JinlianPai Posted February 8, 2015 The Chinese characters for Golden Flower (Jinhua ้ๅ) hide the word light (ๅ ) in it. The lower part of the character for Gold (้) and the upper part for the character Flower (ๅ) make up the character for Light (ๅ ) ย ย Link: http://thesecretofthegoldenflower.com/hide.html ย Yes thats my point exactly Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brian Posted February 8, 2015 In regard to offshoot qigong and new agers in general (from Cultivating Perfection: Mysticism and Self-Transformation in early Quan Zhen (pp80-1)): ย ย Definition of mysticism from same book: ย ย Sounds very preheaven. ย Interestingly, a channeled teaching called the Michael Teachings lists Jesus, Laozi, Buddha, Ra, Krishna, Lilith (Hebrew), and 7 others as those who for a part of their lives were bodily hosts of the Infinite Soul, which is considered an incarnation of the Tao. ย ย Anyway. Qigong does not interact with the mystical. True Neidan from the original teachings of Laozi does. ย I'm thinking that maybe the only true approaches to this "trans-human reality" (preheaven) have to have come from these incarnations of Tao, and that others would have no way to access them. Not that the all the other incarnations must have passed on teachings of immortality, I can't speculate much there. Though Buddha is apparently another. Were the 7 others named? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LaoZiDao Posted February 8, 2015 are you serious? There is no word Jing in that phrase! ย ็ฅๅธๆฐ๏ผ่ช็ถๆฐ้๏ผ้ๆ ๅ็ธ๏ผไธๆง่ๅทฒ๏ผไธๅ ็ฅ่ๅทฒใ ย I think we can nullify your "evidences" after that or you will insist you've "studied very intensely and openly the source text of The Secret Of The Golden Flower "? ย I am still waiting to hear a response on this, as it was conveniently ignored by ZOOM. This kind of mistake can put doubts on anything you have to say ZOOM, you should have some response to this, at least admit you were wrong. People like you blindly read English translations of scriptures and take them as ultimate truth...Not even 100% the translations fault here, its your own interpretations, lack of a teacher and linage which is most of the problem. ย You accuse Opendao of using "tricks" by actually being able to translate some Chinese, man its not tricks its called actually being able to read and understand a tradition which is being discussed here, also not only understanding but having years of experience working with Neidan. ย If you think Neidan is as simple as reading a website called thesecretofthegoldenflower.com without consulting a teacher and understanding the scriptures in its original form (Chinese language), you could not be more wrong. You know there is so much room for error in translations to English? ย https://m.facebook.com/notes/dzogchen-khenpo-choga-rinpoche/auspicious-news-my-teacher-lama-karma-attains-rainbow-body/10151794778007773/ ย Man do you know what it means to die? ย Qi separate from Shen = Death .. so this is Tianxian for you? ย Let's check what Tianxian Zhongliquan had to say about this kind of 'incorrect' practices which you take is Tianxian. BTW this crap is common, and any real achievement would not be posted on Facebook ย So we will start with some trickery, using Chinese characters. ย ๅๆฐ๏ผโๅคง้้พ็ฅใ้พ่กไน็ๅฆไฝ๏ผโ Lu said : Great Dao is difficult to understand and realise, what is the reason? ย ้ๆฐ๏ผโไปฅๅ้จๅฐๆณ๏ผๆไธบ่งๅ๏ผ่ๆฌฒๆตๅคๅพใไบ็ธไผ ๆ๏ผ่ณๆญปไธๆ๏ผ้ๆ้ฃไฟ๏ผ่่ดฅๅๅคง้ใ Zhong Said: By means of depending on the ways the of small method's, seeming easy and appear to have good results, and desire to circulate and spread to many. Mutually passing on these false methods, being incorrigibly stubborn and benighted to the end of their days, succeeding to become popular and common practices as well as undermining and corrupting Great Dao. ย I didn't translate them all, just a few, and highlighted some relevant ones: ย ๆๆๆ่ ใ those who abstain from meat and wine adopting vegetarian diet, ๆไผ็ฒฎ่ ใ those who stop eating grain and fast from food for periods of time, ๆๆญๅณ่ ใ those who abstain from the flavours, ๆ็ฆ ๅฎ่ ใ those who meditate and stabilise the mind, ๆไธ่ฏญ่ ใ those who don't talk, ๆๅญๆณ่ ใ those who preserve thoughts, ๆ็ป็ดฏ่ ใ those who go without rest, ๆๅผ้กถ่ ใ those who open the crown of the head [third eye], ๆ็ผฉ้พ่ ใ those who withdraw and retract the tortoise (genitalia), ๆ็ป่ฟน่ ใ those who cut off relations, ๆ็่ฏป่ ใ those who recite Scriptures or chants, ๆๅฎๆฏ่ ใ those who stabilise or fix the breath, ๆๅ็บณ่ ใ those who practice Tu Na, exhale [the old] and inhale [the new], ๆๅธๆฝ่ ใ those who donate to temples and charity's, ๆไพๅ ป่ ใ those who make offerings and sacrifices to gods and deities, ๆๆๆต่ ใ those who provide aid, relief and salvation ๆๅ ฅๅฑฑ่ ใ those who enter the mountain [leave their wives and family], ๆ่ฏๆง่ ใ those who realise only Xing ๆไธๅจ่ ใ those who are motionless, ๆๅๆ่ ใ those who accept and maintain blind faith ย On false methods: Zhongliquan said: By beginning cultivation and not realising the Great Dao, as well as desire to attain the goal quickly. Cultivation can be compared to a still sitting tree, the heart as if cold and like dead ashes, Shen internally conserved, not to scatter the mind aspirations and concentration. By calmness and stabilising therefore the Yin Shen can release, it is the clear spirit of a Ghost, pure Yin, without Yang, it is Immortal. Because using the mind aspirations and concentration the Yin spirit wont scatter, for these reasons we call it Gui Xian. Although its called Xian, it's actually a Gui (ghost \ devil \ spirit of dead). ย From ancient times til now Buddhist disciples, hard-working diligent in their practice so therefore they call it 'attained the Dao', truly ridiculous and laughable. ย Also for the record, Opendao's "dogma" is also the same things my teacher is saying and teaching. At least my dogma works, which is more then you can say. Having never had a Neidan teacher, and probably never will at this rate. ย ย 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JinlianPai Posted February 8, 2015 The Chinese characters for Golden Flower (Jinhua ้ๅ) hide the word light (ๅ ) in it. The lower part of the character for Gold (้) and the upper part for the character Flower (ๅ) make up the character for Light (ๅ ) ย ย Link: http://thesecretofthegoldenflower.com/hide.html ย Now you dont think that the golden lotus practices was given to the shaolin to hide and protect them...... ย There couldnt possibly be a golden lotus method or fa..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted February 8, 2015 (edited) . Edited February 8, 2015 by ZOOM Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yae Posted February 8, 2015 (edited) Were the 7 others named? ย Mhm: ย "[MEntity] The list of human Infinite Soul Manifestations would be: [MEntity] With approximate time frames - Ti'AT (female - 4,000,000 BCE), Khro'Te (male child - 2,000,000 BCE), Ker (female - 1,000,000 BCE), Sonad, Kin, Serep (brothers - 700,000 BCE), Tinet, TenTen, Tia (sisters - 500,000 BCE), Shia (female - 150,000 BCE), Kendre (female - 75,000 BCE), "Ra" (male - 6,000 BCE), "Krishna" (6,000 BCE) "Lilith" (female - 4,000 BCE), Lao Tzu (male - 4,000 BCE), "Buddha" (male - 500 BCE), "Christ" (male - 5 BCE). " ย https://www.truthloveenergy.com/explore/blogs/841/22/list-of-infinite-souls Edited February 8, 2015 by Bluemind 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dawei Posted February 8, 2015 Now you dont think that the golden lotus practices was given to the shaolin to hide and protect them...... ย There couldnt possibly be a golden lotus method or fa..... ย I've got no idea about what is golden lotus practices... but it seems like an interesting connection if you could explain it... but probably a new thread. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JinlianPai Posted February 8, 2015 Very powerful spirits that can aid your internal cultivation. Thanks for sharing. anytime man im trying to figure this out myself as well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted February 8, 2015 (edited) . Edited February 8, 2015 by ZOOM Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dawei Posted February 8, 2015 anytime man im trying to figure this out myself as well. ย FYI: Rainbowvein is a lady 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LaoZiDao Posted February 8, 2015 Are you opendao's tag team partner who just got PM'ed by him to do the next shift? ย ย No, I am not. I have no relation to Opendao. I'm from the other side of the globe ย Can you answer to anything I said or just troll? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JinlianPai Posted February 8, 2015 FYI: Rainbowvein is a lady ok sorry rainbowvein. ย Yeah I dont state anything with authority I just read books and listen to lectures and am trying to connect the dots like everyone else. ย but into my research of chinese astrology and lore I seen the golden dragon come up time and time again. ย So please take any info I post and do your own research id love to hear it. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LaoZiDao Posted February 8, 2015 Why don't you show your BS "false method list" to John Chang? As I pointed out before, the Mo Pai method is also on the list, what disproves it already as BS! ย Just shows you have no idea of anything that Neidan is about. End of story. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dawei Posted February 8, 2015 Just shows you have no idea of anything that Neidan is about. End of story. ย This is what gets threads towards the PIT... ย ย ย To be fair... is Mo Pai on the false list? ย ANd if so... ย Do you agree? ย If yes or now, explain why (is Mo Pai not neidan, etc) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted February 8, 2015 (edited) . Edited February 8, 2015 by ZOOM Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
opendao Posted February 8, 2015 That may be... and why I don't like to pander to neidan terminology. ย My usage background is in Medical Qigong... and transmission/reception of divine light energy. ย I gave my usage and experience and did a bad job of trying to tie it to neidan seeking results. ย no probs. Btw, I've seen your posts about Taiyi, maybe you have some thoughts about the title of the book being discussed here (Golden Flower)? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LaoZiDao Posted February 8, 2015 I understand! So a personal issue because I disproved your buddy Cozma single-handedly! You know, Wu-Liu Pai members post here that Liping is only seen as a Qigong teacher in China! So as you only learned Qigong, I most likely know much more about Neidan than you do! ย Yet you disagree with Quanzhen scriptures? You don't agree with Zongliquan, Ludongbin, Liuyiming... etc.. so just which Daoist doctrine do you understand and agree with? if you read ANY Daoist scripture (not butchered by English translations), all your false assumptions about Neidan will be corrected on a textual level very easily. ย But you can't even be bothered to learn anything or go anywhere to learn anything, just read some crap that is handed to you on a golden platter, which is nice and easy to read in English. To understand Neidan it takes a lot of work, time, dedication, persistence and practice. Not to mention having a teacher, but it's clear why you don't have a teacher anyway. ย You're not even looking. ย You know it all 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted February 8, 2015 (edited) . Edited February 8, 2015 by ZOOM Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ralis Posted February 8, 2015 ย Yet you disagree with Quanzhen scriptures? You don't agree with Zongliquan, Ludongbin, Liuyiming... etc.. so just which Daoist doctrine do you understand and agree with? if you read ANY Daoist scripture (not butchered by English translations), all your false assumptions about Neidan will be corrected on a textual level very easily. ย But you can't even be bothered to learn anything or go anywhere to learn anything, just read some crap that is handed to you on a golden platter, which is nice and easy to read in English. To understand Neidan it takes a lot of work, time, dedication, persistence and practice. Not to mention having a teacher, but it's clear why you don't have a teacher anyway. ย You're not even looking. ย You know it all ย You read the texts in the original language? Are you a teacher? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dawei Posted February 8, 2015 no probs. Btw, I've seen your posts about Taiyi, maybe you have some thoughts about the title of the book being discussed here (Golden Flower)? ย I saw this connection too... but they used different characters: Taiyi ๏ผๅคชไธ๏ผvs Taizhe (ๅคชไน). ย I have pressed the idea that Taiyi is even pre-Dao... I don't get the sense that Taizhe is pre-Dao but post-Dao (or concurrent). I've not seen Taizhe used in other texts so I would need to explore it more. ย Dao is an 'arising' concept... it arises In this cycle of creation and consciousness. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
opendao Posted February 8, 2015 I understand! So a personal issue because I disproved your buddy Cozma single-handedly! Btw: http://thetaobums.com/topic/32561-the-teaching-of-quanzhen/?p=498703 ย You have Qigong teacher, no Neidan teacher! ย Just for the record, LaoziDao's teacher has no relation to Wang Liping... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
opendao Posted February 8, 2015 I saw this connection too... but they used different characters: Taiyi ๏ผๅคชไธ๏ผvs Taizhe (ๅคชไน). ย I have pressed the idea that Taiyi is even pre-Dao... I don't get the sense that Taizhe is pre-Dao but post-Dao (or concurrent). I've not seen Taizhe used in other texts so I would need to explore it more. ย yes, hard topic. But it seems it's very far from "creative" as ZOOM assumed based on English translation Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted February 8, 2015 (edited) . Edited February 8, 2015 by ZOOM Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dawei Posted February 8, 2015 yes, hard topic. But it seems it's very far from "creative" as ZOOM assumed based on English translation ย I think it points to the difference in Taiyi and Taizhe. ย Taiyi - primal illumination (big bang); original light and fire... Pure Unity ย Taizhe - creates life ย TO me, the latter is Yuan Shen, Yuan, Qi, Yuan Jing in motion... creating... but already split up. ย IMO, and this is probably unfair, I think Taizhe was meant to represent Taiyi (of historical lore) but it was misrepresented. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wells Posted February 8, 2015 (edited) . Edited February 8, 2015 by ZOOM Share this post Link to post Share on other sites