A simple question on the human soul

[Lindelani Mnisi]

what does the human soul look like? I've heard of a few variations, like that satanic star(I only say that because I forget the name of it), a tree, etc

[baiqi]

Wrong question: it doesn't look like anything.

 

Rather ask: what does it feel like?

[三江源]

Wrong question: it doesn't look like anything.

 

Rather ask: what does it feel like?

How do you know it doesnt look like anything?

[Flolfolil]

how do you know you can feel it? it is totally possible that everything you ever feel is completely of the body

[Seeker of Wisdom]

There is no soul. Have you heard of anatta - 'no-self'? People are a fluid combination of 5 processes (the skhandas), none of which are complete on their own: form, sensation, conception, volition, and consciousness. There is no one substantial thing, like a soul, which is 'I'.

 

If you analyse yourself, you will just find the flux of these processes, with no soul owning them. When we die, instead of us being an eternal soul which takes up a new body, it's more like the latter 4 skhandas continue whirling and integrate with a new form skhanda. Instead of pouring water from one glass to another, it's like a river flowing from one town into the next.

 

People who think they're feeling their soul are actually focusing on consciousness or a sublime mental state, and misinterpreting the experience.

 

Am I making sense? Anatta is tricky to wrap your head around, but really it's quite simple.

 

Even if there were a soul... like the mind and consciousness, it wouldn't have any sort of form. No shape, size, colour or appearance. Imagine saying 'sadness is 9 inches long' - it's nonsensical.

Edited May 25, 2013 by Seeker of the Self

[三江源]

lots of theories!

[Seeker of Wisdom]

Fortunately, we can cultivate and get the experience.

[Jetsun]

There is no soul. Have you heard of anatta - 'no-self'? People are a fluid combination of 5 processes (the skhandas), none of which are complete on their own: form, sensation, conception, volition, and consciousness. There is no one substantial thing, like a soul, which is 'I'.

 

If you analyse yourself, you will just find the flux of these processes, with no soul owning them. When we die, instead of us being an eternal soul which takes up a new body, it's more like the latter 4 skhandas continue whirling and integrate with a new form skhanda. Instead of pouring water from one glass to another, it's like a river flowing from one town into the next.

 

People who think they're feeling their soul are actually focusing on consciousness or a sublime mental state, and misinterpreting the experience.

 

Am I making sense? Anatta is tricky to wrap your head around, but really it's quite simple.

 

Even if there were a soul... like the mind and consciousness, it wouldn't have any sort of form. No shape, size, colour or appearance. Imagine saying 'sadness is 9 inches long' - it's nonsensical.

 

Even the Buddhists say that you become a subtle body when your physical body dies, well some do. Something keeps your consciousness together from lifetime to lifetime.

[三江源]

Fortunately, we can cultivate and get the experience.

You are so right.

 

I am immensely grateful for that.

 

What I wonder is wether people manifest in their own practice exactly what they believe.. so that the beliefs limit the practice.

[ChiDragon]

how do you know you can feel it? it is totally possible that everything you ever feel is completely of the body

 

Your soul manipulates the body. Without the soul you cannot feel your body is because the feeling is from the soul.

[三江源]

well, in taoism of course we have organ spirits and shen.

 

the hun and the po. what a dynamic duo.

[rene]

What I wonder is wether people manifest in their own practice exactly what they believe.. so that the beliefs limit the practice.

 

Yes...and whether a fixed path/practice limits the beliefs, understandings and experience.

 

 

warm regards

[johndoe2012]

.

Edited August 18, 2013 by chris d

[johndoe2012]

.

Edited August 18, 2013 by chris d

[effilang]

How do you fine folks explain the Yang Shen and Yin Shen then?

Or are we all just practicing alchemy for shits n giggles...

Edited May 25, 2013 by effilang

[johndoe2012]

.

Edited August 18, 2013 by chris d

[Seeker of Wisdom]

Even the Buddhists say that you become a subtle body when your physical body dies, well some do. Something keeps your consciousness together from lifetime to lifetime.

 

That may well be true. Still not a soul though.

[Lindelani Mnisi]

I think I prefer believing in that there is a soul...makes things easier for me, but thanks

[Jetsun]

That may well be true. Still not a soul though.

 

There may not be such a thing as an eternal soul but there are different levels of truth. Souls may be impermanent and exist on the subtle level. On the ultimate level nothing exists independently but that doesn't mean you should ignore conventional truths. Try tell a Shaman who does soul healing and soul retrievals every day that souls don't exist when they spend most of their life interacting with them directly and guide them where to go when they die etc.

[Flolfolil]

Try tell a Shaman who does soul healing and soul retrievals every day that souls don't exist when they spend most of their life interacting with them directly and guide them where to go when they die etc.

you have psychology in your interest list so i would think you would understand where i am coming from here. it is possible that all experiences of the soul are just experiences of ones own subconscious.

 

i have yet to see evidence for the existence of a soul, but everyone is welcome to try and convince me. right now it just seems like a matter of opinion to me

 

and this coming from someone who believes the all is one theory! imagine that

Edited May 25, 2013 by Flolfolil

[Maddie]

There is no soul. Have you heard of anatta - 'no-self'? People are a fluid combination of 5 processes (the skhandas), none of which are complete on their own: form, sensation, conception, volition, and consciousness. There is no one substantial thing, like a soul, which is 'I'.

 

If you analyse yourself, you will just find the flux of these processes, with no soul owning them. When we die, instead of us being an eternal soul which takes up a new body, it's more like the latter 4 skhandas continue whirling and integrate with a new form skhanda. Instead of pouring water from one glass to another, it's like a river flowing from one town into the next.

 

People who think they're feeling their soul are actually focusing on consciousness or a sublime mental state, and misinterpreting the experience.

 

Am I making sense? Anatta is tricky to wrap your head around, but really it's quite simple.

 

Even if there were a soul... like the mind and consciousness, it wouldn't have any sort of form. No shape, size, colour or appearance. Imagine saying 'sadness is 9 inches long' - it's nonsensical.

 

well, in taoism of course we have organ spirits and shen.

 

the hun and the po. what a dynamic duo.

 

Anatta has been at the forefront of my mind the past couple days as I'm trying to wrap my mind around it. I'm also trying to reconcile the remaining 4 Skanda's with the notion of Hun in Taoism.

 

To me what it seems like is that the consciousness that survives death in Buddhism is similar to the Hun soul in Taoism as it is the part of us that survives death. So what I'm wondering is if the term "Hun" is simply the Taoist label for the 4 Skandas.

[Jetsun]

you have psychology in your interest list so i would think you would understand where i am coming from here. it is possible that all experiences of the soul are just experiences of ones own subconscious.

 

i have yet to see evidence for the existence of a soul, but everyone is welcome to try and convince me. right now it just seems like a matter of opinion to me

 

and this coming from someone who believes the all is one theory! imagine that

 

Yeah it's possible, if a person makes more of their subconscious conscious then more of their soul is present, but if parts are missing then they need soul retrieval, but different people use different models. But the existence of the soul has been debated for thousands of years so I doubt anyone here is going to be able to present proof either way.

 

Even in Buddhist history where they say there is no soul you have masters and even the Buddha himself who worked hard through many lifetimes to develop their spiritual understanding to gain enlightenment, which I see no different from the early Christian concept that you work from life to lifetime on your soul to gain union with God in the kingdom of heaven. It seems like even Buddhists have to go through the process of having a soul to get to a place of no soul even if they don't use that exact term to describe the process.

 

In many Western paths you work on your soul in order to be conscious after death in the astral realm so you can direct where you go instead of just being swept where momentum takes you, so in that path the concept of the soul is useful, but if you are aiming for all out enlightenment in this life right now then the idea of a soul could be a barrier.

[thetaoiseasy]

Edited May 25, 2013 by thetaoiseasy

[Creation]

There is no soul. Have you heard of anatta - 'no-self'? People are a fluid combination of 5 processes (the skhandas), none of which are complete on their own: form, sensation, conception, volition, and consciousness. There is no one substantial thing, like a soul, which is 'I'.

 

If you analyse yourself, you will just find the flux of these processes, with no soul owning them. When we die, instead of us being an eternal soul which takes up a new body, it's more like the latter 4 skhandas continue whirling and integrate with a new form skhanda. Instead of pouring water from one glass to another, it's like a river flowing from one town into the next.

 

People who think they're feeling their soul are actually focusing on consciousness or a sublime mental state, and misinterpreting the experience.

 

Am I making sense? Anatta is tricky to wrap your head around, but really it's quite simple.

 

Even if there were a soul... like the mind and consciousness, it wouldn't have any sort of form. No shape, size, colour or appearance. Imagine saying 'sadness is 9 inches long' - it's nonsensical.

Honestly, I think Buddhist harping on about how there is no "soul" can be confusing to spiritual seekers. The Buddha taught that there is no permanent unchanging essence, but that is not the only definition of soul. If you define "soul" to be the most subtle aspect of a "person", this does exist in Buddhism and is called alayavijnana. But it is not thought of as a permanent unchanging essence, and therefore does not contradict the teachings of the Buddha. Moreover, the Daoist idea of higher and lower souls use yet another definition of soul, as some kind of spiritual aspect of a person, but not necessarily the "highest", just a particular one, which is why in that system there is more than one soul.

[baiqi]

How do you know it doesnt look like anything?

Because it is formless.

 

When we talk about the soul, it is about the "heart" (not just the physical organ). It is about what you feel deeply. It is close to the Tao, which doesn't have any shape.