Lightseeker

LMP, SonOfTheGods, Mercury Fire Blood and Honey

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4 hours ago, liminal_luke said:

Immortality or a slice of pecan pie with a side of vanilla Hagen Daz.  Such a hard decision...

 

Damn it started all good, and now there are pies everywhere.

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9 hours ago, thelerner said:

 It's seems so rare that if I plug 'Longman Pie Chicago' into Google I get restaurants and pie recipes.   Which is too bad.  

Try spelling it Long Men Pai 😁

 

The top thread in Fuxi have a link to a Texan that can initiate you as a Daoist priest, and like a supermarket you can choose between traditions including Long Men Pai.

Ian Duncan also teaches from this tradition. 

 

These are first generation westerners doing this. Wait 10 years, and their students will have diluted the teachings and started to write books. 

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Just listening to this man Mercury Fire Blood Honey this morning.

 

Whilst I appreciate his diligent cultivation and individualism, I would like to point out some "errors" in his reasoning.

 

Just Energy : Part of the Whole

We are not just part of the whole, we are individuating, we are becoming unique intelligences and unique energy beings.   Anyone who prevents that and causes you to dissolve back in the world energy will kill you.   
However for a monkey to "wake up" he has to feel the universal energy first to open his horizons from monkey mind, in order to finally discover his own individualism.   Hence it is said that once the Father is known, the Son is born.
 

Just Energy : No It's More Complicated

We are also not "just energy".   We are energy transformation engines.   In the same way the plant species of the planet are not "just lying there", they exist to transform sunlight through photosynthesiss .... we likewise as more advanced crops, are not "just here".   We are transforming energy of many types, all our functions relate to this, they are developed to transform energy.   And that includes intelligence, food, air, it is a transformation of energy.
As engines we need to burn cleanly, and learn how to service ourselves, in order that we transform energy correctly as a part of the entire universe's project.
So .... just feeling "more energy" is a very crude thing.

Energy Warfare Vs Waking Up
This man has an endless war with other energy beings.   And his solution is beefing up, and then beefing up again.   But how long will this go on for before you are exhausted ?  And how can such a simple frail man like Ramana Maharshi live effortlessly with no beefing ?
Clearly there is a different order of spirituality that leads to peace that requires no beefing up, at least not at the end.
The answer is that the recognition of the true self is effortless and lifts you out of the crude world of energy wars.   The end.

Therefore the recognition of the true self must be transmitted on the first day and every day, as it is the answer.   Of course you have to know how to do that.

Subconscious Spirituality vs Real Spirituality

In the Conscious world there are no crazy people, because they no longer struggle, they are in the kingdom of God.
So where are the energy demons that this man talks of ?   Where do they live ?
They are in the Subconscious world, a half sleep half dream half awake nightmare.   Humans are already in this world.
You do not want to stay in this world, nor do you want to fight with the beings in this world, who are all one eyed.
There are many hierarchies and powers and spells and magic blue firebird energies here.   There are many beings of "power", with their little groups of subconscious one-eyed followers.   It's like Marvel DC land.
But in the end it is the land of terrible suffering.
I advise you to leave asap.

 

Energy Work's Purpose

A sane use of energy work might be to preserve your life (but not too much), and to get to know yourself through flexing your energetic muscles.
Beyond that you need to let go of it, and awaken to God, and surrender to God. 
The God, and there is only one.

Then you will enter effortless truth-peace.

 

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6 minutes ago, rideforever said:

We are not just part of the whole, we are individuating, we are becoming unique intelligences and unique energy beings.   Anyone who prevents that and causes you to dissolve back in the world energy will kill you.   
However for a monkey to "wake up" he has to feel the universal energy first to open his horizons from monkey mind, in order to finally discover his own individualism.

 

This is a complex question. The key lies in a soul and soul based practice are hard to grasp. Your "self" might not be "real" self, just a dirt that is reflected in the mirror.

 

Without working with previous reincarnation this discussion will be pointless. Individualism changes when you got 50 or 100 personas living inside one body.

 

11 minutes ago, rideforever said:

 In the same way the plant species of the planet are not "just lying there", they exist to transform sunlight through photosynthesiss

 

Good point.

 

10 minutes ago, rideforever said:

This man has an endless war with other energy beings. 

 

I have been on astral plane, does not sound like it is possible to go there and be at peace. It is a war zone. Those who are at peace, dont ever go there. You can be as peaceful as you want, but still be eaten alive by some monster or a demon. You might be thinking that this world is not real and is only a projection of human inner self, but that is not true.

 I have met real demons and they are as real as anybody here.

 

13 minutes ago, rideforever said:

the energy demons that this man talks of ?   Where do they live ?

 

They live on energy planes above ours.

 

15 minutes ago, rideforever said:

Beyond that you need to let go of it, and awaken to God, and surrender to God. 
The God, and there is only one.

 

Sounds like giving up control on your life. Not the path for everyone to take. And the God mentioned must be a superstition. There is no God out there at all. There are different powers including your inner self, which you may be calling God, but it just a tiny light of a soul.

 

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God (1) refers to being Conscious and living in the Conscious plane.

Then you can see straight for the first time, and in seeing straight you experience reality.

In doing so you become connected to the spirit behind existence itself, or God (0).

So God as a term points initially towards the means to reality, and then finally to the spirit behind reality, it is a good and meaningful term.

At a lower level God (2) is expressed to monkeys as "the big monkey in the sky", which again is not incorrect, just an explanation given to those on a lower plane.

God (2) leads to God (1) which leads to God (0).

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9 hours ago, Mudfoot said:

Try spelling it Long Men Pai 😁

 

The top thread in Fuxi have a link to a Texan that can initiate you as a Daoist priest, and like a supermarket you can choose between traditions including Long Men Pai.

Ian Duncan also teaches from this tradition. 

 

These are first generation westerners doing this. Wait 10 years, and their students will have diluted the teachings and started to write books. 

Ten years isn't so long.   Googling Long Men Pai Chicago, gave me some Youtube videos and maybe 1 in 5 articles having to do w/ the art.  No local schools, but thats not surprising.  Course I'm not looking for anything exotic these days. 

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I wouldn't put them down just because they seem to be having a bit of fun, they could be onto something. I doubt any serious traditional schools will pay any attention to them. I assume they're not even Chinese or pretending to be from a trad. lineage.

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10 hours ago, kondensation said:

I wouldn't put them down just because they seem to be having a bit of fun, they could be onto something. I doubt any serious traditional schools will pay any attention to them. I assume they're not even Chinese or pretending to be from a trad. lineage.

We don't pretend to be chinese or trace lineages through random dead dudes. :P

 

We are our own lineage.

 

What others do is their own business.  None of it affects us as long as they don't go poking around where they shouldn't anyways lol

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16 hours ago, rideforever said:

God (1) refers to being Conscious and living in the Conscious plane.

Then you can see straight for the first time, and in seeing straight you experience reality.

In doing so you become connected to the spirit behind existence itself, or God (0).

So God as a term points initially towards the means to reality, and then finally to the spirit behind reality, it is a good and meaningful term.

At a lower level God (2) is expressed to monkeys as "the big monkey in the sky", which again is not incorrect, just an explanation given to those on a lower plane.

God (2) leads to God (1) which leads to God (0).

We dont use your definition of "god" which would be extremely limited for our purposes.  

 

Keep in mind that we are not a taoist offshoot.  As I've mentioned before we are, among other things, antitaoist. 

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On 7.4.2019 at 5:44 AM, Forwards said:

We don't pretend to be chinese or trace lineages through random dead dudes. :P

 

We are our own lineage.

 

What others do is their own business.  None of it affects us as long as they don't go poking around where they shouldn't anyways lol

 

If you do your thing and you're honest about it, it shouldn't bother people. I saw some back and forth... but honestly, I don't know what the conflict is about.

 

On 7.4.2019 at 5:47 AM, Forwards said:

Keep in mind that we are not a taoist offshoot.  As I've mentioned before we are, among other things, antitaoist. 

 

In what sense are you anti-taoist?

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3 hours ago, kondensation said:

 

If you do your thing and you're honest about it, it shouldn't bother people. I saw some back and forth... but honestly, I don't know what the conflict is about.

 

 

In what sense are you anti-taoist?

Easiest way to think about it is that if it is a religion or established belief system we don't like it.  The specifics and whys probably don't matter much if you're not considering joining or are a member.

 

That's only if you're considering joining, though.  We don't walk the streets at night looking to burn taoists or lynch christians.  Although if one of our members turns out to be THE antichrist we'd probably organize a get together to celebrate.  Maybe do some pickup mma bouts or have a bake/protein sale for an animal based charity. 

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11 minutes ago, Forwards said:

Easiest way to think about it is that if it is a religion or established belief system we don't like it.  The specifics and whys probably don't matter much if you're not considering joining or are a member.

 

That's only if you're considering joining, though.  We don't walk the streets at night looking to burn taoists or lynch christians.  Although if one of our members turns out to be THE antichrist we'd probably organize a get together to celebrate.  Maybe do some pickup mma bouts or have a bake/protein sale for an animal based charity. 

 

This hearty attitude is why I enjoy the Loneman Pai fellows. I don't practice it, but I sure would love to grab a beer with them and party in the vein of the Beastie Boys

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18 minutes ago, Forwards said:

Easiest way to think about it is that if it is a religion or established belief system we don't like it.  The specifics and whys probably don't matter much if you're not considering joining or are a member.

 

That's only if you're considering joining, though.  We don't walk the streets at night looking to burn taoists or lynch christians.  Although if one of our members turns out to be THE antichrist we'd probably organize a get together to celebrate.  Maybe do some pickup mma bouts or have a bake/protein sale for an animal based charity. 

 

This statement suggests a belief system.

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8 minutes ago, lifeforce said:

 

This statement suggests a belief system.

Semantics get tricky, but you do have a point worthy of consideration. When someone says they don’t believe in God - I always tell them that is still a belief. 

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39 minutes ago, lifeforce said:

 

This statement suggests a belief system.

Spot on!  Everyone believes things (...i hope haha) but are they the boss or are you?

 

I use beliefs, methods and theories like I use tools.  If I'm building a house its different tools than baking a pie ( again i hope :P )

 

Again, we are a magick based lineage.  I believe in many gods, spirits, entities, etc. But none as a figure of worship.

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51 minutes ago, Earl Grey said:

 

This hearty attitude is why I enjoy the Loneman Pai fellows. I don't practice it, but I sure would love to grab a beer with them and party in the vein of the Beastie Boys

We always talk about get togethers but we're usually busy or solitary.

 

If we do end up having a get together that isnt closed down for members only I'll buy you a beer bro haha

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Posted (edited)
On 09/04/2019 at 12:09 AM, Forwards said:

Spot on!  Everyone believes things (...i hope haha) but are they the boss or are you?

 

I use beliefs, methods and theories like I use tools.  If I'm building a house its different tools than baking a pie ( again i hope :P )

 

Again, we are a magick based lineage.  I believe in many gods, spirits, entities, etc. But none as a figure of worship.

 

I could be mistaken but I think you are the only person here  that thinks like that ... or at least, expressed it that way .

 

I sparked up when I read that, I often write stuff like that myself and try to explain it to people when the question of belief arises, but I usually get no response or a strange look.

 

Yes ! Belief should be part of one's 'tool kit'. Like the mind should be .   One's beliefs can change due to trauma - like a blow to the head, so what does that say about any 'objective reality' for our beliefs. I studied some Comparative religion at Uni and the first units where about belief and the nature of belief, the lecturer made its dynamics pretty clear, but really, only me and two others in a class of around 35 got it .  The lecturer said that was normal. Oh yes, every one ELSE had beliefs but their own  beliefs ( a lot  of them where Christian and doing the course as a preliminary to seminary studies .)  where fact, revelation, or divinely inspired  :D  ... and they could not understand why the others thought that was funny. 

 

I tried to explain it recently to someone ;   I have a set of beliefs about what happens when I die ; I believe  ... this or that belief ...and it has changed over the course of my life. But if someone asks me what do I think will actually happen when I die   ................ dunno  :huh: .        

 

That just seems to confuse most people .

 

Gee !  One day, people might start realising the same thing about their emotions.

 

We need to see our tools as tools and not our identity or let them  loose place in the hierarchical structure of our being  -  and this of course implies that something is 'the king' of all these forces 'that are not us'  :ie. the seat of identity or what should be regulating our whole 'internal orchestra' ;.

 

The body is our tool , most get that.  The , mind is usually given the place of 'Master Controller', but it should not be, it is third in hierarchy. I already mentioned, the emotions, another tool.

 

As we rise up the internal hierarchy of forces they become more subtle, harder to control and more difficult to realise as 'tools'  (as ; where does identity lie, if not in the body, the mind or the emotions ? ) . Then we get to the level of 'spirit' ,  one's essential nature, whatever we bring with us into life, including our genetic coding .   Now it starts getting more complex, so I will leave it there.

 

In Exo-psychology the 'master controller' is in circuit 7 - the neuro - electric circuit. In magick, it is symbolised by  the magician  wearing his crown, with wand and sword ( master and king of the forces in himself and of evocation and invocation).

 

But talk about these concepts to most, and you loose them .

 

A note on 'worship' ; you can use worship in the same way as belief ; it can supply a need ( perhaps its two way ? ) to those parts of the self that thrive on it.  Its one of the main 'paths'   ;

 

Gnana-Yoga. Union by Knowledge.
Raja-Yoga. Union by Will.
Bhakta-Yoga. Union by Love.
Hatha-Yoga. Union by Courage.
add Mantra-Yoga. Union through Speech.
Karma-Yoga. Union through Work.

 

The Holy Qabalah. Union by Knowledge.
The Sacred Magic. Union by Will.
The Acts of Worship. Union by Love.
The Ordeals. Union by Courage.
add The Invocations. Union by Speech.
The Acts of Service. Union through Work.

 

( and their negative manifestation ;

 

If this idea be any but the Supreme and Perfect idea, and the student lose control, the result is

insanity,

obsession,

fanaticism,

 paralysis and death

 addiction to gossip

incurable idleness.

 

- 'Postcards to Probationers'. )

 

 I have found it very beneficent , if understood,  but risky ..... like love and relationship, one needs to commit and feel it and dissolve , then one can feel wonderful and get all sorts of energy and benefit, but one can 'fall' into it, loose control somewhat ... get 'sucked in', then one's magical ritual of worship can become 'religion'.  LIke how the Hare Krishna's practice 'Bhakti Yoga'  but are totally tied up into 'religion' . You have to 'give' but not too much so you dont 'fall' but you cant really get full benefit UNLESS you fall .   Tricky .

 

Crowley said it was the MOST dangerous path of magick  ( due to similar reasons to the above  )

 

As a form of magic, I have found that it   works REALLY  well .

 

On that note and the use of worship in  (higher) Magick , Liber Astarte    has  some great observations in it ;

 

" This is the Book of Uniting Himself to a particular Deity by devotion. ....

 

.https://www.sacred-texts.com/oto/lib175.htm

 

 

Edited by Nungali
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Posted (edited)
On 09.04.2019 at 11:51 PM, Nungali said:

 

I could be mistaken but I think you are the only person here  that thinks like that ... or at least, expressed it that way .

 

I sparked up when I read that, I often write stuff like that myself and try to explain it to people when the question of belief arises, but I usually get no response or a strange look.

 

Yes ! Belief should be part of one's 'tool kit'. Like the mind should be .   One's beliefs can change due to trauma - like a blow to the head, so what does that say about any 'objective reality' for our beliefs. I studied some Comparative religion at Uni and the first units where about belief and the nature of belief, the lecturer made its dynamics pretty clear, but really, only me and two others in a class of around 35 got it .  The lecturer said that was normal. Oh yes, every one ELSE had beliefs but their own  beliefs ( a lot  of them where Christian and doing the course as a preliminary to seminary studies .)  where fact, revelation, or divinely inspired  :D  ... and they could not understand why the others thought that was funny. 

 

I tried to explain it recently to someone ;   I have a set of beliefs about what happens when I die ; I believe  ... this or that belief ...and it has changed over the course of my life. But if someone asks me what do I think will actually happen when I die   ................ dunno  :huh: .        

 

That just seems to confuse most people .

 

Gee !  One day, people might start realising the same thing about their emotions.

 

We need to see our tools as tools and not our identity or let them  loose place in the hierarchical structure of our being  -  and this of course implies that something is 'the king' of all these forces 'that are not us'  :ie. the seat of identity or what should be regulating our whole 'internal orchestra' ;.

 

The body is our tool , most get that.  The , mind is usually given the place of 'Master Controller', but it should not be, it is third in hierarchy. I already mentioned, the emotions, another tool.

 

As we rise up the internal hierarchy of forces they become more subtle, harder to control and more difficult to realise as 'tools'  (as ; where does identity lie, if not in the body, the mind or the emotions ? ) . Then we get to the level of 'spirit' ,  one's essential nature, whatever we bring with us into life, including our genetic coding .   Now it starts getting more complex, so I will leave it there.

 

In Exo-psychology the 'master controller' is in circuit 7 - the neuro - electric circuit. In magick, it is symbolised by  the magician  wearing his crown, with wand and sword ( master and king of the forces in himself and of evocation and invocation).

 

But talk about these concepts to most, and you loose them .

 

A note on 'worship' ; you can use worship in the same way as belief ; it can supply a need ( perhaps its two way ? ) to those parts of the self that thrive on it.  Its one of the main 'paths'   ;

 

Gnana-Yoga. Union by Knowledge.
Raja-Yoga. Union by Will.
Bhakta-Yoga. Union by Love.
Hatha-Yoga. Union by Courage.
add Mantra-Yoga. Union through Speech.
Karma-Yoga. Union through Work.

 

The Holy Qabalah. Union by Knowledge.
The Sacred Magic. Union by Will.
The Acts of Worship. Union by Love.
The Ordeals. Union by Courage.
add The Invocations. Union by Speech.
The Acts of Service. Union through Work.

 

( and their negative manifestation ;

 

If this idea be any but the Supreme and Perfect idea, and the student lose control, the result is

insanity,

obsession,

fanaticism,

 paralysis and death

 addiction to gossip

incurable idleness.

 

- 'Postcards to Probationers'. )

 

 I have found it very beneficent , if understood,  but risky ..... like love and relationship, one needs to commit and feel it and dissolve , then one can feel wonderful and get all sorts of energy and benefit, but one can 'fall' into it, loose control somewhat ... get 'sucked in', then one's magical ritual of worship can become 'religion'.  LIke how the Hare Krishna's practice 'Bhakti Yoga'  but are totally tied up into 'religion' . You have to 'give' but not too much so you dont 'fall' but you cant really get full benefit UNLESS you fall .   Tricky .

 

Crowley said it was the MOST dangerous path of magick  ( due to similar reasons to the above  )

 

As a form of magic, I have found that it   works REALLY  well .

 

On that note and the use of worship in  (higher) Magick , Liber Astarte    has  some great observations in it ;

 

" This is the Book of Uniting Himself to a particular Deity by devotion. ....

 

.https://www.sacred-texts.com/oto/lib175.htm

 

 

 

*Writing @Nungali name into a secret tdb club, voidisyinyang waiting for you there*

Edited by GSmaster

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On 4/9/2019 at 4:51 PM, Nungali said:

 

I could be mistaken but I think you are the only person here  that thinks like that ... or at least, expressed it that way .

 

I sparked up when I read that, I often write stuff like that myself and try to explain it to people when the question of belief arises, but I usually get no response or a strange look.

 

Yes ! Belief should be part of one's 'tool kit'. Like the mind should be .   One's beliefs can change due to trauma - like a blow to the head, so what does that say about any 'objective reality' for our beliefs. I studied some Comparative religion at Uni and the first units where about belief and the nature of belief, the lecturer made its dynamics pretty clear, but really, only me and two others in a class of around 35 got it .  The lecturer said that was normal. Oh yes, every one ELSE had beliefs but their own  beliefs ( a lot  of them where Christian and doing the course as a preliminary to seminary studies .)  where fact, revelation, or divinely inspired  :D  ... and they could not understand why the others thought that was funny. 

 

I tried to explain it recently to someone ;   I have a set of beliefs about what happens when I die ; I believe  ... this or that belief ...and it has changed over the course of my life. But if someone asks me what do I think will actually happen when I die   ................ dunno  :huh: .        

 

That just seems to confuse most people .

 

Gee !  One day, people might start realising the same thing about their emotions.

 

We need to see our tools as tools and not our identity or let them  loose place in the hierarchical structure of our being  -  and this of course implies that something is 'the king' of all these forces 'that are not us'  :ie. the seat of identity or what should be regulating our whole 'internal orchestra' ;.

 

The body is our tool , most get that.  The , mind is usually given the place of 'Master Controller', but it should not be, it is third in hierarchy. I already mentioned, the emotions, another tool.

 

As we rise up the internal hierarchy of forces they become more subtle, harder to control and more difficult to realise as 'tools'  (as ; where does identity lie, if not in the body, the mind or the emotions ? ) . Then we get to the level of 'spirit' ,  one's essential nature, whatever we bring with us into life, including our genetic coding .   Now it starts getting more complex, so I will leave it there.

 

In Exo-psychology the 'master controller' is in circuit 7 - the neuro - electric circuit. In magick, it is symbolised by  the magician  wearing his crown, with wand and sword ( master and king of the forces in himself and of evocation and invocation).

 

But talk about these concepts to most, and you loose them .

 

A note on 'worship' ; you can use worship in the same way as belief ; it can supply a need ( perhaps its two way ? ) to those parts of the self that thrive on it.  Its one of the main 'paths'   ;

 

Gnana-Yoga. Union by Knowledge.
Raja-Yoga. Union by Will.
Bhakta-Yoga. Union by Love.
Hatha-Yoga. Union by Courage.
add Mantra-Yoga. Union through Speech.
Karma-Yoga. Union through Work.

 

The Holy Qabalah. Union by Knowledge.
The Sacred Magic. Union by Will.
The Acts of Worship. Union by Love.
The Ordeals. Union by Courage.
add The Invocations. Union by Speech.
The Acts of Service. Union through Work.

 

( and their negative manifestation ;

 

If this idea be any but the Supreme and Perfect idea, and the student lose control, the result is

insanity,

obsession,

fanaticism,

 paralysis and death

 addiction to gossip

incurable idleness.

 

- 'Postcards to Probationers'. )

 

 I have found it very beneficent , if understood,  but risky ..... like love and relationship, one needs to commit and feel it and dissolve , then one can feel wonderful and get all sorts of energy and benefit, but one can 'fall' into it, loose control somewhat ... get 'sucked in', then one's magical ritual of worship can become 'religion'.  LIke how the Hare Krishna's practice 'Bhakti Yoga'  but are totally tied up into 'religion' . You have to 'give' but not too much so you dont 'fall' but you cant really get full benefit UNLESS you fall .   Tricky .

 

Crowley said it was the MOST dangerous path of magick  ( due to similar reasons to the above  )

 

As a form of magic, I have found that it   works REALLY  well .

 

On that note and the use of worship in  (higher) Magick , Liber Astarte    has  some great observations in it ;

 

" This is the Book of Uniting Himself to a particular Deity by devotion. ....

 

.https://www.sacred-texts.com/oto/lib175.htm

 

 

We seem to have some similar ideas here.  You're obviously dangerous...

 

When ive tried to help people work with and use emotions as tools, masks and helpers i normally just received confusion.   So its usually easier to try and use more buzzword ideas like disassociation and similar to tell people you dont have to be lead by an idea or feeling.  No one likes to hear that as they believe youre placing judgement, unless of course youre dealing with people being torn apart by the stuff and then they love it.

 

Thats hilarious about the uni class because it is the norm. Everyone is delusional but me.

 

Which reminds me of a joke thats the exact same idea that i love telling parents.

 

What's the difference between brats and an angels?   Brats are somebody else's kids.  

 

I get some mixed reactions there... haha

 

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