Endless desire

[stirling]

13 hours ago, Tommy said:

Don't know if I am doing this wrong or not. Or maybe just too early??? Not looking forward to demons and voices.

 

Demons and voices are "makyo":

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makyō

 

They are distractions that come from the thinking mind. If your mind is still, they aren't there by definition. The stillness is the deeper reality of these experiences - the thing that is ALWAYS there when the mind is allowed to stop.

 

Many experiences of all kinds occur during meditation. Most of them are blissful. Some people have supernatural experiences, some don't. It's good to have recourse to a proper teacher to check in with who has seen and understands these experiences, so that when things like this happen they can be framed in their proper perspective and there is some tuning of your practice where problems arise. 

 

@Cadcam, if you are continuing to experience anhedonia you should really be in contact with a mental health professional.

[old3bob]

I'd say that besides types of illusions that may only be in our heads or that might be downplayed or written off as only that, there are real beings that are predatory dark souls which are not written off so easily or just by philosophical thoughts.   Thus all the thousands of years of  work that protective beings have done and are doing, along with teachings and methods that have been used against such forces.

 

Btw, most orthodox shrinks know nothing of the other side...and also write off problem's related to it as just a mental or emotional delusions.

 

 

[Tommy]

1 hour ago, old3bob said:

I'd say that besides types of illusions that may only be in our heads or that might be downplayed or written off as only that, there are real beings that are predatory dark souls which are not written off so easily or just by philosophical thoughts.   Thus all the thousands of years of  work that protective beings have done and are doing, along with teachings and methods that have been used against such forces.

 

Btw, most orthodox shrinks know nothing of the other side...and also write off problem's related to it as just a mental or emotional delusions.

Sounds like stuff that myths and legends are made from. "Thousands of years of work that protective beings have done". If I was writing a novel then I would like to use that. Would you mind? There is no doubt that "there are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in your philosophy". "most orthodox shrinks know nothing of the other side". Thumbs up.

 

Sterling said, "Demons and voices are "makyo"

 

Thanks for the reminder.

Edited Monday at 08:00 PM by Tommy

[old3bob]

1 hour ago, Tommy said:

Sounds like stuff that myths and legends are made from. "Thousands of years of work that protective beings have done". If I was writing a novel then I would like to use that. Would you mind? There is no doubt that "there are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in your philosophy". "most orthodox shrinks know nothing of the other side". Thumbs up.

 

Sterling said, "Demons and voices are "makyo"

 

Thanks for the reminder.

 

good luck when your time comes...

[SodaChanh]

3 hours ago, old3bob said:

I'd say that besides types of illusions that may only be in our heads or that might be downplayed or written off as only that, there are real beings that are predatory dark souls which are not written off so easily or just by philosophical thoughts.   Thus all the thousands of years of  work that protective beings have done and are doing, along with teachings and methods that have been used against such forces.

 

Btw, most orthodox shrinks know nothing of the other side...and also write off problem's related to it as just a mental or emotional delusions.

 

 

 

I was reminded by this 

 

 

You know constant wifi bombardment, mobile radiation, bad food, constant collective negativity also plays a role. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Lairg]

6 hours ago, stirling said:

Demons and voices are "makyo":

 

I like to test propositions.  My ignorance often amazes me.  How could I believe such stupid things?  

 

I am with Shakespeare:

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

 

 

Edited yesterday at 12:10 AM by Lairg

[stirling]

12 minutes ago, Lairg said:

I like to test propositions.  My ignorance often amazes me.  How could I believe such stupid things?  

 

I am with Shakespeare:

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

 

Did you read the supplied link? Yes, believing that they have any intrinsic reality would be a mistake, but denying their occasional appearance in consciousness would be a mistake. From the link:

 

Quote

"Makyō are the phenomena–visions, hallucinations, fantasies, revelations, illusory sensations–which one practicing zazen is apt to experience at a particular stage in his sitting. ...Never be tempted into thinking that these phenomena are real or that the visions themselves have any meaning. To have a beautiful vision of Buddha does not mean that you are any nearer becoming one yourself, any more than a dream of being a millionaire means you are any richer when you awake."

— Hakuun Yasutani, in Philip Kapleaus's The Three Pillars of Zen, pp. 42-44

 

Non-duality is a deeper level of reality than the duality of God/devil/angel and man. Testing IS important, but using other dualistic phenomena to determine what is "real" is a flawed process. The realization of the non-dual reality is a complete perspective shift - the litmus test of what is "real" afterward happens in comparison with that STILL VISIBLE realization.

[Lairg]

43 minutes ago, stirling said:

Testing IS important, but using other dualistic phenomena to determine what is "real" is a flawed process.

 

So my physical brain can never know

[stirling]

The science that pointed to the brain being where the experience of being originates is known to be flawed, and has been for many years, so yes. Here is a nice article on this topic:

 

https://tricycle.org/article/six-questions-b-alan-wallace/

 

...or, if you are more science minded:

 

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9490228/

 

-

 

Setting that aside for a moment - if you were asleep and based your reality on experiments done in your dream, your experiments MIGHT have some sort of seeming circular reality, but when you finally woke up you would dismiss them outright. The same goes here - it is entirely possible to "wake up" from the dream of duality and see that there is a deeper, more real level of reality that includes and suffuses the reality you already experience.

[SodaChanh]

Relationship to your parents could also be an issue. How is that going? 

[steve]

20 hours ago, stirling said:

 

@Cadcam, if you are continuing to experience anhedonia you should really be in contact with a mental health professional.

 

I agree, anonymous strangers online may not be the best resource under the circumstances.

[Tommy]

14 hours ago, steve said:

 

I agree, anonymous strangers online may not be the best resource under the circumstances.

Sometimes it takes a stranger to point out something is wrong.  It just takes a bigger/humble person to be able to accept good advice.

[Lairg]

1 hour ago, Tommy said:

Sometimes it takes a stranger to point out something is wrong

 

I tend to test before committing fully

 

[Lairg]

On 1/6/2026 at 12:38 PM, stirling said:

if you were asleep and based your reality on experiments done in your dream, your experiments MIGHT have some sort of seeming circular reality, but when you finally woke up you would dismiss them outright.

 

Usually I go back in time and step into the dream again and do experiments to test my hypotheses.  Sometimes I do that with a friend watching the scene in the dream.  

 

[Nungali]

On 1/6/2026 at 1:38 PM, stirling said:

The science that pointed to the brain being where the experience of being originates is known to be flawed, and has been for many years, so yes. Here is a nice article on this topic:

 

https://tricycle.org/article/six-questions-b-alan-wallace/

 

...or, if you are more science minded:

 

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9490228/

 

-

 

Setting that aside for a moment - if you were asleep and based your reality on experiments done in your dream, your experiments MIGHT have some sort of seeming circular reality, but when you finally woke up you would dismiss them outright. The same goes here - it is entirely possible to "wake up" from the dream of duality and see that there is a deeper, more real level of reality that includes and suffuses the reality you already experience.

 

 

Lairg probably doesn't though    . 

 

Dreams seem  connected to many  drives of the psyche , including desires .