Living Life is a totally misconstrued taoist concept

[tulku]

Absolutely!!!

 

Back to this question though:

 

If you renounced the concept of renunciation, what do you have left?

 

 

Nothingness

[FixXxer1846]

oh yeah sure with just a feewwwww minor exceptions here and there

 

like the difference between burning down monasteries and building them for example hahahaha

 

read chinese propeganda much? :D

 

You are only worried about the monasteries? Maybe not today, but the monasteries should have been taken down. They were part of the ruling class. The ordinary peasant in Tibet had no rights. A landlord allied with the Dalai Lama could rape a peasant's/slave's wife and cut off his balls and eviscerate him when he protested. Happened a lot. Dalai Lama were no better than the Vatican or the Taliban. But that's the normal state of the world. That's how power works. That is why democracy has been invented.

 

Chinese propaganda? Didn't I just tell you I have nothing with Mao or communism? But you worry about your monasteries. I prefer to look at the lowest classes.

[Stigweard]

[Harmonious Emptiness]

You are only worried about the monasteries? Maybe not today, but the monasteries should have been taken down. They were part of the ruling class. The ordinary peasant in Tibet had no rights. A landlord allied with the Dalai Lama could rape a peasant's/slave's wife and cut off his balls and eviscerate him when he protested. Happened a lot. Dalai Lama were no better than the Vatican or the Taliban. But that's the normal state of the world. That's how power works. That is why democracy has been invented.

 

Chinese propaganda? Didn't I just tell you I have nothing with Mao or communism? But you worry about your monasteries. I prefer to look at the lowest classes.

 

references? sources? You can't just toss that out there without some backup information

[Aaron]

I can tell you right now, Aaron.

 

You will be the one who will be suffering in bondage to your desires for all of eternity.

 

I don't hate myself. On the contrary, I love myself.

 

What I do hate however are all those "enlightened" poseurs who think they hold all the answers to the universe just because they caught a glimpse of oneness.

 

If you are truly enlightened, then let me ask you. Do you have the capacity to communicate with the gods and even the Creator/Tao/Universe himself?

 

Of course not. You are just pretending to be "enlightened" while indulging yourself in the everyday luxuries of life because you are too weak-willed to resist the energies of desires conjured up by external beings.

 

What's needed to transcend these desires is not religion, suffering or even spirituality.

 

What's needed to transcend these desires is the acceptance of death as the inevitability of life.

 

Why do people indulge in their senses? Because they are afraid of Death and they indulge in their senses to feel alive!

 

As I said before, I expect the energies of desires to come down upon you much harder than before and I expect that you will suffer in bondage to your desires for the rest of this life-time and for eternity until your soul becomes so tired it will dissolve into nothing as a result of endless incarnations of lifetimes of desires.

 

That will be the punishment for one enslaved in desires.

 

You are so off base I don't know where to begin, so I wont. If you wish to live in a fantasy world of your choosing, that's your choice. The fact that you can't even understand what I'm saying tells me that it's pointless to talk to you.

 

You did a good job of trying to touch a nerve, but it's hard to touch a nerve when there isn't one present. Your pushing buttons that do nothing, but I see that your buttons are all very much still attached. I would wager this has to do with your desire to maintain an image of enlightenment. I could care less if you think I'm enlightened or not, I know what I know, which is this...

 

You will never be clean so long as you think you need to be clean. You will never be pure so long as you think you need to be pure. So long as you think you need to be good, then you will always be evil. Remember that, because one day it's going to smack you upside the head.

 

Aaron

 

edit- One thing though, why are you stuck on this creator/tao/universe "himself" idea. The universe is not a him. So long as the universe is created in your image, you will always see it in that light. If it helps you to sleep at night I have an intimate relationship with the universe, he is well endowed and passionate. and yes I can communicate with him, he just doesn't talk back.

Edited September 6, 2011 by Twinner

[tulku]

You are so off base I don't know where to begin, so I wont. If you wish to live in a fantasy world of your choosing, that's your choice. The fact that you can't even understand what I'm saying tells me that it's pointless to talk to you.

 

You did a good job of trying to touch a nerve, but it's hard to touch a nerve when there isn't one present. Your pushing buttons that do nothing, but I see that your buttons are all very much still attached. I would wager this has to do with your desire to maintain an image of enlightenment. I could care less if you think I'm enlightened or not, I know what I know, which is this...

 

You will never be clean so long as you think you need to be clean. You will never be pure so long as you think you need to be pure. So long as you think you need to be good, then you will always be evil. Remember that, because one day it's going to smack you upside the head.

 

Aaron

 

edit- One thing though, why are you stuck on this creator/tao/universe "himself" idea. The universe is not a him. So long as the universe is created in your image, you will always see it in that light. If it helps you to sleep at night I have an intimate relationship with the universe, he is well endowed and passionate. and yes I can communicate with him, he just doesn't talk back.

 

I already told you.. you are hardly enlightened..

 

the creator/tao/universe does talk back but he only talks back to high-level practitioners..

 

taming their desires and culling the indulgence of the senses are like fundamental ABCs for these high-level practitioners..

 

anyway good luck to you and your life.. you gonna need it.. lol

[Marblehead]

Don't delude yourself. A mere petty human who can't even determine his own fate can never judge a being like me.

 

What a wonderful and powerful ego you have there Tulku!

 

I think you have a whole lot of work to do.

[Marblehead]

well i am walking the talk now if you haven't sensed it by now.

 

No, you are spreading fertilizer.

[Marblehead]

the only thing that can make me feel happy and fulfilled right now is if i gain enlightenment.. and i am going to focus on nothing but enlightenment for the rest of my life

 

What a wonderful life that should be. Living to your full potential. WoW!!!

[Marblehead]

cause my scissors aren't that sharp!!

 

Are you playing with your willy again?

[Marblehead]

again, i don't know why i'm even wasting my time typing this.. DOH! you got me tulku now you can bask in some more attention that you don't deserve sheesh

 

Hehehe. 'Cause you love the challenge. Not very Taoish. But then, I'm here so what can I say?

[Marblehead]

I think he will make much progress ...

 

How that is quite a statement.

 

It even points to the suggestion that he has so very far to go still.

 

I really do hope he finds what he is looking for but from what I have seen he has no idea what it is he is looking for. With luck it might come along and slap him aside the head.

[Marblehead]

Buddhism may fit you better than Taoism.

 

I would call that an understatement.

[Marblehead]

I was addicted to sex and now I am not.

 

I'm still addicted but can't get an erection. How sad. Hehehe.

[Marblehead]

Okay. I didn't like a couple things you said in this post but I do want to highlight this:

 

... it is not that people have no control over their desires. It is that your consciousness is too weak to control and resist your desires.

 

There is limited truth in this.

 

But then, if we did not have the desires in the first place we wouldn't have to resist them.

 

Lao Tzu and Chuang Tzu both suggest that we lessen our desires.

 

Can we look at a beautiful, sexy woman, admire her beauty without any thoughts of taking her to bed?

 

We can admire the beauty of life without having the need to partake of everything. The need is only the ego screaming out.

[Marblehead]

If you are arguing for renunciation, you are attached to it.

 

Right now my ass is attached to my chair. No, I don't want to give up this attachemnt.

[tulku]

[Marblehead]

I don't care much about all the intricacies of Taosim either ...

 

Well, I do.

[Marblehead]

How is enlightenment escapism?

 

How is trying to evolve to a higher state of consciousness escapism?

 

Are you trying to tell me there are no higher forms of beings out there in the universe whose consciousness is so high that they would not fall into the addictions of sex, women, food, fun and anything else that indulge the senses?

 

Is our whole damn existence only about sex, women, food, fun and indulgence of the senses?

 

Are the Tibetan and other monks escapist? Are the mountain Taoist sages escapist?

 

If so, then you know what, I do pride myself in being a escapist. What's the fricking karmic penalty for being a escapist like the monks?

 

Good response Tulku.

 

Yeah, escapism is not what you are striving for. But then, I think you shouldn't be striving at all but that's just my opinion.

[Marblehead]

There is a point where even city married life is just yet another attachment.

 

Wow! You and Stig really got attached there, didn't you?

[Marblehead]

I don't think your efforts will ever be sufficient to hijack this thread.

 

I love that phrase, "I don't think ..."

 

I have been guilty of that, Oh!, so many times.

[Marblehead]

Hello Tulku,

 

You are ignorant.

 

Hi Aaron. I know Tulku started it but you know better than to do that.

[Marblehead]

When we can cultivate the eye to see beneath the surface of things, often, we may be filled with surprising finds, just like when one goes treasure hunting. The good things are often laid hidden beneath, or sometimes, people cover up the good things as a sort of camouflage so that the gems are not gotten at by too many, in which case they may end up devalued. I could be wrong, but i think in many aspects, Taoism is something like that.

 

Yep.

[Stigweard]

I'm still addicted but can't get an erection. How sad. Hehehe.

 

Right now my ass is attached to my chair. No, I don't want to give up this attachemnt.

What is it with you and your chair already ?!!

 

[Marblehead]

If you renounced the concept of renunciation, what do you have left?

 

 

If you take the chair out from under Marblehead's ass what do you have left?

 

Marblehead sitting on the floor.

 

You can never get rid of everything. All we can do is change our relationship with things.