Alchemy, is it real ??

[Antares]

40 minutes ago, 心神 ~ said:

Would that suggest that the practice of internal alchemy (depending on what that looks like) is incompatible with original Taoist "wu-wei" philosophy?

A few days I spoke to a man who thinks he does neidan and he stated the same westernized BS that Dao accepts and includes everything and thus the shit and pill of immortality ARE THE SAME bcoz Dao does not judge and deny anything and one needs just to flow with everything, and this would be Wu-Wei. This is state and one needs to do a lot of work before can reach it.

Doing precedes non doing.  

[Annnon]

smoking weed has nothing to do with spirituality

 

[Forestgreen]

1 hour ago, 心神 ~ said:

 

If the two are not compatible, why is internal alchemy attributed to Taoist thought and practice?

Because it is such a cool practice. 

Or, there are other texts than DaoDeJing, where wuwei philosophy is less prominent. 

The yellow court scriptures comes to mind.

1 hour ago, 心神 ~ said:

Who developed internal alchemy and why, and was their pursuit "Taoist" in nature, or a subversion?

Their pursuit was a specific spiritual path. There are quite a few different daoist traditions, developed with different goals in mind, some of these traditions use the term neidan today. 

At least one of the methods did most likely not originate from within the chinese daoist tradition. 

[Nungali]

13 hours ago, Antares said:

Sorry, I don't think Western alchemy is still valid.

 

That' just westernized BS. What should die is your ignorance and NEGATIVE QI we have. You are NOT ur negative thoughts and emotions. And yes there is smth that can purify you, but I am not specialist in medicine so I wont comment it in re to external alchemy.

 

 

 

Ahhhh .... no . Its just that you do not understand it . It is based on observing the processes in nature .  

 

13 hours ago, Antares said:

But I believe it should work similarly to internal alchemy bcoz it is def-ly based on the same principles. How you can purify urself from impurities? There must be smth that has pure Yang and pure Yin qualities and then making you more and more Yang. Yang is life and prosperity, Yin is death and degradation.

 

 

13 hours ago, Antares said:

 

But this is not DYING and ROTTING, it is the process of ascension and expansion. I would say it is purification ans refinement but not death and decay.

 

I said it was a stage .  The above bolded is the next stage . 

 

 

 

13 hours ago, Antares said:

So just awareness is not Alchemy.

 

 

Who said it was ?  

 

 

13 hours ago, Antares said:

 

You can be Yin Spirit and have awareness but very shallow one. May be they have they own Alchemy I dunno but it is not we are looking for. We need to know precise steps and concepts what and how to do, how to prevent degradation and death 

 

You cant ... it is a stage in the nature of life  .  You are going to degrade and die , no matter how much you rage personally or on line about it . 

 

However you can extend and make better the stage before that . 

[Nungali]

7 hours ago, Annnon said:

smoking weed has nothing to do with spirituality

 

 

Aha ... your field of information needs expanding ... again  !  

 

Do you know what a Sadhu is ?  Specifically Naga Sadhus and specifically at Kumbha Mela and Diwali festivals .    

[ChiDragon]

On 9/7/2025 at 6:37 AM, Stream said:

So is it possible that there are medicine pills that can help in cleansing the body of impurities??

No, sorry, no such medicine pills have invented yet. It is not that I am aware of. Anyway!

Edited 21 hours ago by ChiDragon

[Forestgreen]

4 hours ago, Nungali said:

 

Who said it was?

Silent thunder:

 

"Awareness (the experience of  being) itself is Alchemy."

[Forestgreen]

4 hours ago, Nungali said:

 

I said it was a stage . 

The worst thing when comparing traditions is that we have to understand how terms are defined in that tradition. Which is funny, there was just some posts about how definitions of terms were a bad thing. 😁

[Nungali]

 

Which is why I asked the people that are talking eastern alchemy to define what it is , but it was ignored . Instead  ......     argue . 

 

And they dont seem to want to know what the western definition is . Instead .....  argue .  

 

 

 

[Neirong]

13 hours ago, Antares said:

that Dao accepts and includes everything and thus the shit and pill of immortality ARE THE SAME bcoz Dao does not judge and deny anything and one needs just to flow with everything, and this would be Wu-Wei.

A lot of people, I would say certainly not a minority, are in cultivation and "esoteric practices" purely for their egos.
That feeling of being or thinking yourself to be special, despite any internal flaws. You could be obese, sitting on a couch drinking beer all day, but because you are a member of a "prominent" internal arts school, and realized the "truth" of enlightenment, you are still the chosen one. No need to change yourself at all. Your Dao accepts all imperfection. Your bald, obese, tattooed all over, cigar-smoking, drug addict teacher, who is also a superpowerful secret martial arts master (that never once fought in his life) and hidden sage with wisdom pearls putting bs generator to shame, is once again proving it for you.
 

With such a mentality, it will be impossible to make any progress - the cultivation path is tough and unforgiving; that is why it is common to see people practicing for 30-40 years with no real gain or siddhis.
It's wild to me that people ask how to check the MCO status of a person, especially when they are supposed to be a lifetime practitioner of "internal arts".
 

If everyone is special, then nobody is special.
 

-------------------------------------

About alchemy
 

If someone is unaware (ignorant) of astral travel and the spiritual world, they might assume that common descriptions of astral travel, such as teleportation, phasing through walls, or levitation, refer to physical reality.

Similarly, alchemy is, in most cases, an internal process rather than an external one. It involves the transmutation of the self into a perfect being, not the creation and consumption of a physical elixir.

Esoteric texts were typically written and shared in cryptic forms to ensure that only those with proper access to the tradition, guided by a qualified teacher, having necessary keys to decipher information could gain value from them. Others would misinterpret these texts and, for example, concoct a mercury-laden pill, irreversibly poisoning themselves.

When it comes to physical pills, even if you find a legitimate source - caution is necessary due to the risk of heavy metals and other toxic substances exposure. Many herbal supplements, particularly those sourced from China, may contain dangerous levels of lead, arsenic, or other harmful heavy metals.

[Sherman Krebbs]

35 minutes ago, Forestgreen said:

The worst thing when comparing traditions is that we have to understand how terms are defined in that tradition. Which is funny, there was just some posts about how definitions of terms were a bad thing

 

Defining experiential things in words is impossible.  For example, define what the color blue looks like.  Not just "it is the color of the sky," or " its a certain wave length of electromagnetic energy, but try to define in words what it looks like in the abstract. The best you can do to convey a definition of an experience is by someone experiencing the thing and then giving it name.   Metaphors can also convey some meaning of experiential things--blue is calm, serene, ethereal, peaceful, cold--but then again those are only useful if the other person has experienced it.   

 

most of the irrational argument on this site is from narcissists (they are easy to spot), claiming that an something someone experienced was turquoise, and not the cerulean blue that only they have the ability to see.   

[Sanity Check]

22 hours ago, Nungali said:

 

I had success with silver treatments ... not pills though ' a tonic'  ... I know it can be risky but I made it myself to make sure and got the required right color in the end product . Out of curiosity I bought some , could not tell the quality as it was in a colored bottle  so I tipped some out .... nope ! That was the color the instructions warned me about !   I used it in conjunction with blood electrification . 

 

But again this is not alchemy ... not western alchemy anyway . 

 

What is the definition of eastern alchemy ? 

 

 

I guess I might say western alchemy is Sir Isaac Newton exposing himself to toxic levels of mercury attempting to refine a philosopher's stone (elixir).

 

While eastern alchemy is a legendary unicorn proprietary intellectual property that is 100% unavailable to 99.9% of people.

 

Eastern alchemy is like winning gamblers. 

 

Everyone tries to discuss what leads to consistent winning in gambling.

 

With nearly all of their conversation failing to amount to more than idle speculation.

[Master Logray]

If eastern alchemy worked, there would not have been eastern internal alchemy.  

[damdao]

Even today there are lineages of external alchemy, medical branch https://classicalchinesemedicine.org/conversations-with-the-salt-doctor/

[Forestgreen]

10 hours ago, Sherman Krebbs said:

 

Defining experiential things in words is impossible.  

I wrote that we have to understand how terms are defined.

So "alchemy " could be more specified as neidan, and defined as the process of reversal from postheavento preheaven energetics. That definition could be furter elaborated with inclusion criteria and exclusion criteria: In this practice we do this and not that. 

With ( insert term here) we mean (internal result), and not (the external substance or imaginary beast) that we used as a simili. 

And here, your comment finally makes sense in this context: Some of the internal results are hard to describe,  but sometimes it is just the teacher that is unwilling to describe it. 

[Annnon]

16 hours ago, Nungali said:

 

Aha ... your field of information needs expanding ... again  !  

 

Do you know what a Sadhu is ?  Specifically Naga Sadhus and specifically at Kumbha Mela and Diwali festivals .    

 

but why you mentioning it, they don't smoke weed to reach enlightnment, that's what I'm saying

 

weed has nothing to do with spirituality, that's just twisted, people use spirituality as an excuse to smoke weed

Edited 6 hours ago by Annnon

[Nungali]

17 hours ago, Sanity Check said:

 

 

I guess I might say western alchemy is Sir Isaac Newton exposing himself to toxic levels of mercury attempting to refine a philosopher's stone (elixir).

 

That is right in that is what you might say .

 

But I was hoping for THE definition .    No one seems to want to approach this .... either that or their is total ignorance about it . 

 

 

17 hours ago, Sanity Check said:

 

While eastern alchemy is a legendary unicorn proprietary intellectual property that is 100% unavailable to 99.9% of people.

 

Eastern alchemy is like winning gamblers. 

 

Everyone tries to discuss what leads to consistent winning in gambling.

 

With nearly all of their conversation failing to amount to more than idle speculation.