Ethical conduct indispensable for attaining enlightenment or Buddhahood

[Ajay0]

Ethical conduct in the form of right speech, right livelihood and right effort are considered to be vital practices leading to enlightenment in Buddhism or Buddhahood.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_Eightfold_Path

 

https://studybuddhism.com/en/tibetan-buddhism/about-buddhism/buddha-s-basic-message/a-full-buddhist-life-the-eightfold-path/the-three-trainings

 

Ethical conduct is also emphasized in the religious philosophies of Hinduism, Jainism and Sufism for attaining enlightenment.

 

This itself is a refutation of the nihilist and existentialist premise that life is meaningless and all values and virtues are but abstract mental contrivances without any relevance of their own.
 

[silent thunder]

Lately, boundary areas between on and off the mat, praxis and daily life deliciously dissolve.

Several tenets resonate as constants throughout awareness, (wherever it abides).

 

Embody an unfoldingness in impeccability.  (particularly in the relating of witness to judge)

Radical authenticity in word, thought and action is imperative.  (This does not imply stuffiness, or seriousness.  Rather its opposite is required (for myself).   Nurture unflinchingly authentic, open playfulness.  Radical of release in unfolding presence.  Whole hearted, unabashed, acknowledged and accepted presence). 

 

Do not take any aspect of perceived reality personally.

While awareness may experience within Maya, our true nature is not of it.

 

Wholeness of awareness in presence.  Abide in Beingness.  Simplicity.

 

 

Release everything and what remains is true nature.

Edited September 27, 2023 by silent thunder

[old3bob]

On 9/23/2023 at 3:44 AM, Ajay0 said:

Ethical conduct in the form of right speech, right livelihood and right effort are considered to be vital practices leading to enlightenment in Buddhism or Buddhahood.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_Eightfold_Path

 

https://studybuddhism.com/en/tibetan-buddhism/about-buddhism/buddha-s-basic-message/a-full-buddhist-life-the-eightfold-path/the-three-trainings

 

Ethical conduct is also emphasized in the religious philosophies of Hinduism, Jainism and Sufism for attaining enlightenment.

 

This itself is a refutation of the nihilist and existentialist premise that life is meaningless and all values and virtues are but abstract mental contrivances without any relevance of their own.
 

 

preparations in a life of working with Dharma's is very important but is not a guarantee that it leads to enlightenment, if so it could be done by an ego's subtle design.  The Self chooses the Self (since Hinduism was brought up in your post) or Spirit chooses Spirit and sees through any of ego's designs.

Edited September 26, 2023 by old3bob

[stirling]

The Eightfold Path is interesting. It is sort of a "fake it till you make it" proposition, being that the only possible way to properly  express right view, right resolve, right speech, right conduct, right livelihood, right effort, right mindfulness, and right samadhi is to actually BE enlightened. 

 

The point of the Eightfold Path, and the precepts is to slow as much as possible the accumulation of new karma until such time as the delusion of "self" is seen through completely (Arhat) and karma is no longer created. 

 

On 9/23/2023 at 1:52 PM, silent thunder said:

Embody an unfoldingness in impeccability.  (particularly in the relating of witness to judge)

Radical authenticity in word, thought and action is imperative.  (This does not imply stuffiness, or seriousness.  Rather its opposite is required.   Nurture unflinchingly authentic, open playfulness.  Radical of release in unfolding presence.  Whole hearted, unabashed, acknowledged and accepted presence). 

 

Do not take any aspect of perceived reality personally.

While awareness may experience within Maya, our true nature is not of it.

 

Wholeness of awareness in presence.  Abide in Beingness.  Simplicity.

 

 

Release everything and what remains is true nature.

 

This is great. Yes! I especially love your emphasis: 

 

Radical authenticity in word, thought and action.

 

I have found training (and teaching) the Tibetan "Lojong" teachings to be a great method for reducing self-cherishing, increasing bodhicitta and bringing forward those qualities above that are SO necessary to success. 

 

WIth any luck there will continue to be those that experience the subtle pop of understanding, and for whom the Eightfold Path is merely the experience of being.  

[iinatti]

...

 

 

Edited September 27, 2023 by iinatti

[Ajay0]

On 9/26/2023 at 5:49 AM, old3bob said:

 

preparations in a life of working with Dharma's is very important but is not a guarantee that it leads to enlightenment, if so it could be done by an ego's subtle design.  The Self chooses the Self (since Hinduism was brought up in your post) or Spirit chooses Spirit and sees through any of ego's designs.

 

Yes, but Virya or virile effort is also emphasized by the Buddha as well.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vīrya

 

Anyway, the theme of the op is that ethical or moral conduct has its relevance in the larger scheme of things and cannot be dismissed as mere abstractions.

[old3bob]

agreed...

[Ajay0]

^{Insightful article on Sila...}

 

https://www.serenecolombo.org/pali-word-of-the-day-sila/

 

Quote

When someone has good virtue, or sīla, they give up doing bad things and they only do good things. The Supreme Buddha taught that sīla is the foundation of all wholesome qualities. That means that if we develop good sīla, then it will be easy to develop other good qualities like samādhi (concentration) and paññā (wisdom).

[Ajay0]

 

Quote

 

“A wise man after establishing well his virtue develops consciousness (samādhi) and understanding (paññā).” ~ Visuddhimagga I,P.2

 

"This stability of the mind (samadhi) can be brought about through sustained practice of meditation on one subject. At the same time, an orderly mind is necessary for the effective practice of meditation. However, to achieve a qualified samadhi, we must also have acquired, before and during our meditation practice, good conduct and high moral standards." ~ Samdhong Rinpoche

 

“The first training, ethics (also called ethical conduct or moral discipline) is crucial in developing the second and the third, concentration and wisdom, and as such is really the foundation for the other two.” ~ Tashi Tsering

 

 

 

These wise sayings further reveals how sila or virtuous conduct leads to restraint and calming of the monkey mind, and enables the sequential development of concentration and wisdom later on.

[Krenx]

Sila also functions as a way to reveal unwholesome qualities within us that are hard to see, and only surface when it is cornered with virtue.

 

Eventually as unwholesome and unskillful qualities are abandoned rightly, Sila/ virtue becomes effortless, and they becomes a measure of one's progress on the path. 

 

And the Arahant, fully enlightened being, would be the prime example of perfected Sila, where even the threat, or real circumstances of immediate death or bodily harm, can never cause them to break precepts. 

[Lairg]

Ethical conduct is certainly necessary - but whose ethics?

 

 Ethos is a Greek word meaning "character," originally denoting "custom" or "habit." It forms the root of the term "ethikos," which means "morality" or "showing moral character."   

 

Perhaps human ethics are not quite there yet

 

 

[Cadcam]

Before one can understand right action, they would have to establish a set of ideals. It would appear that the religious ideal is loving kindness, which brings about compassion and wisdom. 

 

 

[steve]

On 9/24/2025 at 7:44 PM, Lairg said:

Ethical conduct is certainly necessary - but whose ethics?

 

 Ethos is a Greek word meaning "character," originally denoting "custom" or "habit." It forms the root of the term "ethikos," which means "morality" or "showing moral character."   

 

Perhaps human ethics are not quite there yet

 

 

 

I would say the ethics associated with the system being discussed, in this case Buddhist ethics.

[Cadcam]

The thing about right action is that they can be established by any ideal. That's why nihilism and existentialism prevail over any system. Once you break free from the system one was indoctrinated in, it's possible to see this. Unfortunately it can leave a person faithless, especially if they have no higher power.  

[bradley]

you know whats right and wrong. its primordial. no ethical code, ideal, or analysis is required. righteous action needs no justification or explanation. a truely authentic person only does what is right, there is no other action

[Cadcam]

My understanding of enlightenment is the apprehension and understanding of Chaos.

 

Once one recognizes that action is dependent on ideals, and that any ideal can produce a series of action, and that there is no set list of ideals and actions, one can see the chaos that ensues in the understanding and interaction of different people's. This brings wisdom.

 

Also, examining actions and the chaos they bring also yields wisdom.

 

A third reason for studying chaos is to see where individuals fail their ideals, causing irrational or chaotic action.

 

I consider myself enlightened because I can understand a broad spectrum of actions, and can be at peace with chaos.

[Cadcam]

50 minutes ago, bradley said:

you know whats right and wrong. its primordial. no ethical code, ideal, or analysis is required. righteous action needs no justification or explanation. a truely authentic person only does what is right, there is no other action

While it may be possible to always do the right thing because it's embedded in our being, the truth is that most of us fail. That is why they worship Jesus, because he walked perfectly through life and was without sin.

 

I would still argue that people are not born righteous and need dogma to act appropriately 

[Cobie]

 

1 hour ago, bradley said:

you know whats right and wrong. its primordial. no ethical code, ideal, or analysis is required. …

Studies on young children suggest that morality is learned, not an instinct. Imo all systems do set moral rules for this reason, they have to come from the outside. Buddhists have e.g. the Five Precepts. 
 

 

Edited Saturday at 08:47 PM by Cobie

[Cadcam]

It takes a person years to contemplate,  compare and consider moral ideals, and to gather axiom to stand by as they create a set of ideals. People aren't just born understanding these things. Also, because we aren't all educated monks, parents don't always treat children the right way, and the child develops improper behavior.  It takes a good set of teachings and good teachers to raise people to a moral level. 

[bradley]

23 hours ago, Cadcam said:

While it may be possible to always do the right thing because it's embedded in our being, the truth is that most of us fail. That is why they worship Jesus, because he walked perfectly through life and was without sin.

 

I would still argue that people are not born righteous and need dogma to act appropriately 

okay. thanks.