Topic derail; Free Taoist thunder magic information

[BaguaKicksAss]

We were discussing Dr. Johnson's new Neigong book, and FlowingHands wanted to save us all some money ($200 to be exact). He suggested having some good info, and said the Dao was free. So Cat asked about thunder magic....

 

Well since thunder magic isn't usually covered in a Neigong book/course.... probably best to discuss it in its very own thread.

[flowing hands]

North, East, South, West and center. Each have their own color and element.

 

When begging them to come one must start facing the east, the south, the west and then the north. Then lastly looking above to the center. A variation can be using a colored flag in the left hand that has a talisman on it of the eastern deity, while uttering the command and pressing the finger tip. then on to the next color of the southern deity etc. The flags can be used instead of the jian.

 

It is a traditional Daoist art to make circles and summon gods and Immortals. I have been learning an Immortals art called the 'nine rings immortal master'. Nine rings are walked using technique in each ring, until all the rings were complete. Nine is an important number in Daoist magic. nine x nine = 81, another important number.

 

How many trees can I plant now!?

[Dainin]

If flowing hands' scrap of information doesn't satisfy you, there is always Sifu Lin's classic work :

 

Tao Jiao Lei Fa: Taoist Thunder Magic Traditions and Their Relationship to Nei Kung Meditation

 

 

Whose thunder is more powerful?

 

[BaguaKicksAss]

If flowing hands' scrap of information doesn't satisfy you, there is always Sifu Lin's classic work :

 

Tao Jiao Lei Fa: Taoist Thunder Magic Traditions and Their Relationship to Nei Kung Meditation

 

 

Whose thunder is more powerful?

 

From Amazon, whom is selling the 30 page book in digital format:

 

 

Most Helpful Customer Reviews

4 of 6 people found the following review helpful

1.0 out of 5 stars Dao for dollars. May 1, 2013

By Michael R. Saso

The work listed here, and others attributed to "Shifu Lin" have no real Daoist content, but are made up by the behind-the-scenes author for the purpose of making a profit, misleading readers both into believing that such a person as Shifu Lin existed, and/or is an orthodox Daoist. The Muo Pai school is also not a legitimate, recognized Wushu school, readers must be warned of the fictional (ie, made up)content of the actual author's works. The use of my name in "contributing" to these works refers to e-mails in which the author's erroneous ideas were hopefully pointed out. Works like these can be catalogued under the general title "Dao for $$$). Not to be recommended for purchase.

 

Think I'll stick with the AC/DC .

 

Edit: PS we were discussing free info

Edited May 27, 2013 by BaguaKicksAss

[BaguaKicksAss]

North, East, South, West and center. Each have their own color and element.

 

When begging them to come one must start facing the east, the south, the west and then the north. Then lastly looking above to the center. A variation can be using a colored flag in the left hand that has a talisman on it of the eastern deity, while uttering the command and pressing the finger tip. then on to the next color of the southern deity etc. The flags can be used instead of the jian.

 

It is a traditional Daoist art to make circles and summon gods and Immortals. I have been learning an Immortals art called the 'nine rings immortal master'. Nine rings are walked using technique in each ring, until all the rings were complete. Nine is an important number in Daoist magic. nine x nine = 81, another important number.

 

How many trees can I plant now!?

 

Well 9 or 81 trees sounds appropriate . When you plant the trees, do you offer one of the immortals a home within the tree?

 

Thank you for sharing your methods.

 

I'm wondering if you mean these folks: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lei_Gong (him and the others mentioned there) or this crew: http://en.daoinfo.org/wiki/The_Thunder_Patriarch

[dawei]

North, East, South, West and center. Each have their own color and element.

 

When begging them to come one must start facing the east, the south, the west and then the north. Then lastly looking above to the center.

 

But the consistent theme I have heard from you over the year(s) is that one can 'do' these things but without some master to learn under or some power bestowed... one is just 'turning a direction and bowing' on their own.

 

One can "do" all the right things; try to have a clean heart; beg the immortals... but there is probably still no interaction beyond the physical existence.

 

What I hear from you is one of two things (sorry to summarize in so short an analysis:

1. Be One with the Free Dao every day... All the seeking beyond that is wasted energy

2. Seek a master and learn a very long time but still don't expect something more. Go with what you learn. Accept it all without great expectation. This is the Now, each moment.

[Zhongyongdaoist]

Well 9 or 81 trees sounds appropriate . When you plant the trees, do you offer one of the immortals a home within the tree?

 

Thank you for sharing your methods.

 

I'm wondering if you mean these folks: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lei_Gong (him and the others mentioned there) or this crew: http://en.daoinfo.org/wiki/The_Thunder_Patriarch

 

The Heavenly Lord Puhua aka, Thunder Patriarch, is probably meant, among other things the Thunder Bureau has 81 floors, the other fellow is a pre-Daoist nature deity with roots in popular religion, he could probably help with weather magic and maybe arrange introductions, but Thunder Magic is high level Daoist Military magic and not something to be taken lightly.

 

 

Edit, corrected typo Puahua to Puhua.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Zhongyongdaoist

[lienshan]

 

North peak = Cloud Terrace Peak

East peak = Facing Sun Peak

South peak = Landing Wild Goose Peak

West peak = Lotus Peak

Center peak = Jade Maiden Peak

 

The ancient cultus center 7 kilometers to the north of the five peaks Mount Hua has been exavacated.

The divination method used was named Lienshan (Mountains standing together).

It's put in short a binary shamanic practise which is at least 8.000 years old according to exavacations

of shamans burried with eight tortoise shells placed in circles instead of their heads.

 

North, East, South, West and center. Each have their own color and element.

 

 

Nine is an important number in Daoist magic. nine x nine = 81, another important number.

 

The nineth one is a around 340 BC HuangLao school invention described in §5 of Shuo Gua:

 

http://ctext.org/book-of-changes/shuo-gua 帝出乎震 Di comes forth in Zhen (Thunder)

 

Di comes also forth in the last line of the Tao Te Ching chapter four.

Edited May 28, 2013 by lienshan

[flowing hands]

But the consistent theme I have heard from you over the year(s) is that one can 'do' these things but without some master to learn under or some power bestowed... one is just 'turning a direction and bowing' on their own.

 

One can "do" all the right things; try to have a clean heart; beg the immortals... but there is probably still no interaction beyond the physical existence.

 

What I hear from you is one of two things (sorry to summarize in so short an analysis:

1. Be One with the Free Dao every day... All the seeking beyond that is wasted energy

2. Seek a master and learn a very long time but still don't expect something more. Go with what you learn. Accept it all without great expectation. This is the Now, each moment.

 

Yes, to use all these techniques one has to establish full contact with the deities or Immortal masters and be bestowed their 'fa'. I have started you off, at some point I will instruct you further and true realization may come to you if you are fated. Patience is the essence of learning and realization.

[Wu Ming Jen]

I have been to the Thunder Gods cave on Mt Wudang. It has a great energetic and also connected energetically to Cheng San Fengs cave. Please understand deities that actual lived and deities that have a duty / a job that are not real but symbolic in nature.

 

 

 

According to the history, Thunder God Hole, built in Ming Dynasty, was the place of Zhang-Shouqing, a famous Wudang Mountain Taoist, to exercise Qingwei Law of Thunder and to pray for rain. (real person)

 

Thunder God Hole is the only place to worship Thunder God, also named God Deng. In the stone hall, there is a statue of Thunder God, the biggest in Wudang Mountain, which has a bird face in a man body, a glede mouth, two snipe eyes, two man feet, and ten glede toes, which exhibited the graceful bearing of Thunder God of China in 15th century. (not the look of the real person and related to different duties)

 

The belief of Thunder God has derived from ancient people's subconscious adoration to thunder and lightning.

 

 

Taoism believes that the thunderclap can stand for Heaven, "It is in change of living beings and humans, can bring you fortune and misfortune." So in Wudang Mountain, there are many celestial beings having different expressions on their faces, holding their own tools that show their different duties.

 

Use a light when entering the back of the cave because....

Behind the Hole, there is a natural spring, streaming all the year, cool in summer, warm in winter and having a sweet taste, so is also called Supernatural Spring.

 

There are many twisted roads and byways within the huge umbrella of Taoism. Recently books claim their methods are Taoist with apparent proof dating from antiquity. In reality many of the methods if even "authentic" would not be taught to people without personally knowing them and is never a primary concern in training.

 

That being said my own personal experience with celestial beings would not be helpful and even an obstacle to others, such matters should not be written for the general public to reflect a thousand moons.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Wu Ming Jen

[Cheshire Cat]

I have been to the Thunder Gods cave on Mt Wudang. It has a great energetic and also connected energetically to Cheng San Fengs cave. Please understand deities that actual lived and deities that have a duty / a job that are not real but symbolic in nature.

 

 

Hi,

what do you mean by saying that they are not real, but symbolic? Is this a daoist explanation?

thank you

[Zhongyongdaoist]

I have been to the Thunder Gods cave on Mt Wudang. It has a great energetic and also connected energetically to Cheng San Fengs cave. Please understand deities that actual lived and deities that have a duty / a job that are not real but symbolic in nature.

 

 

 

According to the history, Thunder God Hole, built in Ming Dynasty, was the place of Zhang-Shouqing, a famous Wudang Mountain Taoist, to exercise Qingwei Law of Thunder and to pray for rain. (real person)

 

Thunder God Hole is the only place to worship Thunder God, also named God Deng. In the stone hall, there is a statue of Thunder God, the biggest in Wudang Mountain, which has a bird face in a man body, a glede mouth, two snipe eyes, two man feet, and ten glede toes, which exhibited the graceful bearing of Thunder God of China in 15th century. (not the look of the real person and related to different duties)

 

The belief of Thunder God has derived from ancient people's subconscious adoration to thunder and lightning.

 

 

Taoism believes that the thunderclap can stand for Heaven, "It is in change of living beings and humans, can bring you fortune and misfortune." So in Wudang Mountain, there are many celestial beings having different expressions on their faces, holding their own tools that show their different duties.

 

Use a light when entering the back of the cave because....

Behind the Hole, there is a natural spring, streaming all the year, cool in summer, warm in winter and having a sweet taste, so is also called Supernatural Spring.

 

There are many twisted roads and byways within the huge umbrella of Taoism. Recently books claim their methods are Taoist with apparent proof dating from antiquity. In reality many of the methods if even "authentic" would not be taught to people without personally knowing them and is never a primary concern in training.

 

That being said my own personal experience with celestial beings would not be helpful and even an obstacle to others, such matters should not be written for the general public to reflect a thousand moons.

 

Thank you for the kindness of your post. Your words are as wise as they are discrete.

 

At http://en.daoinfo.org/wiki/The_Five_Supreme_Commanders_of_the_Thunder_Agency It speaks of "Five Supreme Commanders" under the Heavenly Lord Puhua:

 

The Five Supreme Commanders of the Thunder Agency ( 雷部五元帥 Leibu Wu Yuanshuai ) refer to the five supreme commanders of the Thunder Agency ( 雷部 Leibu ) under the administration of the Heavenly Lord of Universal Transformation Whose Voice of Thunder Resonates With the Origin of the Nine Heavens ( 九天應元雷聲普化天尊 Jiutian Yingyuan Leisheng Puhua Tianzun ).

 

And continues about:

 

Chief Supreme Commander Deng

 

Deng is the chief one among the five supreme commanders. His given name is Zhong. It is said that he "has bright silver teeth", and "is surrounded by fire". He is called in the Supplementary Records of the Listener ( 夷堅志補 Yijian Zhi Bu ) as "General Deng of Heavenly Origin who Interrogates and Summons Demons ( 天元考召鄧將軍 Tianyuan Kaozhao Dengjiangjun ) ". The Remaining Stories about Cauldron-Casting ( 鑄鼎餘聞 Zhuding Yuwen ) quotes the Personal Records of the District of Changshu ( 常熟私志 Changshu Sizhi ), calling him "Supreme Commander Deng, Great Spirit in Charge of Laws and Decrees ( 律令大神鄧元帥 Lüling Dashen Deng Yuanshuai ) ", which indicates that he is in charge of laws and decrees, and of the interrogation and summoning of the Thunder Agency.

 

May I ask, is this the "God Deng" to whom you are referring? Other sources describe his appearance in a way similar to what you describe. I have also seen paintings that would indicate they are the same.

[BaguaKicksAss]

I have been to the Thunder Gods cave on Mt Wudang. It has a great energetic and also connected energetically to Cheng San Fengs cave. Please understand deities that actual lived and deities that have a duty / a job that are not real but symbolic in nature.

 

 

 

According to the history, Thunder God Hole, built in Ming Dynasty, was the place of Zhang-Shouqing, a famous Wudang Mountain Taoist, to exercise Qingwei Law of Thunder and to pray for rain. (real person)

 

Thunder God Hole is the only place to worship Thunder God, also named God Deng. In the stone hall, there is a statue of Thunder God, the biggest in Wudang Mountain, which has a bird face in a man body, a glede mouth, two snipe eyes, two man feet, and ten glede toes, which exhibited the graceful bearing of Thunder God of China in 15th century. (not the look of the real person and related to different duties)

 

The belief of Thunder God has derived from ancient people's subconscious adoration to thunder and lightning.

 

 

Taoism believes that the thunderclap can stand for Heaven, "It is in change of living beings and humans, can bring you fortune and misfortune." So in Wudang Mountain, there are many celestial beings having different expressions on their faces, holding their own tools that show their different duties.

 

Use a light when entering the back of the cave because....

Behind the Hole, there is a natural spring, streaming all the year, cool in summer, warm in winter and having a sweet taste, so is also called Supernatural Spring.

 

There are many twisted roads and byways within the huge umbrella of Taoism. Recently books claim their methods are Taoist with apparent proof dating from antiquity. In reality many of the methods if even "authentic" would not be taught to people without personally knowing them and is never a primary concern in training.

 

That being said my own personal experience with celestial beings would not be helpful and even an obstacle to others, such matters should not be written for the general public to reflect a thousand moons.

 

Thank you for the very informative addition to the thread . Btw, is the http://www.wudangdao.com/WUDANG/WUDANG_shan.htm site, where you got the above quote, yours? Nice layout and photos!! Thunder God Hole is definitely a place I would love to visit when I eventually make it out that way.

[Wu Ming Jen]

Hi,

what do you mean by saying that they are not real, but symbolic? Is this a daoist explanation?

thank you

When it comes to religious application of Taoism the fairy tale characters in stories / gods are usually symbolic to internal .alchemy.like the three pure ones being vitality, energy and spirit, the three treasure we are all born with. Theses powers are in all of us and not power from an outside agency of authority.

 

Within the religious realm these gods have duties just as the 4 seasons regulate each other.The gods are put in charge so to speak of the natural world and act as regulators and protectors of the world (positive and negative). Non religious deities tend to be actual people who inspire us to their level of awareness / immortality.

[Wu Ming Jen]

Thank you for the very informative addition to the thread . Btw, is the http://www.wudangdao.com/WUDANG/WUDANG_shan.htm site, where you got the above quote, yours? Nice layout and photos!! Thunder God Hole is definitely a place I would love to visit when I eventually make it out that way.

Thank you, My school is the Taoist Association, Wudang Taoist Kung Fu academy.. Wudang Dao is another school that is awesome and a great site for pics. One year I traveled with my youngest son to study on the mountain with him and he liked the feel of thunder god hole best. My son wanted to explore the cave and I stopped him and gave him a head lamp because he could have fallen into the spring without a light lol

[BaguaKicksAss]

Thank you, My school is the Taoist Association, Wudang Taoist Kung Fu academy.. Wudang Dao is another school that is awesome and a great site for pics. One year I traveled with my youngest son to study on the mountain with him and he liked the feel of thunder god hole best. My son wanted to explore the cave and I stopped him and gave him a head lamp because he could have fallen into the spring without a light lol

 

Talking about metaphors for internal alchemy, I would say this Thunder Hole is full of them!

What an awesome place to live near (the whole mountain I mean).

[DragonsNectar69k]

Hahahaa. The God's are real. Just last week I met the Lord of Hosts. It concerned a ritual in a dream in a old catholic cathedral. I almost crapped myself when I woke up that morning. A lot of respect for that Higher Being and I haven't been to a Catholic church in years.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voice_of_God