All for One, and One for all, We are all Entagled in Quantum Weirdness

[Zhongyongdaoist]

Here is an interesting article on Quantum Mechanics and how it is reshaping the view of physics and the nature of reality.

Why More Physicists Are Starting to Think Space and Time Are ‘Illusions’

I hope people find this "enlightening".

 

ZYD

 

 

[Kojiro]

According to Kant time and space are part of our mental structure through which we perceive and understand the world. They are part of our psique, and it is impossible for us to perceive the external world without time and space.

[steve]

Good ole’ DaoBums synchronicity!

 

I’ve been reading, and came to post about:

Quantum cognition - quantum models for cognition and decision making. It’s becoming a very predictive approach of course. 

 

Popular -

https://www.livescience.com/quantum-like-model-of-decision-making-proposed.html

 

 

Technical -

https://jbusemey.pages.iu.edu/quantum/TICS.pdf

 

[Mark Foote]

What Gödel found was the possibility of a hitherto unimaginable kind of universe. The equations of general relativity can be solved in a variety of ways. Each solution is, in effect, a model of how the universe might be. Einstein, who believed on philosophical grounds that the universe was eternal and unchanging, had tinkered with his equations so that they would yield such a model—a move he later called “my greatest blunder.” Another physicist (a Jesuit priest, as it happens) found a solution corresponding to an expanding universe born at some moment in the finite past. Since this solution, which has come to be known as the Big Bang model, was consistent with what astronomers observed, it seemed to be the one that described the actual cosmos. But Gödel came up with a third kind of solution to Einstein’s equations, one in which the universe was not expanding but rotating. (The centrifugal force arising from the rotation was what kept everything from collapsing under the force of gravity.) An observer in this universe would see all the galaxies slowly spinning around him; he would know it was the universe doing the spinning, and not himself, because he would feel no dizziness. What makes this rotating universe truly weird, Gödel showed, is the way its geometry mixes up space and time. By completing a sufficiently long round trip in a rocket ship, a resident of Gödel’s universe could travel back to any point in his own past.
 

Einstein was not entirely pleased with the news that his equations permitted something as Alice in Wonderland-like as spatial paths that looped backward in time; in fact, he confessed to being “disturbed” by Gödel’s universe. Other physicists marvelled that time travel, previously the stuff of science fiction, was apparently consistent with the laws of physics. (Then they started worrying about what would happen if you went back to a time before you were born and killed your own grandfather.) Gödel himself drew a different moral. If time travel is possible, he submitted, then time itself is impossible. A past that can be revisited has not really passed. And the fact that the actual universe is expanding, rather than rotating, is irrelevant. Time, like God, is either necessary or nothing; if it disappears in one possible universe, it is undermined in every possible universe, including our own.
 

Gödel’s conclusion went almost entirely unnoticed at the time, but it has since found a passionate champion in Palle Yourgrau, a professor of philosophy at Brandeis. In “A World Without Time: The Forgotten Legacy of Gödel and Einstein” (Perseus; $24), Yourgrau does his best to redress his fellow-philosophers’ neglect of the case that Gödel made against time. The “deafening silence,” he submits, can be blamed on the philosophical prejudices of the era. Behind all the esoteric mathematics, Gödel’s reasoning looked suspiciously metaphysical. To this day, Yourgrau complains, Gödel is treated with condescension by philosophers, who regard him, in the words of one, as “a logician par excellence but a philosophical fool.” After ably tracing Gödel’s life, his logical achievements, and his friendship with Einstein, Yourgrau elaborately defends his importance as a philosopher of time. “In a deep sense,” he concludes, “we all do live in Gödel’s universe.”

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2005/02/28/time-bandits-2

[Invisible Acropolis]

18 hours ago, Zhongyongdaoist said:

Here is an interesting article on Quantum Mechanics and how it is reshaping the view of physics and the nature of reality.

Why More Physicists Are Starting to Think Space and Time Are ‘Illusions’

 

whenever I see articles like this, i try to point out the origins of such concepts... but most often it is an unwelcome exchange, and very little to no "enlightenment" seems to happen

 

Quote

maya, (Sanskrit: “magic” or “illusion”) a fundamental concept in Hindu philosophy, notably in the Advaita (Nondualist) school of Vedanta. Maya originally denoted the magic power with which a god can make human beings believe in what turns out to be an illusion. By extension, it later came to mean the powerful force that creates the cosmic illusion that the phenomenal world is real. For the Nondualists, maya is thus that cosmic force that presents the infinite brahman (the supreme being) as the finite phenomenal world. Maya is reflected on the individual level by human ignorance (ajnana) of the real nature of the self, which is mistaken for the empirical ego but which is in reality identical with brahman.

 

And I must point out that the concept itself is much more detailed and pervasive, even since the Rig Veda.

 

Quote

Māyā (Sanskrit: माया), a word with unclear etymology, probably comes from the root mā^{[13][14][15][16]} which means "to measure".^[17][18]

The same word is also found in the Avestan language: māyā with the meaning of "magic power".

 

According to Monier Williams, māyā meant "wisdom and extraordinary power" in an earlier older language, but from the Vedic period onwards, the word came to mean "illusion, unreality, deception, fraud, trick, sorcery, witchcraft and magic".^[4][12] However, P. D. Shastri states that the Monier Williams' list is a "loose definition, misleading generalization", and not accurate in interpreting ancient Vedic and medieval era Sanskrit texts; instead, he suggests a more accurate meaning of māyā is "appearance, not mere illusion".^[7]

 

And even these modern interpretations lack much of the context where the term originally appears - and as most of us know, it is the context which gives true meaning to a particular term - rather than simple definitions alone.  It is found in many hymns of the Rig Veda, which is the oldest known Hindu text.

 

For example: 

Quote

1. The wise behold with their mind in their heart the Sun, made manifest by the illusion of the Asura;
The sages look into the solar orb, the ordainers desire the region of his rays.
2. The Sun bears the word in his mind; the Gandharva has spoken it within the wombs;
sages cherish it in the place of sacrifice, brilliant, heavenly, ruling the mind.
3. I beheld the protector, never descending, going by his paths to the east and the west;
clothing the quarters of the heaven and the intermediate spaces. He constantly revolves in the midst of the worlds.

 

— Rig veda X.177.1-3

 

alternately:

 

1. The sapient with their spirit and their mind behold the Bird adorned with all an Asura's magic might. Sages observe him in the ocean's inmost depth: the wise disposers seek the station of his rays.

2. The flying Bird bears Speech within his spirit: erst the Gandharva in the womb pronounced it: And at the seat of sacrifice the sages cherish this radiant, heavenly-bright invention.

3. I saw the Herdsman, him who never resteth, approaching and departing on his pathways. He, clothed in gathered and diffusive splendour, within the worlds continually travels.

 

[Netero]

Just now, Mark Foote said:

“In a deep sense,” he concludes, “we all do live in Gödel’s universe.”

 

Some more so than others, perhaps. I present to you:

 

The Curious Tale of Steven Kubacki

 

Quote

Steve grew up in South Deerfield, MA, in a lower middle class family, where his father worked in a tire factory and mother was a secretary at the University of Massachusetts. He graduated from Deerfield Academy in 1972 as a day-student, where he would spend many hours in its college-like library cutting classes and rebelling.  From Hope College in 1979, he received a BA in German Studies—a default major because he just had enough credits after having switched major a dozen times or so.  In 1983, he earned a MA in Linguistics/TOEFL (Ohio University). However, he found linguistics a bit too academic and yearned for more intense human-to-human interactions, subsequently enrolling in a PhD Clinical Psychology program at the University of New Mexico.  During his stay there, he was awarded a Fulbright-Hays Fellowship in the Departments of Philosophy and Psychoanalysis at Frankfurt University in Germany, where he studied under Dr. Rohde-Dachser and Juergen Habermas. 

 

After finishing a 2-year internship at Dartmouth Medical School in 1992, he became a professor at the University of Wyoming and while there was awarded a Fellowship by the American Psychoanalytic Association.  In 1998, he became the Director of Clinical Training at Argosy University-Seattle.  Later he served as Chair of the Department of Psychology at Bastyr University until 2003. He currently has a full-time clinical practice and wants someday to become a full-time writer/blogger.

 

Excerpt from his own website. Quite a remarkable individual. 

What he fails to mention, perhaps for sensible reason, is that he made major headlines in the late 70's and is quite infamous as a hub for various conspiracy theories. 

 

As a student in February 1978, Steve went on a solo skiing trip in the SE area of Lake Michigan. He was reported missing the following day. Investigators found his skis and staffs, with a set of footprints from these that led to the edge of the Lake. And, here they stopped. The ice on the Lake hadn't been broken and no steps back was found. It was as if he had disappeared into thin air. I believe at some point that he was declared legally dead.

 

15 months later, without any recollection of what had happened, Steve woke up in a meadow in Pittsburg, MA, some 700 miles from where he had gone missing. He was wearing clothes that was not his and carrying a bag full of maps he did not recognize. He knocked on his fathers door, who lived 40 miles from where he woke up, and was surprised to learn that he had been missing for so long. He did not remember much. He felt like he had been running. He refused to talk to the media, as he had no recollection of things, and refused to speak to a psychologist, as he was adamant that there was nothing wrong with him mentally. He did not piggyback his strange story either  -- there were no press conferences, no books, no movie rights, no tours of tall tales. Silence. 

 

Some 39 years later, in 2017 (his autobiography ends in 2003), there was an interesting book published, co-authored by Steven Kubacki himself and Brian Blackmore. It's a most curious title; Meta-Mathematical Foundations of Existence: Gödel, Quantum, God & Beyond

 

From his own website, he summarises the following;

 

Quote

Goedel’s Theorems of Incompleteness and Inconsistency

 

Goedel's famous Incompleteness Theorem states that in any system of axioms*, supposing that the system is consistent, there will always be at least one statement pertinent to that system of axioms that can neither be proved nor disproved. All axiomatic systems are inherently incomplete.  No axiomatic system is thereby capacity of determining the validity of all statements within its system of axioms. More simply, any theory, system, or interrelated set of ideas, that is, anything we can think of, is inherently incomplete. There will always be aspects of any system or theory that the system or theory cannot explain, account for, or made valid.

 

Goedel’s second strong conclusion proves the following: In any consistent axiom system it is impossible to prove that the axioms are consistent. Even more radically, the second strong statement proves that if we can show that there is no contradiction in our beliefs, then in fact there is a contradiction in our beliefs!

 

To briefly summarize Goedel’s Theorems of Incompleteness and Inconsistency:

 

1. Incompleteness: There are always questions any set of axioms cannot answer.

2. Inconsistency: There are always contradictions in any set or system of axioms

 

Any system of ideas, beliefs, or axioms, that offers a complete answer to existence, or a complete answer to all the questions of the universe, or for that matter, all the questions in any other system, is necessarily incomplete and inconsistent. Without a doubt, there are always flaws in the arguments presented by any set of axioms. Contradictions must exist even if they have yet to be found.

 

Kubacki-Blackmore Theorems of Totality and Boundary Conditions

 

1. Kubacki-Blackmore Theorem of Totality. This theorem proves that the incompleteness and insufficiency of any X is an infinite incompleteness or uncertainty. The totality of this infinity results in a definition of existence where everything known, imaginable, and unimaginable exists and is interconnected. The totality of everything imaginable and unimaginable is equated with the totality of existence or God. Finiteness and certainty are thereby shown to be untrue and illusionary.

 

2. Kubacki-Blackmore Theorem of Boundary Conditions. This theorem proves that any set of axioms, theories, physical systems, or any X, must have limits and boundaries in order to maintain coherence, structure, and order. Without boundaries and limitations nothing could be cogently analyzed, chaos would ensue, and separateness among objects would not be possible. These boundaries, however, are not constant nor fixed, but probabilistic and change in interaction with the rest of existence.

 

*Axioms are assumptions or statements that are presumed to be true.

 

Which I found VERY interesting and digestible. Quantum mechanics is certainly not my kind of soup as I do not have the brains for it, but it seems that Gödel was to physics as what Sextus Empiricus was to philosophy. 

 

As a final note, it would seem that one of Steven's protégés saw his story in the news, having known him for 6 years prior and called him up to see what's up.  To his surprise, Steven consented to spill the beans, but I have yet to see the book in print. Something very particular did strike my attention though; 

 

Quote

Alternate timelines are explored, bolstered by Steven's own assertion that our universe is at best incomplete, and at worst inconsistent. 

 

 

It is my firm belief that Steven had experienced this "inconsistency" personally. 

 

[iinatti]

On 1.2.2023 at 9:52 PM, Zhongyongdaoist said:

reshaping the view of physics and the nature of reality.

 

Could not help posting this painting of Newton by William Blake, who had similar writings about the illusory nature of physics (or Maya as @Invisible Acropolis cooly pointed out).  Something about it says it all to me. 

 

 

Still honing my Blake, but here is one quote I found ("Natural" ~ Maya as I understand it, which is not well):  

 

Quote

The Natural power continually seeks & tends to Destruction,
Ending in death: which would of itself be Eternal Death.
And all are Class'd by Spiritual & not by Natural power.

And every Natural Effect has a Spiritual Cause, and Not
⁠A Natural: for a Natural Cause only seems: it is a Delusion
Of Ulro & a ratio of the perishing Vegetable Memory.

 

Milton 27:41-46.

 

 

 

Edited February 3, 2023 by Magister Ludi

[Cobie]

obsolete now

Edited February 3, 2023 by Cobie

[C T]

QUANTUM VACUUM
The Unified Field

Scientists have discovered that when all classical sources of matter and energy are removed, creating what is referred to as a vacuum, there is still energy present, even at absolute zero.

 

This discovery has redefined empty space with the definition of a quantum vacuum – a substantive quantized medium filled with harmonic zero-point energy oscillations. This sea of continuous energetic oscillations has now been identified by some physicists as the elemental source of all mass, form, and structure. To give rise to mass, form, and structure, the quantum vacuum must have coherent modes of oscillations.

 

The geometry of these oscillation modes are now being discovered by scientists to have very fundamental functions at the base of reality, and that this constant flux of quantum energy is intrinsically and integrally entangled.

 

~ Nassim Haramein 

 

 

[steve]

They’re slowly creeping up on it…

Beautiful to watch it unfold, both hlundrub and kadag and the brilliant minds trying to define them.

Both equally vibrant and genuine.

 

[Mark Foote]

10 hours ago, Netero said:

 

Some more so than others, perhaps. I present to you:

 

The Curious Tale of Steven Kubacki

 

Not sure he has summarized the second theorem correctly, but I have yet to see and understand the proof in the theory of logic in which it is based.  

Suffice it for me that if the axioms of the theory can be used to prove all that is known in the theory, then a contradiction can be derived from the axioms.  If the axioms do not give rise to a contradiction, then they cannot be used to prove everything that is known in the theory.

That Godel also provided a solution to Einstein's equations in which past, present, and future intertwine--there is a Zen koan about that, a master talking about something that happened generations prior as though he were the cause.  Intrestin'...

[iinatti]

8 hours ago, Cobie said:

“Part of me thinks Blake” had been inspired by reading the DDJ.

 

Edited that part out... meant as a joke  :  ) .  This is an interesting question, though--whether/how he was influenced by eastern thought.  Prob not for this thread.  Not studied Blake much before, though quickly becoming an enthusiast 

[C T]

3 hours ago, steve said:

They’re slowly creeping up on it…

Beautiful to watch it unfold, both hlundrub and kadag and the brilliant minds trying to define them.

Both equally vibrant and genuine.

 

The modern physicists are only now unravelling Gautama's Indra's Net analogy. 

 

Quote

 

“Far away in the heavenly abode of the great god Indra, there is a wonderful net which has been hung by some cunning artificer in such a manner that it stretches out indefinitely in all directions. In accordance with the extravagant tastes of deities, the artificer has hung a single glittering jewel at the net’s every node, and since the net itself is infinite in dimension, the jewels are infinite in number. There hang the jewels, glittering like stars of the first magnitude, a wonderful sight to behold. If we now arbitrarily select one of these jewels for inspection and look closely at it, we will discover that in its polished surface there are reflected all the other jewels in the net, infinite in number. Not only that, but each of the jewels reflected in this one jewel is also reflecting all the other jewels, so that the process of reflection is infinite. The Hua’yen school [of Buddhism] has been fond of this image, mentioned many times in its literature, because it symbolizes a cosmos in which there is an infinitely repeated interrelationship among all the members of the cosmos. This relationship is said to be one of simultaneous mutual identity and mututal intercausality.”

 

~ Francis H. Cook, Hua-yen Buddhism: The Jewel Net of Indra

 

 

[Invisible Acropolis]

On 2/3/2023 at 12:32 AM, C T said:

The modern physicists are only now unravelling Gautama's Indra's Net analogy. 

 

Guatama himself, ever the reformer, did the same for this ancient concept as he did with the (less ancient) concept of the Atman.

 

Quote

 

Vast indeed is the tactical net of great Indra, mighty of action and tempestuous of great speed. By that net, O Indra, pounce upon all the enemies so that none of the enemies may escape the arrest and punishment.

This great world is the power net of mighty Indra, greater than the great. By that Indra-net of boundless reach, I hold all those enemies with the dark cover of vision, mind and senses.

 

- Atharva Veda, Verse 8.8.6. - Verse 8.8.8 

 

 

[Zhongyongdaoist]

On 2/1/2023 at 1:12 PM, steve said:

Good ole’ DaoBums synchronicity!

 

I’ve been reading, and came to post about:

Quantum cognition - quantum models for cognition and decision making. It’s becoming a very predictive approach of course. 

 

Popular -

https://www.livescience.com/quantum-like-model-of-decision-making-proposed.html

 

 

Technical -

https://jbusemey.pages.iu.edu/quantum/TICS.pdf

 

I finally have some time to reply to my own topic, my attention having be waylaid by other matters.  I'm glad to see that it has had some good responses which bring up some of my favorite topics, a list of which would be "incomplete" without Kurt Goedel and some others which I will address as I continue to post here on various aspects of the subject, but first I want to address the subject of Quantum Mechanics and consciousness which I have brought up in several past posts such as this:

On 8/8/2014 at 12:02 PM, Zhongyongdaoist said:

If you would like a really interesting read try:

 

Physics in Mind, Werner R. Lowenstein

 

Two separate links above by the way. Here you can read about information arrows, quantum sensation and about how Maxwell's demon found work designing quantum molecules, that cleverly exploit the relationship between entropy and information, which Lowenstein calls 'Demon Molecules'. I always knew there was a place for him somewhere in quantumville.

One of my earlier explorations of quantum consciousness was in the early days of quantum computing, in the first few years of he new Millennium, in order to examine the question of whether a quantum computer could explain consciousness as a computer better than an ordinary computer model could, my answer at the time was no, that consciousness could not be explained away in a mechanical fashion, even a quantum mechanical one.

 

I hope to have more time for the many topics which this thread opens up to my far to copious mind and imagination.

 

ZYD