Is hinduism mentioned in christianity

[Sanity Check]

 

 

In the bible, when Moses ascends Mount Sinai to commune with God.

 

The hebrews worship a golden calf.

 

We know hinduism contains crossover with worship of cows and calves.

 

Can the dots be connected in such a way as to deduce the hebrews were influenced by hinduism to some degree?

[Apech]

9 hours ago, Sanity Check said:

 

 

In the bible, when Moses ascends Mount Sinai to commune with God.

 

The hebrews worship a golden calf.

 

We know hinduism contains crossover with worship of cows and calves.

 

Can the dots be connected in such a way as to deduce the hebrews were influenced by hinduism to some degree?

  More likely to be an Egyptian influence.

[Maddie]

There is no archeological evidence that the Exodus actually ever happened, so it is important when reading these narratives to ask the question "what point were the authors trying to make". Most scholars agree that most of the Hebrew bible was written during the Babylonian exile and that much of the emphasis was writing to encourage Hebrews to not mix with the local Babylonian culture and customs. They couldn't do this directly since they were being held captive in Babylon so most likely condemning Egyptian practices was how they accomplished this, so thus the "golden calf" story.

[Daniel]

16 hours ago, Sanity Check said:

In the bible, when Moses ascends Mount Sinai to commune with God.

 

It's common cross culture and in geographically distant people.

 

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The hebrews worship a golden calf.

 

Not all of them, only 3000.  The story describes a people from the idolatry of egypt.  And the idol worship was intended to be prohibitted.

 

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We know hinduism contains crossover with worship of cows and calves.

 

Same with egypt...

 

 

 

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Can the dots be connected in such a way as to deduce the hebrews were influenced by hinduism to some degree?

 

Nope.  Not at all.  Not even close.  I've interacted with others who have tried to make this connnection and it's always a fail.

 

Although it does make sense that wise people come up with similar ideas.

 

2 hours ago, Maddie said:

There is no archeological evidence that the Exodus actually ever happened, so it is important when reading these narratives to ask the question "what point were the authors trying to make". Most scholars agree that most of the Hebrew bible was written during the Babylonian exile and that much of the emphasis was writing to encourage Hebrews to not mix with the local Babylonian culture and customs. They couldn't do this directly since they were being held captive in Babylon so most likely condemning Egyptian practices was how they accomplished this, so thus the "golden calf" story.

 

I think there are details here that are good to point out and consider.

 

1)  It's not that there is no evidence.  There is some evidence, but nothing conclusive.  A million or more people?  No evidence of that.

 

2)  When people use the phrase "was written during the babylonian exile" it's not true that most scholars agree to this if it is understood literally.  Almost no one agrees that that during the babylonian exile the stories were "written" as if there was a team of writers sitting at a table constructing a story and writing it in a scroll.  If any scholars agree to that, it is the extreme fringe minority. 

 

The concensus is that there are 2 voices, 2 styles of writing, in the Torah.  One is "priestly", one is "non-priestly".  The 4 source documentary hypothesis has been abandoned by almost everyone excluding scholars and Rabbis attached to Reform Judaism where it has been preached from the pulpit and indoctrinated into their children for almost 100 years. 

 

There are differing opinions about how these two sources became one unified Torah, but, the end result which was **complied** and formalized during the babylonian exile is a "literary unity" with a consistent and coherent message of a single God, not multiple Gods as the Reform Movement and other critics choose to super impose onto it.  Those of us in the orthodox community knew the DH with its multiple Gods and multiple authors was a weak theory dead on arrival.  But it was nice to recieve vindication and validation of this in 2011, then the DH was officially disproven. 

 

Below are links describing this.   Of specfic interest for those who would like to understand what happened in 2011 is the JSTOR article proving there are 2 and only 2 "voices" / "writing styles" in the Torah.  Reading the full article is possible with a free google account.  If anyone is having trouble logging in to JSTOR to read it, please let me know.

 

https://www.jstor.org/stable/10.15699/jbl.1342.2015.2754  <--- Computer analysis disproving the 4 source Documentary Hypothesis

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Composition_of_the_Torah

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Composition_of_the_Torah#Collapse_of_the_documentary_consensus

 

From the above:

 

"The general trend in recent scholarship is to recognize the final form of the Torah as a literary and ideological unity, based on earlier sources, likely completed during the Persian period (539-333 BCE)."

 

"COMPLETED during the Persion period."

 

"COMPLETED" = "Compiled, maybe editted, but NOT WRITTEN, NOT COMPOSED, NOT CONCEIVED.  That happened earlier.  The Persion period is Terminus Ante Quem, TAQ, the absolute latest beginning."  

 

Here's archeological evidence demonstrating this.  The stories, and ideas predated the Persion period.   The temple is most convincing, especially the altar and the sacrifices match descriptions in the Torah.  The temple dates to around 900BCE, the ideas predate it.  Likely greatly predate it.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketef_Hinnom

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tel_Arad#Israelite_temple

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tel_Arad#Israelite_fort_ostraca

https://www.jstor.org/stable/3211023

 

Edited November 6, 2023 by Daniel

[Daniel]

7 hours ago, Apech said:

  More likely to be an Egyptian influence.

 

Exodus 12:38

 

וגם־ערב רב עלה אתם וצאן ובקר מקנה כבד מאד׃

And a mixed multitude went up also with them; and flocks, and herds, and very many cattle.

 

Numbers 11:4

 

והאספסף אשר בקרבו התאוו תאוה וישבו ויבכו גם בני ישראל ויאמרו מי יאכלנו בשר׃

And the mixed multitude that was among them had a strong craving; and the people of Israel also wept again, and said, Who shall give us meat to eat?
 

According to the story, there was a group of non-Israelites ( not from the House of Jacob ) tagging along.  Probably egyptian, but also others.  Many flocked to egypt during the great famine.  Acording to the story, they DID have a stong inflluence on the House of Jacob.  This is a recurring theme.   Especially in the middle/late chapters of Ezekiel. 

 

Edited November 6, 2023 by Daniel

[Apech]

7 minutes ago, Daniel said:

 

Exodus 12:38

 

וגם־ערב רב עלה אתם וצאן ובקר מקנה כבד מאד׃

And a mixed multitude went up also with them; and flocks, and herds, and very many cattle.

 

Numbers 11:4

 

והאספסף אשר בקרבו התאוו תאוה וישבו ויבכו גם בני ישראל ויאמרו מי יאכלנו בשר׃

And the mixed multitude that was among them had a strong craving; and the people of Israel also wept again, and said, Who shall give us meat to eat?
 

According to the story, there was a group of non-Israelites ( not from the House of Jacob ) tagging along.  Probably egyptian, but also others.  Many flocked to egypt during the great famine.  Acording to the story, they DID have a stong inflluence on the House of Jacob.  This is a recurring theme.   Especially in the middle/late chapters of Ezekiel. 

 

 

 

Those damn back sliding cow worshippers!

 

 

[NaturaNaturans]

The golden calf, wasnt that cananite ba’al, asscociated with child sacrifice? Or Moloch maybe?

[Daniel]

28 minutes ago, Apech said:

Those damn back sliding cow worshippers!

 

If only it was limited to worship.  It starts with the worship, then they have a bit too much wine and start tipping them.  That's certainly a capital offense.  

 

Do you have that where you are?  Cow tipping?

 

Edited November 6, 2023 by Daniel

[Daniel]

19 minutes ago, NaturaNaturans said:

The golden calf, wasnt that cananite ba’al, asscociated with child sacrifice? Or Moloch maybe?

 

Nope.  But even if it was, it's verboten.  So if there is a connection, it's polemic.

 

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/polemic

 

( If you're watching YouTube atheists and critics, they usually get this one wrong )

 

Edited November 6, 2023 by Daniel

[Apech]

23 minutes ago, Daniel said:

 

If only it was limited to worship.  It starts with the worship, then they have a bit too much wine and start tipping them.  That's certainly a capital offense.  

 

Do you have that where you are?  Cow tipping?

 

no the cows round here tend to stay upright.

[NaturaNaturans]

28 minutes ago, Daniel said:

 

Nope.  But even if it was, it's verboten.  So if there is a connection, it's polemic.

 

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/polemic

 

( If you're watching YouTube atheists and critics, they usually get this one wrong )

 

Maybe so.

___________
My fav cow, the primordal and cosmic one, i present to you, Audhumbla:

 

[Daniel]

58 minutes ago, NaturaNaturans said:

Maybe so.

___________
My fav cow, the primordal and cosmic one, i present to you, Audhumbla:

 

Never heard of her, but she's definitely ... impressive.

 

Edited November 6, 2023 by Daniel

[old3bob]

there is mention of pagan and or idol worshippers in the Bible, so indirectly many native and far eastern religions were hardly or basically unknown to most of the earlier middle eastern Jews and Christians and if they were known would not be valid or worse per the fanaticism, ignorance, self-serving and co-opting manipulation of power that was and still is in effect via  parts of the Old and New testament!  So one might wonder if the "esoteric" or "mystic" Jesus will ever have the Bible rewritten for us humans at the "mundane" level or will we have to muddle through somehow along with thousands of more years of fundamentalist religious violence and destruction going on in the world. (when it now looks like much of mankind will be fortunate to exist here in another 10-25-50 or 75 years as the dominate species on a planet that is being environmentally, psychologically and astrally overwhelmed!)

Edited November 7, 2023 by old3bob