Whats your purpose/meaning or life?

[NaturaNaturans]

Gratzie 🙏

[Daniel]

5 hours ago, NaturaNaturans said:

If there is no meaning to life, no «father,» im honestly not sure i can deal with it.

 

3 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

I believe there is a Father, in case that is any comfort to you.

 

2 hours ago, NaturaNaturans said:

It kind of does 

 

{lyrics from in the stars - exceprt}

 

Now, Sunday mornings, I just sleep in
It's like I buried my faith with you
I'm screamin' at a God I don't know if I believe in
'Cause I don't know what else I can do

 

I'm still holdin' on to everything that's dead and gone
I don't wanna say goodbye, 'cause this one means forever
And now you're in the stars and six-feet's never felt so far
Here I am alone between the heavens and the embers

 

Oh, it hurts so hard
For a million different reasons
You took the best of my heart
And left the rest in pieces

 

Believe it or not, there's a little telephone in the heart.  The Father is always listening and supporting you.  Figuring these things out is really hard.  But having friends who have been through it makes it a little easier.  Not easy, easier.  

 

You're still holding on?  That's a very powerful idea.  This is one of my favorite songs.  Touches my soul.

 

 

 

 

[Daniel]

@NaturaNaturans,

 

Here's another great one, more light hearted.  A Sunday Morning pick-me-up for lifting-the-spirit.

 

Trey knows what to do. .. It's true

 

 

 

[NaturaNaturans]

@Daniel crazy thing is… after i posted that comment, i got support from you guys, a visit from a Friend and a priest and i feel connected again. I call that a miracle ❤️‍🔥🕊️

[NaturaNaturans]

 

 

 

[Nungali]

6 hours ago, NaturaNaturans said:

This is going to seem random, but i want to share it. What led to a moment that felt like a real, spiritual unity, an experience of the divine, peace… you Get the point, was two thing.

 

This verse from isha upanishad:

O Sun, sole traveler of the Heavens, controller of all, Surya, son of Prajapati, remove thy rays and gather up thy burning light. I behold thy glorious form; I am he, the Purusha within thee. 
(16)

 

And Sol invictus:

 

 

 

 

 

"  Be the flame of the Sun thine ambience, O thou PRIEST of the SUN!  "

 

" I am the flame that burns in every heart of man, and in the core of every star. I am Life, and the giver of Life;  "

 

" Lord visible and sensible of whom this earth is but a frozen spark turning about thee with annual and diurnal motion, source of light, source of life, let thy perpetual radiance hearten us to continual labour and enjoyment; so that as we are constant partakers of thy bounty we may in our particular orbit give out light and life, sustenance and joy to them that revolve about us without diminution of substance or effulgence for ever.  "

 

" Thou who art I, beyond all I am,

Who hast no nature and no name,

Who art, when all but thou are gone,

Thou, centre and secret of the Sun,

Thou, hidden spring of all things known

And unknown,  ...

 

" In my mouth be the essence of the life of the Sun! "

 

Solar / Father   invocations from the Gnostic Mass  - a solar communion ritual .

[Daniel]

3 hours ago, NaturaNaturans said:

 

 

 

 

Love it.  I met Matis a few times.  Super nice guy.

[NaturaNaturans]

@whocoulditbe?

Have you read Nietzsche, or are you aware of his concept of unter/ubermench? I just started «thus spoke zarathustra,» but i am superfically familiar with his philosophy. I think it could be relevant for Your search of meaning and your view on ethics. Shame his repution has  been so besudled by the third reich.

[whocoulditbe?]

5 hours ago, NaturaNaturans said:

Have you read Nietzsche, or are you aware of his concept of unter/ubermench? I just started «thus spoke zarathustra,» but i am superfically familiar with his philosophy. I think it could be relevant for Your search of meaning and your view on ethics. Shame his repution has  been so besudled by the third reich.

I read the Genealogy and Beyond Good and Evil years ago. Nietzsche's writing might as well be a mirror in which everyone sees what they set out to see. The one aphorism that has stuck with me is "tethered heart, free spirit."

[NaturaNaturans]

On 18.10.2023 at 4:44 AM, whocoulditbe? said:

Nietzsche's writing might as well be a mirror in which everyone sees what they set out to see.

In a way, that is kind of his point;)

[NaturaNaturans]

Segment from thus spoke Zarathustra:

Spoiler

Brave, unconcerned, mocking, violent–thus wisdom wants us: she is a woman and loves only a warrior.

You say to me, “Life is hard to bear.” But why would you have your pride in the morning and your resignation in the evening? Life is hard to bear; but do not act so tenderly! We are all of us fair beasts of burden, male and female asses. What do we have in common with the rosebud, which trembles because a drop of dew lies on it?

True, we love life, not because we are used to living but because we are used to loving. There is always some madness in love. But there is also always some reason in madness.

And to me too, as I am well disposed toward life, butterflies and soap bubbles and whatever among men is of their kind seem to know most about happiness. Seeing these light, foolish, delicate, mobile little souls flutter–that seduces Zarathustra to tears and songs.

 

I would believe only in a god who could dance. And when I saw my devil I found him serious, thorough, profound, and solemn: it was the spirit of gravity–through him all things fall.

Not by wrath does one kill but by laughter. Come, let us kill the spirit of gravity!

I have learned to walk: ever since, I let myself run. I have learned to fly: ever since, I do not want to be pushed before moving along.

Now I am light, now I fly, now I see myself beneath myself, now a god dances through me.

Thus spoke Zarathustra.

 

[Giles]

On 13/10/2023 at 12:22 PM, kakapo said:

 

I am probably in the minority but to me the meaning of life is super duper simple.

 

The most basic drive and instinct an organism has is survival.

 

The point of life is to survive.

 

So, we have a problem.

 

The universe is winding down.

 

Stars are dying out. 

 

Eventually no new stars will be born.

 

Eventually everything will grow cold and dark.

 

The heat death of the universe, and then eventually black holes even will evaporate, and protons themselves will decay.

 

So life has a problem.

 

Right now we are too stupid to fix this problem.

 

We can't even begin to fathom how entropy can be reversed.

 

So we have to become more intelligent.

 

Not just a little bit more intelligent, but a lot bit.

 

Intelligence so advanced it would be godlike by our current standards.

 

We will convert this entire universe into a computer to figure out the answer to that question, how can we reverse entropy.

 

 

 

 

 

Might just be cyclical..?

[kakapo]

On 10/11/2023 at 8:36 PM, kakapo said:

 

 

Whats your motivation to get Out of bed? Whats your higher aim? Do you belive its a universal answer to this? Why do good instead of bad?

 

When I look outside my window you know what I see?

 

I see trillions and trillions of nanobots made of carbon, absorbing sunlight to charge themselves up to do work.

 

Depending on the programming of these nanobots they cooperate with each other in different ways, and perform different functions.

 

I feel like some of these nanobots are on the cusp of something amazing.

 

We will see these nanobots engage in recursive self improvement, and it will result in a feedback loop, and an intelligence explosion that will make the Cambrian period pale in comparison.

 

I wake up each morning watching the progress of this situation, waiting for critical mass to be achieved.

 

It makes my heart race.

 

 

 

I've gotten a few DMs about this. 

 

I am talking about cells.

 

Cells are nanobots.

 

Groups of cells that cooperate according to their programming are called organisms.

 

Plants absorb photons to do work, and self replicate and the energy they harvest powers almost the entire biosphere.

 

We are soon to produce artificial minds more intelligent than the most intelligent humans to have ever lived.

 

[kakapo]

5 hours ago, Giles said:

 

Might just be cyclical..?

 

I understand that asking someone to watch a 37 minute youtube video is asking a lot these days.

 

This however is absolutely fantastic.

 

Isaac Asimov really understood the end goal pretty well here and made a fantastic short story out of it.

 

 

 

[Daniel]

56 minutes ago, kakapo said:

I understand that asking someone to watch a 37 minute youtube video is asking a lot these days.

 

It is too much to ask if the individual doing the asking ignores the content of their own videos which they are posting.

 

56 minutes ago, kakapo said:

Isaac Asimov really understood the end goal pretty well here and made a fantastic short story out of it.

 

It's also too much to ask if fictional stories from the 1950s are brought to an intellectual discussion.

 

What should happen, imo, is if the individual who is bringing the video, *actually* understands the content, they should extract the important points and any supporting evidence from the video and type it out.  Then it can be discussed properly.  If they are unwilling or unable to do that, it demonstrates either they aren't going to put in the effort to discuss it properly, or, they don't understand it.

 

Otherwise it's really nothing more than name-dropping:  "Isaac Asimov agrees with me".  But it might or might not.

 

And in my discussion with you in the past, it didn't matter what was actually in the video.  You argued against it and denied the content in the video you had posted.  It was posted with the intention of proving your point.  But it didn't.  And there was nothing but denial, repeated denial for pages and pages.

 

If an individual wants others to watch videos they post without extracting the content, they really need to maintain their credibility.  Without that, there's no reason to trust that person is able to select quality videos.  There is no reason to trust they are even willing to discuss what's *actually* in it.  

 

Edited October 22, 2023 by Daniel

[Daniel]

1 hour ago, kakapo said:

 

I've gotten a few DMs about this. 

 

I am talking about cells.

 

Cells are nanobots.

 

Groups of cells that cooperate according to their programming are called organisms.

 

Plants absorb photons to do work, and self replicate and the energy they harvest powers almost the entire biosphere.

 

We are soon to produce artificial minds more intelligent than the most intelligent humans to have ever lived.

 

 

Yes, I was one of those you DM'd you.  And told you it was a nice metaphor.  Metaphors are not literally real.  Although I was concerned that you considered it to be literally true.  Thank you for clearing this up.

[Daniel]

 

 

[Cobie]

19 minutes ago, Daniel said:

… they should extract the important points … from the video and type it out.  …

I agree. I never look at a posted link or video that lacks this. 
 

 

Edited October 22, 2023 by Cobie

[kakapo]

14 minutes ago, Daniel said:

 

It is too much to ask if the individual doing the asking ignores the content of their own videos which they are posting.

 

 

It's also too much to ask if fictional stories from the 1950s are brought to an intellectual discussion.

 

What should happen, imo, is if the individual who is bringing the video, *actually* understands the content, they should extract the important points and any supporting evidence from the video and type it out.  Then it can be discussed properly.  If they are unwilling or unable to do that, it demonstrates either they aren't going to put in the effort to discuss it properly, or, they don't understand it.

 

Otherwise it's really nothing more than name-dropping:  "Isaac Asimov agrees with me".  But it might or might not.

 

And in my discussion with you in the past, it didn't matter what was actually in the video.  You argued against it and denied the content in the video you had posted.  It was posted with the intention of proving your point.  But it didn't.  And there was nothing but denial, repeated denial for pages and pages.

 

If an individual wants others to watch videos they post without extracting the content, they really need to maintain their credibility.  Without that, there's no reason to trust that person is able to select quality videos.  There is no reason to trust they are even willing to discuss what's *actually* in it.  

 

 

I've watched it many times, and I've read the story many times, I am aware of it's content very well.

 

It's got a twist ending that was relevant to his post about this situation being cyclical.

 

Being old doesn't make it irrelevant.

 

You are welcome to read the story instead of watching the video.

 

https://users.ece.cmu.edu/~gamvrosi/thelastq.html

 

 

[kakapo]

1 minute ago, Cobie said:

I agree. I never look at a posted link or a video that lacks this. 
 

 

 

Certainly your loss in this case.

[kakapo]

16 minutes ago, Daniel said:

 

Yes, I was one of those you DM'd you.  And told you it was a nice metaphor.  Metaphors are not literally real.  Although I was concerned that you considered it to be literally true.  Thank you for clearing this up.

 

I wasn't using metaphors, and it is literally true.

[kakapo]

13 minutes ago, Daniel said:

 

 

 

You are certainly welcome to believe that, 10 years from now I believe this will have aged like milk.

 

Already it is able to make art that wins contests, poetry, songs, and books even that are better than most people can ever hope to write.

 

I can only imagine what tomorrow will bring.

[Daniel]

14 minutes ago, kakapo said:

You are welcome to read the story instead of watching the video.

 

https://users.ece.cmu.edu/~gamvrosi/thelastq.html

 

 

 

Thank you, that's perfect!

 

11 minutes ago, kakapo said:

 

You are certainly welcome to believe that, 10 years from now I believe this will have aged like milk.

 

Already it is able to make art that wins contests, poetry, songs, and books even that are better than most people can ever hope to write.

 

I can only imagine what tomorrow will bring.

 

It's pretty well known in the literary world it cannot and will not ever be able to do proper analysis.  But, we'll see.  I think it depends on what is considered "intelligent", and that depends on the values of the AI trainers.

 

On the other hand, if they produce artifical "life", then it's not AI anymore is it?

 

Edit to add:  and at that point even the word "artifical" seems meaningless.  It would just be "life".

 

Edited October 22, 2023 by Daniel

[kakapo]

1 minute ago, Daniel said:

 

Thank you, that's perfect!

 

 

It's pretty well known in the literary world it cannot and will not ever be able to do proper analysis.  But, we'll see.  I think it depends on what is considered "intelligent", and that depends on the values of the AI trainers.

 

On the other hand, if they produce artifical "life", then it's not AI anymore is it?

 

Edit to add:  and at that point even the word "artifical" seems meaningless.  It would just be "life".

 

 

To me it matters not if the neural networks are made of carbon or silicon, in the end a neural network is a neural network.

[Daniel]

14 minutes ago, kakapo said:

To me it matters not if the neural networks are made of carbon or silicon, in the end a neural network is a neural network.

 

Agreed!  100%.  From my POV, it will need to be 100% biological.  But if they are able to overcome the inherent limitations of carbon or silicon or whatever, so-be-it.  I don't care at all about its outer-wrapper.  If it is thinking and feeling and learning like a human, then, it's "life".  No distinction is needed.  That would be bigotry, imo.

 

Edited October 22, 2023 by Daniel