"may all beings be happy" context?

[old3bob]

30 minutes ago, forestofclarity said:

 

Because I don't understand it. 

 

some understand other far reaching things but not a plain as day question

[old3bob]

37 minutes ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

it is like watching someone very thirsty and begging for water, and then pushing away the water when it is presented.  repeatedly.

 

 

that sure sounds like is a high horse you keep hammering on or deflecting with...Don't you think most of us older folks have come across all of that stuff 40-50 years ago with understandings that are valid for us?

[BigSkyDiamond]

11 minutes ago, old3bob said:

 

that sure sounds like is a high horse you keep hammering on or deflecting with...Don't you think most of us older folks have come across all of that stuff 40-50 years ago with understandings that are valid for us?

 

so then if the valid understanding after many decades is dismissing core foundational spiritual prinicples, then why ask questions about the context of Buddhism? 

 

And within the framework of your own established valid understanding, what is your response to "evil in the material world."  Or again within your own path and your own framework, how does a master in that framework respond?   Who are your heroes and mentors and role models with regards to that?

 

Edited Sunday at 09:11 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[liminal_luke]

Charismatic psychiatrist Phil Stutz, the subject of a recent documentary on Netflix, teaches his patients how to use a "tool" he calls Active Love.  ACTIVE LOVE — THE TOOLS.  In brief, the tool involves sending feelings of love to people who have mistreated you or made you angry.  As you might imagine, I don´t use this one very much.  When people make me angry, I prefer to think of them breaking their legs or getting lost in a blizzard without a warm jacket.  Phil would probably tell me that my negative fantasies of revenge keep me stuck.  As hard as it is to send love to "bad" people, it´s precisely this counterintuitive move that could free me.  

 

May All People Be Happy (especially those who don´t deserve it).  

[Lairg]

Is there a difference between happiness and joy?

 

 

[BigSkyDiamond]

 

12 minutes ago, Lairg said:

Is there a difference between happiness and joy?

 

Yes. 

Secular psychology sees it for example as:   "Happiness is typically a more fleeting emotion, often sparked by a particular moment or event that brings a sense of excitement or exhilaration. Joy, on the other hand, is a more long-lasting state of being, characterized by contentment and satisfaction with life overall. "

 

Different sacred traditions may view it differently.  Some see "happiness" as an emotion which is dependent upon external conditions and events.  While joy is a state of being and an inner state, stemming from internal  sources.  It is not reliant upon or dependent upon external circumstances.

 

 

Edited Sunday at 09:28 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[BigSkyDiamond]

I rather like this (from Psychology Today):  "But happiness is not joy because joy is not external, it can't be bought and it is not conditional on someone else's behavior. In fact, joy is not contingent on anything in order to exist. "

[BigSkyDiamond]

Sandra Brown writes, "Her joy came from deeply held spiritual beliefs but it also came from a place even beyond that. Joy comes when you make peace with who you are, where you are, why you are, and who you are not with. When you need nothing more than your truth and the love of a good God to bring peace, then you have settled into the abiding joy that is not rocked by relationships. It's not rocked by anything."

[old3bob]

43 minutes ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

 

so then if the valid understanding after many decades is dismissing core foundational spiritual prinicples, then why ask questions about the context of Buddhism? 

 

And within the framework of your own established valid understanding, what is your response to "evil in the material world."  Or again within your own path and your own framework, how does a master in that framework respond?   Who are your heroes and mentors and role models with regards to that?

 

 

ask to see what correlations there may be in various forms of Buddhism.  Btw, any dismissing is in your head.  Btw #2 I've already given a few examples in this string of "role models or heroes" that have largely gone ignored or deflected here or there with high stepping or more holy than thou type come backs.

Edited Sunday at 09:48 PM by old3bob

[BigSkyDiamond]

1 hour ago, old3bob said:

Btw, any dismissing is in your head.  Btw #2 I've already given a few examples in this string of "role models or heroes" that have largely gone ignored or deflected here or there

 

you have mentioned :  Jesus; Rama and Ravana; "Buddhism and Bon fierce guardians."

Are those the examples given of heroes and role models for you?  So then In your own understanding, path, and framework what would they do?  What behavior and approach is it of theirs that you admire, revere, hold in high regard, and seek to emulate from the masters?

 

Edited Sunday at 10:47 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[BigSkyDiamond]

5 hours ago, old3bob said:

what did Jesus  (or what any spiritual master would)  do when dealing with evil

 

well, Jesus said:

"But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you"

[BigSkyDiamond]

6 hours ago, old3bob said:

do you truly understand evil?

 

understanding of evil differs, depending on the context, depending on the path, depending on the person, depending on the framework or belief system.

 

as stated in an earlier post, there is a "valid understanding" for you.

so too are there different valid understandings that others hold.

 

the problem with "truly understand evil" is that it implies other views which differ are false.  it is not one size fits all.  it is not true false, nor is it universal.

 

 

Edited Sunday at 11:16 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[Cobie]

 

 

4 hours ago, forestofclarity said:

I've never heard a teacher give such teachings without some sort of context. Buddhism isn't a series of stand-alone axioms, it is a whole tradition, usually transmitted from a living teacher to a student. 

 

Indeed.  It’s all about context always. The ‘may’ imo reflects, as you say, that then there would be no evil.

 

9 hours ago, forestofclarity said:

Do you think that truly happy beings would commit evil acts? 

 

[Cobie]

 

4 hours ago, forestofclarity said:

I've never heard a teacher give such teachings without some sort of context. Buddhism isn't a series of stand-alone axioms, it is a whole tradition, usually transmitted from a living teacher to a student. 

 

Indeed.  And so too it is in Christianity. 

 

1 hour ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

well, Jesus said: "But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you"

And then again there’s, “not I came to bring peace but a sword” (Matthew 10:34)

https://biblehub.com/text/matthew/10-34.htm 

 

 

Edited Sunday at 11:42 PM by Cobie

[Nungali]

10 hours ago, old3bob said:

 

Has anyone come across context for the big hearted Buddhist saying of, "may all beings be happy" ?  Taken literally or without context it would include all Beings including those that willfully choose and or practice evil? (and which makes them happy)

 

 

What if they could be   'made happy ' , then they might not   choose evil  ?  

[Nungali]

10 hours ago, forestofclarity said:

Do you think that truly happy beings would commit evil acts? 

 

 

You beat me to it    

[Nungali]

4 hours ago, old3bob said:

 

ok the 4th line is conditional context and without it the other lines are at least problematic per what I've been trying to get at...

 

My take is  

IF I were   Buddha , I would bless them and say  "may they "   ( and depending on what 'type' of Buddha  [   ]   )  my word  "may'  would change the universe  OR  I am just being ineffectual  and nicely retiring . 

 

If I were an ancient Egyptian  ..... I would  'throw an ax into the face of evil ' . 

 

But for you Oldbob , might I suggest you  bless them and hope for change .... but keep the ax close by . 

[Nungali]

4 hours ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

 

the master recognizes anything and everything as a mirror, reflection, and outpicturing of their own inner state.

and resolves it from within

 

 

' ANY   spiritual master'  he said .   You don't get to  draw a line and say any one that   ' recognizes anything and everything as a mirror, reflection, and outpicturing of their own inner state.and resolves it from within ' qualifies as a master and those outside do not . 

 

Take Mulla Husayn  for example   in the battle at Shaykh Tabarsi , showed  exceptional bravery , ran into the thick of it, showed brilliance in the use of  lance and sword  , was compared to Ali , the greatest swordsman ,  that (at the time ) captivated public interest and inspired poets . 

 

[Nungali]

3 hours ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

 

So let's look at spiritual bypassing:  a tendency to use spiritual ideas and practices to sidestep or avoid facing unresolved emotional issues, psychological wounds, and unfinished developmental tasks.

 

It is also bypassing to dismiss and reject core foundational spritual principles as "platitudes" "niceties" and "rolling over."  For the very same reasons.

 

 

WHOSE   core  foundational and spiritual  attitudes ?   

 

'GET OUT !  Or I will whip you in the face !  "  

 

[Cobie]

 

7 hours ago, old3bob said:

what did Jesus (or what any spiritual master would) do when dealing with evil, to begin with he did not bless it...

 

Some nice ‘direct action’ from Jesus clearing the Temple https://biblehub.com/text/john/2-15.htm 

 

 

Edited Monday at 12:00 AM by Cobie

[Nungali]

2 hours ago, Lairg said:

Is there a difference between happiness and joy?

 

 

 

Yes ..... Joy   works  down the street .    Go and see her to get some happiness . 

[BigSkyDiamond]

38 minutes ago, Cobie said:

Indeed.  And so too it is in Christianity. 
And then again there’s, “not I came to bring peace but a sword” (Matthew 10:34)

 

yes.  context determines the meaning.

along with personal interpretation.  

 

Edited Monday at 12:05 AM by BigSkyDiamond

[Nungali]

1 hour ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

 

well, Jesus said:

"But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you"

 

and if you shoose to use a whip and turn over the tables when the mood strikes you - that's good too 

[BigSkyDiamond]

56 minutes ago, Cobie said:

Indeed.  And so too it is in Christianity. 
And then again there’s, “not I came to bring peace but a sword” (Matthew 10:34)

 

along with 

'Then Jesus said to him, “Put the sword back into its place. All those who use the sword will die by the sword." '  (Matthew 26:52)

 

Edited Monday at 12:23 AM by BigSkyDiamond

[old3bob]

2 hours ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

 

understanding of evil differs, depending on the context, depending on the path, depending on the person, depending on the framework or belief system.

 

as stated in an earlier post, there is a "valid understanding" for you.

so too are there different valid understandings that others hold.

 

the problem with "truly understand evil" is that it implies other views which differ are false.  it is not one size fits all.  it is not true false, nor is it universal.

 

 

lets see, most of mankind has similar reactions to various forms of music which can be said to have a universal aspect to it...so for one that does not fit with your rationalizations... extrapolate the rest if you will?