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nantogph

what's left?

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Acording to Taoist teachings, one's purpose should be to reach a state where all earthly attachements are gonne, to become a void. If so, after reaching said state, what's left? Just peace? How is someone who has done it?

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Letting attachments go and the void state are not necessarily linked together, but its easy for the mind to want to stitch everything together so that things appear to make sense when a more preferable attitude would be to see each principle on its own merit. For example, letting go of attachments - you can spend a few years just to investigate and really penetrate into the meaning of that, during which time all your energy and focus is simply directed to this one thought. Then one day you will fully understand what letting go of attachment really means.

 

After you have gained this insight, then you can move on to understand what voidness really means. Spend another few years contemplating that to arrive at a doubtless, confident, experiential knowing what it is (to you).

 

Then see if these two are linked or are they distinct, or maybe an admixture of each. Doing so means you are taking your questions out of the intellectual into the realm of personal experience, which is what sensible cultivation, in its most practical form, is about.

 

This approach is recommended over and above the one that was presented in your OP because no matter what feedback you get, you will only grasp whatever is said to you on a conceptual level, which, truthfully, will not lead you too far.

 

Moreover, what others say is only useful exclusively for their own path. Your own discoveries are essentially whats crucial for your own cultivation.

Edited by C T
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if earthly attachments are gone, then work with heavenly attachments, if they are gone too, then you can start over again since you can now see more.

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It may be helpful to not think of a void as an absence, or nothingness, but as the very essential substance of life.

 

So reaching the "void" may better be viewed as when one owns being is refined and refined, until your essence is the same as the deep substance of life.

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if you want peace and even bliss... just eat a raw vegan diet...fresh fruit and vegetables... isn't so difficult or esoteric...

99% are already living the void... lol

...

Edited by eye_of_the_storm
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Acording to Taoist teachings, one's purpose should be to reach a state where all earthly attachements are gonne, to become a void. If so, after reaching said state, what's left? Just peace? How is someone who has done it?

 

IMO what's left is exactly the same as what started.

The difference is one's relationship with it and with oneself.

Zhuangzi's parable about the empty boat is a good one to ponder and embody.

 

The Empty Boat

Zhuangzi

He who rules men lives in confusion;
He who is ruled by men lives in sorrow.

Yao therefore desired

Neither to influence others

Nor to be influenced by them.

The way to get clear of confusion

And free of sorrow

Is to live with Tao

In the land of the great Void.

 

If a man is crossing a river

And an empty boat collides with his own skiff,

Even though he be a bad-tempered man

He will not become very angry.

But if he sees a man in the boat,

He will shout at him to steer clear.

If the shout is not heard, he will shout again,

And yet again, and begin cursing.

And all because there is somebody in the boat.

Yet if the boat were empty.

He would not be shouting, and not angry.

 

If you can empty your own boat

Crossing the river of the world,

No one will oppose you,

No one will seek to harm you.

 

The straight tree is the first to be cut down,

The spring of clear water is the first to be drained dry.

If you wish to improve your wisdom

And shame the ignorant,

To cultivate your character

And outshine others;

A light will shine around you

As if you had swallowed the sun and the moon:

You will not avoid calamity.

 

A wise man has said:

"He who is content with himself

Has done a worthless work.

Achievement is the beginning of failure.

Fame is beginning of disgrace."

 

Who can free himself from achievement

And from fame, descend and be lost

Amid the masses of men?

He will flow like Tao, unseen,

He will go about like Life itself

With no name and no home.

Simple is he, without distinction.

To all appearances he is a fool.

His steps leave no trace. He has no power.

He achieves nothing, has no reputation.

Since he judges no one

No one judges him.

Such is the perfect man:

His boat is empty.

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What's left is "Peace & Contentment". We are free to live spontaneously according to our true nature.

 

Just peace only, peace may be contentment in humanity but peace is all in the Taoist cultivation.

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Acording to Taoist teachings, one's purpose should be to reach a state where all earthly attachements are gonne, to become a void. If so, after reaching said state, what's left? Just peace? How is someone who has done it?

 

Their final blazon, and to prove

Our almost-instinct almost true:

What will survive of us is love.

( Larkin)

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Just peace only, peace may be contentment in humanity but peace is all in the Taoist cultivation.

Well, I am going to wish upon you contentment as well, just for the hell of it.

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Well, I am going to wish upon you contentment as well, just for the hell of it.

Contentment, as i understand, is a key virtue to aim for in Taoist cultivation. Peace and contentment are like bride and groom - often paired together, but sometimes they go their separate ways :D

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My understanding of Taoist intention, is clarity.. through which, resonant appropriateness, sometimes known as natural harmony, is revealed.. peace and contentment are by-products of clarity..

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the whole aim is peace?

 

That would be inner peace. Total satisfaction with what and who you are. Total acceptance of your condition within your environment.

 

Easy you say?

 

Then why are there so many miserable people on the planet? Why do Buddhists keep telling us that we are suffering?

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That would be inner peace. Total satisfaction with what and who you are. Total acceptance of your condition within your environment.

 

Easy you say?

 

Then why are there so many miserable people on the planet? Why do Buddhists keep telling us that we are suffering?

 

I think you missed the point... peace is easily achievable by the masses...

 

But you raise a good point: why is there misery and suffering? :)

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That would be inner peace. Total satisfaction with what and who you are. Total acceptance of your condition within your environment.

 

Easy you say?

 

Then why are there so many miserable people on the planet? Why do Buddhists keep telling us that we are suffering?

 

Go ask a married person....!!!

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That would be inner peace. Total satisfaction with what and who you are. Total acceptance of your condition within your environment.

 

Easy you say?

 

Then why are there so many miserable people on the planet? Why do Buddhists keep telling us that we are suffering?

 

The Buddha is a devil.

 

The Buddha creates suffering

 

The Buddha said "you are what you think!" .... then he tells people... you are suffering, life is suffering... what a mind f*** eh?

Edited by eye_of_the_storm

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Wellll if you're attached to suffering how can it be anything other than a part of you?

 

You are happy - it doesn't mean you're only happy. It's a part of you.

You are suffering - it doesn't mean you're only suffering. It's a part of you.

 

If you don't identify with it then it is not longer a part of you. Maybe it's a pretty intense feeling. Still, you can chose not to identify it even if it's taking up all of your attention.

 

Inner peace is not something you have. It's receptive. Without state. It's not the same as happiness. It's merely a state free from conditional attachment whereby you are free to attach temporarily to whatever you want. Sounds nice, right?

 

The question of what's left is obvious when you start working with refinement. After some practice things that at one point would be bothersome just bounce off. Sometimes you don't even notice these things anymore. Sometimes you do, at which point you are free to chose whether you react or not. This just continues until there is nothing left that sticks of its own accord. What I'm talking about is VERRRRYY ordinary. You can't be too quick to dismiss it for mystical experiences.

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peace is when you stop filling your body with garage and eat as nature intended and the natural light of the cosmos will flow through you... the natural state of all things is peace/ bliss/ harmony/ creativity ... many have corrupted the temple/body totally though and are like a rusty spark plug... disconnected and unable to spark...

it really is very simple... no mediation for 50 years... just eat properly and you will feel gooooodd.... and when you feel good.... you can feel goood for other people... and then everyone starts feeling gooood and everything becomes goood

Physical health is the foundation of happiness and world peace... healthy body = healthy mind = healthy spirit

:D

Have some MANGOES ... do these not shine like the SUN? These Mangoes are very very happy :D :D :D

calypsomangoes.jpg?MOD=AJPERES&CACHEID=2


eating mangoes = en light en ment

Edited by eye_of_the_storm
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peace is when you stop filling your body with garage and eat as nature intended and the natural light of the cosmos will flow through you... the natural state of all things is peace/ bliss/ harmony/ creativity ... many have corrupted the temple/body totally though and are like a rusty spark plug... disconnected and unable to spark...

 

it really is very simple... no mediation for 50 years... just eat properly and you will feel gooooodd.... and when you feel good.... you can feel goood for other people... and then everyone starts feeling gooood and everything becomes goood

 

Physical health is the foundation of happiness and world peace... healthy body = healthy mind = healthy spirit

 

:D

Reading some of the views you have presented, it does not appear that your diet choice has made any impact on your outlook about things in general, so no, i for one will not buy the above assertion that veganism alone is sufficiently wholesome for the spirit.

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Reading some of the views you have presented, it does not appear that your diet choice has made any impact on your outlook about things in general, so no, i for one will not buy the above assertion that veganism alone is sufficiently wholesome for the spirit.

 

 

you have too strong of an attachment to Buddha

 

and you believe "spirituality" is about being meek, docile, without passion

 

all these facades of what a "good/spiritual person" is

 

I know people who speak and pretend to be good... but fill their bodies with the stolen flesh and blood of other sentient creatures... demons with a smile...

 

my words are quite light in comparison to what some of the ancient sages said about similar things

 

you can be happy, peaceful, powerful and purposeful

 

maybe not in Buddhism though

 

CT doesn't believe physical healthy = happiness... ok...

 

Such a simple and immediate solution ignored...

 

Many humans want to suffer that is the truth... without that they have nothing

 

you know if the majority of people on this planet went vegetarian/ vegan there would be enough food to feed the entire planet twice over... i guess that isn't "sufficiently wholesome for the spirit." ...

 

Maybe if I just stare at a wall everything will be solved...

 

Or maybe Buddha will feed these people?

 

O Buddha I am nothing... feed me

 

monk-bowing-down.jpg

 

Edited by eye_of_the_storm

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The Buddha is a devil.

The Buddha creates suffering

The Buddha said "you are what you think!" .... then he tells people... you are suffering, life is suffering... what a mind f*** eh?

'Suffering' isn't a great translation for 'dukkha' because it implies that nihilistic, pessimistic view of things - I can't think of a good one word term. Imagine if wu wei was routinely translated as 'loafing about in your slippers'. That would give people a wrong idea that Taoism is all about being lazy, avoiding action. Similar translation issue here with Buddhism implying nihilism.

 

Think of it more like 'the stress of going against wu wei', that would be a more Taoist way of phrasing the same thing. Or in Zhuangzi's parable of the empty boat that Steve shared on the first page, the dukkha an unawakened person has is like when the boat isn't empty.

 

...you can be happy, peaceful, powerful and purposeful

maybe not in Buddhism though...

¿Que? You're just listing things that Buddhist practices have increased in me. ;)

Edited by Seeker of Wisdom
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