"Buddhism Has Nothing To Do With Vajrayana"

[Annnon]

The title is a quote from this comment I found on the Reddit about Tantra, the person who did the post said the following: 

 

"There is nothing such as Vajrayāna Buddhism, it is Cināchāra with Buddha-Pādukā, Buddhism has nothing to do with Vajrayāna. Just because Buddha-Pādukā is present, doesn't mean it's origin is marked by buddhism.

The whole Vajrayāna Flourished as A part of Sahajayāna of Kaula dharma. Whatever these fanatic Modern day Buddhists believe does nothing to us Nepalese Following Sarvāmnāya. I bet these Rascals "Buddhists" doesn't even know what āmnāya they follow as well.

Hypocrites"

 

I'm new to the "Tantra world", I understood Vajrayana Buddhism as being a form of "Tantric Buddhism", but it seems like the majority of the deities there comes from Indian Tantric Systems and he says that Vajrayana is not even buddhist.

 

Anyone who knows more about this or disagrees, feel free to share your opinion.

[Apech]

The exact origins of Vajrayana are hard to pin down historically.  However I think it is fairly safe to say that the form of Buddhism which was transmitted to Tibet in two waves mainly in the 8th and 10th Centuries was the same as what was being practiced mainstream in Northern India at the time.  And thus is actually Buddhism and not some kind of strange hybrid which the person is suggesting.  I suspect the poster is Nepalese Hindu and thus is anti- Buddhist in some way which is uncertain.

 

Those are my thoughts anyway.

[stirling]

In terms of what is Buddhist or not Buddhist there are a few things I like to keep in mind:

 

The teachings of the Buddha weren't set down in writing until 500 years after his death, and were captured by disciples generations later. How pure are they to the intent of Gautama Buddha? We will never know. We do know that they have led many students to realization, and that should be the litmus test on which they are judged.

 

Indian Buddhism and tantric Shiavism travelled to China and intermixed with the VERY compatible Dao, Tibetan folk/Vajrayana, and Ch'an practices creating Tibetan Buddhism, Daoism, and Zen. Teachers didn't really keep these separate as "schools" until MUCH later. We do know that they have led many students to realization, and that should be the litmus test on which they are judged.

 

An enlightened teacher will tell you that ALL of these (and let's add Sufi poets, Patanjali, the Upanishads and MUCH MORE) point to the same things, and that their practices works from different aspects to illuminate the students. What matters is that the authors of these works and the teachers that teach them UNDERSTAND what is being said. We do know that they have led many students to realization, and that should be the litmus test on which they are judged.

 

My opinion is that Buddhism isn't about Guatama Buddha, it is about ALL Buddhas, including the ones at your local Tibetan Buddhist center.

 

- 

 

Food for thought: Buddhism of any kind, and in fact any set of practices, has nothing to do with enlightenment. Holding this question in your mind might even be what "enlightens" "you".

[Gerard]

11 hours ago, Annnon said:

Anyone who knows more about this or disagrees, feel free to share your opinion.

Basically another iteration of "my kung fu is better than yours." Ignore them all but embrace this philosophy:

 

"Many paths lead to the top of the mountain."

 

[Salvijus]

Vajrayana is maybe 10% buddhism 90% everything else. It's a bit cringe that "buddhism" is their front cover title to me. You might aswell call them druids or shamans or christians or satanists and you'll be just as accurate. 

Edited 37 minutes ago by Salvijus