SeekerOfHealing

Rare Esoteric Buddhist Teachings

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Bodhisattvas are high spiritual beings. In some sutras you have described them I think i Pranjna Paramita or Nagarjuna writings that they know everything and they are everything etc. so good luck with comparing what you think to what it really is.

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@Seeker of Healing, those Bodhisattvas that you refer to are rightly called as Maha-Bodhisattvas, like Earth-store (Kshitigarbha) and Kuan-Yin (Avalokitasvara) Bodhisattvas. However, any one of us on the path, keeping the precepts and practise any of the paramittas without exception, is a bodhisattva. In this context, a bodhisattva is not or may not be an arhant or even within the "4-pairs of persons, the 8-kinds of individuals" a reference to those who are stream-enterer, right up to the category of none-returner. It is this inclusiveness that accepts non-Buddhist saints as bodhisattvas.

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Do you mean 'sunyata' (sanskrit) or 'sunnata' (pali) which means voidness, emptiness? 

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Yes. Only buddhism have bodhichitta which brings to realization of chitta from ultimate perspective which makes bridge to relative. After realization of emptiness world cease to exists but you still can relate to the relative reality which is essentially non existent, that why Diamond Sutra says there is no one to help and no one to save (ultimate perspective) but there are still relative people need to be awaken or "saved". This only can happen thru buddhist means. Even being taoist immortal is still limited, even if the karma of yang shen is milions of bilions of kalpas.  

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Yes. Only buddhism have bodhichitta which brings to realization of chitta from ultimate perspective which makes bridge to relative. After realization of emptiness world cease to exists but you still can relate to the relative reality which is essentially non existent, that why Diamond Sutra says there is no one to help and no one to save (ultimate perspective) but there are still relative people need to be awaken or "saved". This only can happen thru buddhist means. Even being taoist immortal is still limited, even if the karma of yang shen is milions of bilions of kalpas.

 

I would have to disagree. I think you may be attached to a limited view of a (ruler) immortal. Consider the meaning of being the "valley of the universe" and the usefulness of a Buddha....

 

Know the strength of man,

But keep a woman's care!

Be the stream of the universe!

Being the stream of the universe,

Ever true and unswerving,

Become as a little child once more.

Know the white,

But keep the black!

Be an example to the world!

Being an example to the world,

Ever true and unwavering,

Return to the infinite.

Know honor,

Yet keep humility.

Be the valley of the universe!

Being the valley of the universe,

Ever true and resourceful,

Return to the state of the uncarved block.

When the block is carved, it becomes useful.

When the sage uses it, he becomes the ruler.

Thus, "A great tailor cuts little."

 

TTC - Chapter 28

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There was one interview with The Dalai Lama and his reply to a question about Jesus, was that Jesus was a Bodhisattva. Who is considered a Bodhisattva? On a broad perspective, a Bodhisattva is one who kept the precepts (5, 7, 10, or 227) and practise the Paramittas, the Perfections. The basic 5 precepts are inherent in all religions, and in varying degrees, the paramittas, and can be observed and practised without even taking refuge in the Triple Gems. If a person has a good moral bearing, and practises all the precepts and one perfection in his life-time, for all intents and purposes, he is a Bodhisattva. Seeker of Healing is quite right that a Christian saint (having all these attributes) is considered a Bodhisattva. Just like when a 'free-thinker' friend replied to my asking of his faith replied that he has no particular faith, but observe and practise the goodness of heart, in deed and thought. I said to him that in that case, he is a Buddhist, for the Teaching of All the Buddhas is 'Do good, don't do evil, that is the teaching of all the Buddhas!"

I would say that Jesus is a Buddha.

 

To me a Bodhisattva is not someone who does nice things or lives by some precepts. This to me is a Bodhisattva

 

From the Avatamsaka Sutra...

 

 

 

Great bodhisattvas have no attachment to Buddha and do not develop attachments;

 

they have no attachment to the teachings and do not develop attachments; they have

 

no attachment to lands and do not develop attachments; they have no attachments

 

to sentient beings and do not develop attachments. They do not see that there are

 

sentient beings, yet they carry on educational activity, civilizing and teaching ways

 

of liberation; they do not give up the practices of bodhisattvas with great compassion

 

and great commitment. Seeing buddhas and hearing their teachings, they act accordingly;

 

trusting the buddhas they plant roots of goodness, ceaselessly honoring and serving them.

 

 

 

They are able to shake infinite worlds in the ten directions by spiritual powers; their minds are

 

broad, being equal to the cosmos. They know various explanations of truth, they know how

 

many sentient beings there are, they know the differences among sentient beings, they know

 

the birth of suffering, they know the extinction of suffering; while knowing all acts are like reflected

 

images, they carry out the deeds of bodhisattvas. They sever the root of all subjection to birth.

 

 

 

They carry out practices of bodhisattvas for the sole purpose of saving sentient beings and yet

 

do not practice anything. Conforming to the essential nature of all buddhas, they develop a mind

 

like an immense mountain. They know all falsehood and delusion, and enter the door of omniscience.

 

Their knowledge and wisdom are broad and vast and unshakable, due to the attainment of true enlightenment.

 

This is the insight of practical knowledge of equally saving all sentient beings in the ocean of birth and death.

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This stuff works miracles but you need to have big balls to approach those teachings. The way how it transform yourself, how your Sangling examine you and how it put you into situation so you can see your actual state and level of development ... it's just amazing, but this is super hard practice because it's life itself. It's really put you into path which is very hard. A lot of stuff will come your way to face it, so you can look into your heart. How situation unfolds is just beyond reach of my understanding.

 

You will be kicking, crying, begging that this is not going 'your way' but when the thing is actually finish you will be thanking up you Sangling that you actually go this way. It's just amazing. If you will be initiated by yourself and get the Sangling teacher for your own, practice it and you will be amazed.

This happens for everyone including those not initiated or having a sangling.

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No, it's not happens to everyone. If you are not part of school it will not happen to you. Things happen in Harvard or Yale or anything like that do not happen outside them for other people. It's very specific things that happens and how they uncover and everything. It's very unique to this tradition and to this practice. You can think like that but it's far from reality as you have no experience about this. You just thinking about what I posted and thought that you can relate to some things in your imagination which is far from truth. Just practice and you will see if you will be accepted as not all doing ritual will be accepted or will get a sign. 

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This is one of the most interesting schools.

 

Ormus

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@Jonesboy, 

 

I would say that Jesus is a Buddha.

Answer: I've no problem with your personal belief, but what was that that Jesus had awaken from? Perhaps, Yehwa was also a Buddha?


To me a Bodhisattva is not someone who does nice things or lives by some precepts. This to me is a Bodhisattva From the Avatamsaka Sutra...
Answer: Can a person be considered a (Maha-)Bodhisattva but has no ideals (the bodhisattva-ideal), no vows and no practice (which means no faith), does no practise of paramittas? That person has the 'potential' (to be a bodhisattva), the unrealized bodhicitta, and steep in 'ignorance'. 

Great bodhisattvas have no attachment to Buddha and do not develop attachments; (Answer: Yet Cunti and Avalokitasvara are disciples of Amitaba Buddha and 'attached' to him)
they have no attachment to the teachings and do not develop attachments; (Answer: aren't they Buddhists? Again in the Lotus Sutra, homage is first given to Sakyamuni Buddha) they have no attachment to lands and do not develop attachments;
they have no attachments to sentient beings (Answer: they have their vows to save all sentient beings, for instance, Kshitigarbha vowed to 'save' all hell beings) and do not develop attachments. They do not see that there are sentient beings, yet they carry on educational activity, civilizing and teaching ways of liberation;
they do not give up the practices of bodhisattvas with great compassion and great commitment. (Answer: ain't this 'attachment'?) Seeing buddhas and hearing their teachings, they act accordingly; trusting the buddhas they plant roots of goodness, ceaselessly honoring and serving them. They are able to shake infinite worlds in the ten directions by spiritual powers; their minds are broad, being equal to the cosmos. They know various explanations of truth, they know how many sentient beings there are, they know the differences among sentient beings, they know the birth of suffering, they know the extinction of suffering; while knowing all acts are like reflected images, they carry out the deeds of bodhisattvas. They sever the root of all subjection to birth.
They carry out practices of bodhisattvas for the sole purpose of saving sentient beings and yet do not practice anything.(Answer: self-contradictory statement)
Conforming to the essential nature of all buddhas, they develop a mind like an immense mountain. They know all falsehood and delusion, and enter the door of omniscience. Their knowledge and wisdom are broad and vast and unshakable, due to the attainment of true enlightenment. This is the insight of practical knowledge of equally saving all sentient beings in the ocean of birth and death. (Answer: are you referring to the super-normal powers obtained from meditation?)

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@Seeker of Healing, there are degrees of spiritual accomplishment that's why I mentioned about the "4-pairs of persons, and 8-types of individuals" in my earlier post. To destroy the 'three poisons' of anger. greed, and attachment, besides understanding what they are, wisdom and practice are required as well to remove these poisons and to fully realize what is meant by sunyata or sunnata. Do remember that there is no such thing as a Buddhist sunyata or sunnata, though there is an immense body of philosophical discussions on this theme of Emptiness in Buddhist sutras. Similarly, Buddhists are not the only ones inflicted with these three poisons, though other religions may not be as comprehensive in dealing with them as Buddhism.

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No, only Buddhism have depth to realize it fully, other religions are limited. It's been like that from classic suttas to mahayana agamas and sutras.

 

The only compromise mahayana buddhist have is Diamond Sutra which said "all sages and saints are only difference in depth of THIS" which means they are generally the same but the depth is different - depth of realization which is just compromise to not still anger between religions but truth is all other religions are makings of Mara if you study classical buddhist deeply you will find that Mara is "god" of abrahamic religions and other religions. Taoism can be excluded from this if it comes to neidan, but still they are deceived by immortality which will never happen to them.

Edited by SeekerOfHealing
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Hi Sudhamma,

 

I would say that Jesus is a Buddha.

Answer: I've no problem with your personal belief, but what was that that Jesus had awaken from? Perhaps, Yehwa was also a Buddha?

 

I would say Jesus was awakened from the same thing the Buddha was :) As for Yahweh, yes I would agree that he is a Buddha. If you have ever felt their presence, become one with them you would have no doubt.

 

I believe this saying from GOT explains it all.

 

50. Jesus said, "If they say to you, 'Where have you come from?' say to them, 'We have come from the light, from the place where the light came into being by itself, established [itself], and appeared in their image.' If they say to you, 'Is it you?' say, 'We are its children, and we are the chosen of the living Father.' If they ask you, 'What is the evidence of your Father in you?' say to them, 'It is motion and rest.'"

 

 

To me a Bodhisattva is not someone who does nice things or lives by some precepts. This to me is a Bodhisattva From the Avatamsaka Sutra... Answer: Can a person be considered a (Maha-)Bodhisattva but has no ideals (the bodhisattva-ideal), no vows and no practice (which means no faith), does no practise of paramittas? That person has the 'potential' (to be a bodhisattva), the unrealized bodhicitta, and steep in 'ignorance'.

 

Not really sure what you are asking here. Bodhisattva is beyond a disciple, master or an arhat. It is a being who has realized true Wisdom.

 

 

Great bodhisattvas have no attachment to Buddha and do not develop attachments; (Answer: Yet Cunti and Avalokitasvara are disciples of Amitaba Buddha and 'attached' to him)

they have no attachment to the teachings and do not develop attachments; (Answer: aren't they Buddhists? Again in the Lotus Sutra, homage is first given to Sakyamuni Buddha) they have no attachment to lands and do not develop attachments;
they have no attachments to sentient beings

 

Respect, love from an open heart is not attachment.

 

 

they have no attachment to lands and do not develop attachments;
they have no attachments to sentient beings(Answer: they have their vows to save all sentient beings, for instance, Kshitigarbha vowed to 'save' all hell beings)

 

Bodhichitta is again an open heart and the vow is important. It is that helping others which moves one beyond the light past cessation or stopping at that stage of being. I don't think you will find anyone saying bodhichitta is an attachment.

 

 

and do not develop attachments. They do not see that there are sentient beings, yet they carry on educational activity, civilizing and teaching ways of liberation; they do not give up the practices of bodhisattvas with great compassion and great commitment. (Answer: ain't this 'attachment'?)

 

I previously answered that but this is what the Buddha did, did he not? Are you suggesting the Buddha had attachments?

 

 

Seeing buddhas and hearing their teachings, they act accordingly; trusting the buddhas they plant roots of goodness, ceaselessly honoring and serving them. They are able to shake infinite worlds in the ten directions by spiritual powers; their minds are broad, being equal to the cosmos. They know various explanations of truth, they know how many sentient beings there are, they know the differences among sentient beings, they know the birth of suffering, they know the extinction of suffering; while knowing all acts are like reflected images, they carry out the deeds of bodhisattvas. They sever the root of all subjection to birth.

They carry out practices of bodhisattvas for the sole purpose of saving sentient beings and yet do not practice anything.(Answer: self-contradictory statement)

 

Can you explain why you find it self-contradictory?

 

 

Conforming to the essential nature of all buddhas, they develop a mind like an immense mountain. They know all falsehood and delusion, and enter the door of omniscience. Their knowledge and wisdom are broad and vast and unshakable, due to the attainment of true enlightenment. This is the insight of practical knowledge of equally saving all sentient beings in the ocean of birth and death. (Answer: are you referring to the super-normal powers obtained from meditation?)

 

Well I didn't write it but what they are referring to is ultimate emptiness and some of what that Wisdom is like with that realization.

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Hi Jonesboy, thank you for your reply(ies). I'm leaving this thread. May you be well and happy always. Sabbe satta sukhita hontu!

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When it comes to Jesus, there should be wooden plates that tell the story of who taught Jesus, whether they are still around, that's another thing.  When Belief systems look to use Ignorance, they end up destroying what counters their motives. (The same is true for Governments)

 

The word "God" is generalized, One could say God, Yewah and Allah, the same God and Heaven, The Kingdom and Paradise, the same place.  By saying that, The Family of Abraham would be worshiping the same God and have the same Heaven.  If you look at the Holy Books, Quran, Torah and the Bible.  The Quran and Torah share similarities, just the Cultures are different.  But the Bible has been changed so many times, there is only fragments that link to the Quran and Torah.

 

If you know the Fundamentals of the Bodhisattva Path, find the oldest copy of the Quran, read threw it and find Fundamentals buried in it.  But within the beginning pages of the Quran it say's "when you read this Book, remove ownselves", meaning to be Selfless, without Bias.  The same is true with the Torah.  But, there are many paths, all seeking Peace.

 

If it's true about The Family of Abraham, Why not just one Religion?  multiple cultures.  If anyone thinks that there should be one Belief system, know this:  What Belief system has no blood on their hands?  even Buddhist do, you can look in the past.  For there to be one Belief system, none of the Belief systems of this World, nor any God.  But you could say "it's not the Belief system, it's the People."  it's one or the other, so it's better to have multiple Belief systems, all have respect and find Peace.

 

For the original thread:  It's not Buddhist, there are Sutra's that have the influence of Christianity but also their are Lineages.  When Emptiness is added, the real meaning of the word "God" is revealed.  Knowing that meaning, any Sutra that has that word in it, you know the context (True or False Sutra) but also know why "Buddha's are the Teachers of Gods."

 

This "Ultimate Reality" that part of The Family of Abraham is saying is God, actually means "The Realization of Emptiness, Reality as it is" since there is no Ultimate, but Realization comes after understanding and practice.  Should not steal what you do not understand and twist it in your ignorance. 

 

As One said to a Tenzin, the word "Deity" is seen as a God/Goddess, Buddha's and Bodhisattva's are not Gods/Goddess's, the more appropriate word would be "Role models", what you seek to be like, what you seek to walk in the footsteps of, using the words "Role Models" removes ignorance.

 

"No Being knows everything, since everything is:  all that was, is and will be, through the Beginning-less and Endless cycles of Existence."  "With The Profound Wisdom of Emptiness, you only Realize the Fundamental Laws that govern the Beginning-less and Endless cycles of Existence.- Reality as it is."

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Posted (edited)

Keep of Christianity and other fake religions out of this thread. All the newy agey 'universalism' (sameims) interpretation etc. as they are just thoughts without any substances like our universe.

 

Out of respect for this rare and authentic tradition which works for those who have enough luck to be initiated.

Edited by SeekerOfHealing

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Posted (edited)

...

Edited by rex

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