up a creek without a paddle.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

Edited May 12, 2013 by OldGreen

[manitou]

Please consider handling your newly discovered darker side as we recovering alcoholics do: When you realize that you screwed over someone, don't just kick yourself. Physically go to that person, if you can, and make a physical amend to them. If they don't accept it, it doesn't matter. It's your insides that you're trying to clear out. The more the amends hurt your ego, the better it is for your ultimate ego subjugation.

 

It is called the 'christ consciousness' when you can step aside from yourself and see yourself for what you really are, in a dispassionate way. We can't be truly loving (although I understand your attempts to do so) until we've cleared out the mess inside us, and only then can the sun shine outward. Everything up to that point is pretense, merely covering up what you're really feeling on the inside.

 

When I first started this clearing out process 31 years ago, I made a list of every possible character defect I could imagine, and then I assumed I had it to some degree. It seems to be easier to do it that way, because then your ego won't be trying so hard to defend itself and deflect blame.

 

It's for this very reason, this clearing process that you're going through, that masters will tell you to Know Thyself. They understand that in order to see things clearly, our inner lens must be spotless. It is a long process, life will bring you 'fresh opportunities' all the time to file down the rough edges. Once you've identified the rough edge, as someone above said, you are starting to separate from it. Once you see it, whether through meditation or the same type of 'problems' coming to you over and over (which means there is some character defect inside you attracting the negative manifestation) you have the opportunity to direct your thinking to the opposite, if necessary.

 

This process you're undergoing will be a lifelong journey. The big chunks are usually discovered at the beginning of the search, but as time goes on the defects get subtler and subtler. This is not to say the subtle defects are easier to remove - they're often harder to detect and deeply rooted.

 

True love is experienced more and more as your inner lens gets clearer.

[3bob]

no one has to go about exploring their dark side per-se since it will show up at any and all opportunities if one allows or gives in to it, although one does have to spend "X" amount of time working on understanding same so as not to or divided by same. ("a divided house can not stand")

 

Practice for unity with the "root" or divine spirit, for a twisted practice of unity against the Tao has no root of its own "And what is against Tao will soon cease to be" TTC, 30

[liminal_luke]

ChrunchyChocolate555,

 

It's very admirable, of course, to strive to be a better person, to be kind and in service to others, etc. But there can be a "dark side," as you put it, to all this focus on being good as well that's worth considering. For some, the need to be good is rooted in self-hate. If you hate yourself (and really most of us do at least to a tiny extent) than it's not enough to be an average person; we need to be saintly to compensate for, and keep at bay, our feelings of worthlessness.

 

This might not apply to you, but since you're in a space where you're willing to confront your own darkness, I wanted to put it out there as a possibility.

 

Liminal

Edited May 12, 2013 by liminal_luke

[Lemon_Squeezy]

hi crunchy,

 

I think its perfectly natural and healthy to be where you are at right now. It sounds like you are evolving, and just see the selfish side of yourself that we all have, but few acknowledge.

 

 

How you proceed and choose to frame your self-insight may be important. If you let it get to you and truly believe you are a bad person, it will make future progress difficult. It may be best just to let go (wu-wei), accept and embrace it, but choose to focus on the good things you can do for others.

 

You said in the past you gave away your power in social situations. I bet if you were in social situations where you were with like-minded, soulful generos peopel, this wouldnt be an issue. If you have free time, joining a volunteer group or yoga class could really bernefit you I think.

 

As a tangent, what is to be said about wu-wei and the collective unconscious? Action through non-action? How does one not harbour any guilt by passively sitting through all the bad things going on in the world?

 

How do you not?? There's too many bad things going on. And wu wei is what we need to do more of, so if anything you are setting an example for youir fellow man

Edited May 13, 2013 by Lemon_Squeezy

[xor]

I've had that magic moment of realizing how much of an asshole I've sometimes(edit:make that often!) been. It's part of the process. Only when you are aware of your faults can you begin to correct them.

Edited May 14, 2013 by Guest