Holy $#!@! Kunlun doesn't DO anything...

[steve]

Welcome back smile.

Can we learn from everything and waste nothing?

[~9~]

Welcome back smile.

Can we learn from everything and waste nothing?

Maybe "waste" is necessary for there to be a "gain" in leaning? (empty the cup to be filled).

 

I like Mizu's insight - I don't like it being re-framed into anything but what the insight was for them. Think of the reverse "Kunlun did it all" - others - "Kunlun did nothing it was all you"... besides I think the insight was the non-doing of the practice... but I have found with task which are inherently frivolous, with no substantial result.... I dedicated seeker, facing a lack of result in their seemingly important task, is left to confront the only element in the endeavor which is of any import (or existing in reality at all) - namely the self. And in confronting the self head way is gained.

 

But I think it is "false cause" to believe the frivolous endeavor as the cause of the result - after all it could be replaced with any other frivolous endeavor and have the same end. At the end of the day it was the dedication and applied effort which brought the result.

 

Replace kunlun with standing on your head - and if you really really believe standing on your head is really really important; standing on your head is something you really really want to get "right", and you are really really willing to change yourself; then eventually you will confront your "self" and make head way.

 

The more frivolous the activity - the more obvious the insight.(the louder you laugh at yourself when you think back on how worked up you got over such a frivolous act). JMHO.

[Pietro]

I think that condensing Mizu's realization in saying that we do everything to ourselves, and kunlun did not do anything to him, because kunlun could not do anything, is making a big disservice to the process he has gone through. And to the realization that he reached. I think that if we come to term with this realization, as a community, we all can make a jump. By changing our attitude toward several practices. And I repeat "several", as in more than one, less than all.

 

To Mizu were done some promises: this practice will give you ... , ... , and ... . He believed those promised, and found himself two years down the line sicker, lonelier, having lost his girlfriend, friends and most of his interesting life. Yes, it was him doing this to himself. No, he is not responsible. Because he approached this practice with an open heart, and full of trust. In another tradition they would have said, from his internal child. But we cannot also blame who taught to him KunLun, in the measure in which those people honestly believed what they were teaching.

 

Somehow we human beings are in this together. We are all together fencing off the darkness of our collective ignorance. This is why we should honor Mizu's awakening and make it our own. And this is why I suspect Buddhists speak about ignorance. At least I suspect so. Not being a Buddhist I might be dead wrong, and maybe they use the word ignorance with an alternative meaning.

 

Also it is false to say that every practice does not do anything, and we always do everything to ourselves. There definitely are practices that "do" things. Of course you need to practice them, but it is the action of the practice that makes you succeed. Not your belief, or your intent, or the purity of your heart, or any other unmeasurable reason that people in spiritual groups tend to use to describe the fact that some things sometimes work and sometimes don't. I am thinking here of a simple exercise like the spinal stretch. it is being taught by Bruce students in the first lesson of the first course. It can do really good things to the spine. No one (I hope!!!) will suggest that doing spinal stretch all day long will do miracles for you. In fact we are specifically told NOT to practice spinal stretch too much. 3 times a day being the limit. And this exercise will do good, but will not solve everything.

 

So here we have a difference:

on the one side we find a school that teaches a practice, saying that it will do all sort of good things, on the other an exercise in another school that give limited results, and should be practiced a limited amount of time. And there are many exercise in many schools that are like this one. I only speak about Bruce because lately I am just practicing his material. But the list is long, of schools and of practices.

 

I think that when a school will tell you that a single practice will do unbelievable things, you have good reasons not to believe her. Or put it in another way, exceptional statements need exceptional proofs.

 

But then someone might say that I am comparing apples and oranges. One is a physical exercise, the other is a spiritual exercise. And many people share the believe, or the hope, that although the physicality is undeniably complicated, the spirituality will be simpler. That eventually there will be a practice that will take care of everything. And we just need to reach that one practice, and then everything will be simpler. Not necessarily un-painful, but uncomplicated. Well, if there is such a practice, and if there is such a level, I sure as hell haven't reached it.

 

So I think this is the second take away message I think there is in this story: spiritual practices are not necessarily simpler.

 

But then there is a third gem in here. And please forgive me if I do not unroot it completely because I am still working on it. We (meaning western culture, or any culture that bought into western values) believe that bliss is a doorway. So many practices use bliss. Kunlun is not the only one. We also have them in the healing tao. But if you really think about it, we have this also in normal life. If spiritual bliss must be a doorway to immortality or enlightenment, then orgasmic bliss should be the doorway to a life long happiness with a person.

 

Think about it, the two concept just mirror each other perfectly.

 

Well, I now think that bliss in not a doorway. Or more specifically it is a doorway, but not to a happy land. Bliss tends to unbalance the hormonal system, and as a result you need more of it to feel good again. It essentially makes you an addicted. An addicted to sex, to spiritual high, to drugs, to adrenaline, you name it. *

 

But if bliss is not the solution (and off go all, -not some in this case, but all- the practices that teach how to reach bliss) then what is the solution?

 

Maybe the Buddhist decision to let go of any desire at least leads in the right direction. You let go of any desire, at least your hormonal system calms down. The dopamine receptors open up, and you start to feel good always. Essentially you reach a semi-bliss state. But you just don't go so high that you need to go down after. You just go as high as you can support yourself. It grows every day, but it never peaks in such a way that the body needs to protect itself from the dopamine surges. So you never feel down.*

 

But maybe is possible to reach this state without giving up "all desires". Just by learning to discern which desires will make you feel bad, and which will not.

 

So all together I think the take away messages are three fold:

-if a practice should do unbelievable things, then you should pay extra attention.

-spiritual practices are not necessarily simpler than physical ones

-bliss is not a doorway to unending happiness, but can be a doorway to addiction (unending unhappiness).

 

 

 

* A bit of basic neuro-physiology can help here. When you experience bliss, you are essentially experiencing surges of dopamine through your brain. The problem is that the body is evolved to protect itself, so when so much dopamine reaches the system, the receiving neurons start to close down the dopamine receptors. So when the peak has ended, you will feel more unhappy, because now your average level of dopamine is filtered by the fact that many dopamine receptors are closed. It takes a few days for the receptors to open up again. (cfr. Cupid's Poisoned Arrow)

[~9~]

 

 

* A bit of basic neuro-physiology can help here. When you experience bliss, you are essentially experiencing surges of dopamine through your brain. The problem is that the body is evolved to protect itself, so when so much dopamine reaches the system, the receiving neurons start to close down the dopamine receptors. So when the peak has ended, you will feel more unhappy, because now your average level of dopamine is filtered by the fact that many dopamine receptors are closed. It takes a few days for the receptors to open up again. (cfr. Cupid's Poisoned Arrow)

 

Epileptics experience a mild high after seizures as well (another form of spontaneous movement). Holding the breath (starvation of oxygen) leads to aschema and damaged (hyper sensitivity) in neurons (hypo-ventilation does the same). Both does mild damage to the the cerebral cortex, where the boundary of self is located. IMHO when prolonged exposure to this can lead to an experience of the "self" dissolving away, thus no boundary between self and world (or any other activity in the brain as well); an "eternal oneness", "merging with everything" sort of experience.

 

After almost a couple decades of this pursuit I don't see these sensations as credibility of a practice. IMO it provides motivation to push along in pursuit where we may have normally lost interest, but really no different than taking drugs. The pushing on is what confronts the "self". Not giving up, not accepting our normal excuses is the mechanism which drives this. The result, like anything else we put our attention too, is growth. Now after so long I don't really see any mechanics of these fancy practices to provide anything more advantageous than any other "ordinary" activity. The same results can be found in washing the dishes if the same dedication and heartfelt passion was applied to that as an endeavor of growth. But of course there are no Master Dishwashers to lead us down that path of nonsense (thank goodness).

[orb]

 

After almost a couple decades of this pursuit I don't see these sensations as credibility of a practice. IMO it provides motivation to push along in pursuit where we may have normally lost interest, but really no different than taking drugs. The pushing on is what confronts the "self". Not giving up, not accepting our normal excuses is the mechanism which drives this. The result, like anything else we put our attention too, is growth. Now after so long I don't really see any mechanics of these fancy practices to provide anything more advantageous than any other "ordinary" activity. The same results can be found in washing the dishes if the same dedication and heartfelt passion was applied to that as an endeavor of growth. But of course there are no Master Dishwashers to lead us down that path of nonsense (thank goodness).

 

You sound pretty healthy, sir. What practice are following these days (if any) if you don't mind me asking?

[~9~]

You sound pretty healthy, sir. What practice are following these days (if any) if you don't mind me asking?

 

Chopping wood, carrying water (and washing the occasional dish - mental hygiene is important too!)

[orb]

Chopping wood, carrying water (and washing the occasional dish - mental hygiene is important too!)

 

 

Perfect! I would add cleaning the house and the car too, but these are just details....

Edited May 13, 2011 by orb

[Aetherous]

Now after so long I don't really see any mechanics of these fancy practices to provide anything more advantageous than any other "ordinary" activity.

 

Well, this is something I disagree with. For instance, running a few miles has different effects from watching a few hours of TV. Positive and negative things can potentially be said of both activities, but in trying to achieve certain goals (like weightloss) running would be more advantageous. To relax and learn something, watching a documentary would be more advantagous than running. From the standpoint of spiritual growth, running and TV watching both have different effects as well...

 

Many of these fancy practices such as Kunlun have different effects from eachother. People often speak of neigung and alchemy here...the Kunlun practice falls into this category. It alters one's internal energy, as well as mind and emotion. People sometimes seek things like ascension/light body work, development of siddhis, etc. The Kunlun practice can fall into these categories, and these things can sometimes occur spontaneously, as well as gradually develop. It is said that the Kunlun practice causes a merging of micro and macrocosm, and I can attest that this is true especially from this and other practices...synchronous things can happen more often in nature, which mirror the mind. Much different from doing the dishes.

 

For a person who is seeking a serene state of mind, in some ways the Kunlun practice accomplishes this as well. In a way, it is stronger than simply sitting still meditating. Energy is temporarily harmonized as a result of the posture, having profound effects on the body and mind. At least in my experience, I feel like life is more in flow and have a sense of blissful emptiness (inadequate and misleading description but whatever). It can have strange effects on one's surroundings, as well as interactions with other people. So a lot of stuff is happening under the hood, which can be ignored...or explored. The effects can change...so that instead of the practice cultivating serenity, it cultivates whatever is on your mind....

 

I think the main issues with the practice are: how we relate to it, and how it's practiced.

 

The following are just my own ideas, and don't necessarily represent the school's ideas:

 

If we don't first calm the mind and create a sacred space, then we are simply mirroring and amplifying our issues through the practice. So some ideas can be smudging (juniper or sage work well), taking a purifying bath beforehand (lukewarm or cool water), relaxed breathing, lighting some candles around you, maybe some prayer, perhaps doing a protection ritual, etc. The room you practice in should be clean, and healing to be in...a sacred space. It can help to have a feng shui type fountain, with fresh water running through it...or nature sounds of something similar. I think it's good to have fresh air circulating, and also to be close to the ground in the room where you practice. (Side note: Where you practice is actually really important, since the practice will tend to attract different types of spirits...some of which may be inherent to the place you're practicing and not necessarily inherent to you or the practice itself...it can have a disturbing effect on your state of mind). All of these types of considerations will help one to have a much more positive effect on the practice. Afterwards, you might want to spend time in a more meditative state, rather than having to go somewhere quickly and interact with other people, which will easily disturb the energy and inward state of mind you have just cultivated.

 

The reason why many have spoken of Kunlun as spiritual crack here is because of the way they treat it. For instance if you have the coca plant, and take it in a traditional way, it can give you positive effects. But if you make it into cocaine it can start to get dangerous. If you then do crazy wannabe chemist shit to it, then it becomes very damaging! A problem is that many starting out are already wannabe chemists, or they are already trying to make Kunlun into something it's not by their desires and also what they bring to it. So the coca example can be the same with this spiritual practice...if treated with the appropriate respect, the results can be beneficial. Also, how you feel about the practice has an effect on your results with it...if you approach it with fear, guess what's going to be amplified and projected during the session. If you feel positive about it, then that will reflect in your practice. So following one's own intuition is paramount. Cultivating positive emotion in daily life, and perhaps through different meditations, is recommended...

 

Another thing about a strong spiritual practice. If you don't balance your own life and simply spend all of your time on spiritual stuff and inner work, instead of focusing on: love life, exercise and nutrition, career, travel and fun, friends and talking about world issues, etc...well then your life will be unbalanced as a result of your own actions. Part of awareness development is not just becoming more aware of awareness...it's about becoming aware of things in your life and becoming a decision maker. Taking responsibility to shape it. This is the basic idea of magick. A practice which has the potential to dismantle your life (as a result of decreased awareness of aspects of it) can lead us to this potential for magick, and reveal how we aren't using our capabilities (something even as simple as planning how to earn more money, and working towards it).

 

In our world, it's probably most beneficial to spend 90% of our time focused on outer activities, and reserve a special 10% to spiritual escapades! Just how I feel about it...

 

So now to how Kunlun is practiced: I was personally taught that once you feel the energy, then that is all you need from the practice. "If you steep tea for too long it becomes bitter". For myself, most of the time if I simply think of the posture I feel a slight blissfulness rise through me...a slight straightening of the spine. That can be enough. If you do too much and look for some sensation to occur, you can become desensitized and it will seem like a pointless exercise. "Less is more." For myself, it's a very subtle feeling, and I get more from other practices. I was also taught to not flail around...to go within the heart instead, and breathe. Most importantly: to let go. To just practice until the moment you feel something occuring, then to forget about it and do the close down. Not to pine after things.

 

I was also taught that it's necessary to have an exercise routine in addition to the practice. The American Heart Association recommends a minimum of 30 minutes of moderate cardiovascular activity per day for maintaining wellbeing. From studying exercise physiology, I can say that aerobic activity such as taking long hikes, biking or jogging can be much more restorative than intense exercise such as weight lifting or sprinting.

 

Another thing I really like is cold water therapy...going to a fresh river or waterfall with cool water, or simply going under the shower for a minute or two. It helps with the detoxing effects which occur, and benefits the kidneys.

 

So all of these suggestions can relieve a lot of the negative symptoms associated with the practice.

 

Anyway, I think it's not a practice which we can reasonably say: might as well do the dishes/it has no substantial effects. There is definitely more to explore here, in my experience.

[~9~]

Well, this is something I disagree with. For instance, running a few miles has different effects from watching a few hours of TV. Positive and negative things can potentially be said of both activities, but in trying to achieve certain goals (like weightloss) running would be more advantageous. To relax and learn something, watching a documentary would be more advantagous than running. From the standpoint of spiritual growth, running and TV watching both have different effects as well...

 

 

 

To improve a muscle you need to work the muscle. With the willingness to improve the self, anything can be used as the path to wisdom; postures, breath, dishes. To improve the "self" all that is needed is yourself...

Edited May 13, 2011 by ~9~

[Birch]

"Just by learning to discern which desires will make you feel bad, and which will not."

 

This one gets my x Billion for today :-)

 

Edit: Tai -po

Edited May 13, 2011 by -K-

[onelove]

To improve the "self" all that is needed is yourself...

 

+1

[onelove]

The reason why many have spoken of Kunlun as spiritual crack here is because of the way they treat it. For instance if you have the coca plant, and take it in a traditional way, it can give you positive effects. But if you make it into cocaine it can start to get dangerous. If you then do crazy wannabe chemist shit to it, then it becomes very damaging! A problem is that many starting out are already wannabe chemists, or they are already trying to make Kunlun into something it's not by their desires and also what they bring to it. So the coca example can be the same with this spiritual practice...

 

Take spiritual energy practice (YiGong) and add (al)chemist shit to it (Red Phoenix) and you have Kunlun

 

BTW I don't mean to say RP is shit, or that Kunlun is shit, I'm just flowing with the analogy here to make the point that the analogy isn't entirely appropos

[Owledge]

To improve the "self" all that is needed is yourself...

I think that's a mere dogma. Reality easily disproves this generalistic view. Analyzed in more detail, it becomes vague and unprovable as well as disprovable. How could you make a claim like that when all practical examples you can use as support for the claim would have to be taken from a system where a virtually infinite amount of factors are influencing each other all the time?

 

From this dogma, a kind of arrogance can develop, where someone who achieved something believes it to be his own doing, neglecting everything that influenced him towards that achievement.

[orb]

I think that's a mere dogma. Reality easily disproves this generalistic view. Analyzed in more detail, it becomes vague and unprovable as well as disprovable. How could you make a claim like that when all practical examples you can use as support for the claim would have to be taken from a system where a virtually infinite amount of factors are influencing each other all the time?

 

From this dogma, a kind of arrogance can develop, where someone who achieved something believes it to be his own doing, neglecting everything that influenced him towards that achievement.

 

 

I have no idea what you just said, but I have a feeling that it's deep.

[三江源]

.

Edited April 4, 2015 by 三江源

[~9~]

I think that's a mere dogma. Reality easily disproves this generalistic view. Analyzed in more detail, it becomes vague and unprovable as well as disprovable. How could you make a claim like that when all practical examples you can use as support for the claim would have to be taken from a system where a virtually infinite amount of factors are influencing each other all the time?

 

From this dogma, a kind of arrogance can develop, where someone who achieved something believes it to be his own doing, neglecting everything that influenced him towards that achievement.

 

 

Hum.... if you have no self, then how would self improvement to be achieved? How is that a "claim"?

 

What about a claim in which the result is attributed to a system when in Reality "a virtually infinite amount of factors are influencing each other all the time"... the center of that influence for sentience is always occurring at the "self", thus all that is needed is the self, any system is simply the context and motivation to reach out to these factors. Once once this occurs awareness naturally expands to that focus. Once the factors are now in focus then awareness is naturally accumulated. What we pay attention to we learn about, so awareness continues to expand.

 

Be careful of the kool-aid.

[Owledge]

Would be interesting to observe such a "self" trying to improve itself in an empty universe.

Actually, I think there wouldn't even be trying.

 

And if in that utterly empty universe, suddenly a red ball appeared, I'm quite sure the self would 'leap' at it with all its attention. Well, who could have predicted that?!

Now, what about choice? Imagine a red ball AND a blue cube appeared. Now the mysterious force of the self would manifest freedom of choice and choose to pay more attention to one of the two objects, right? Yeah, maybe it discovered the blue cube first. Maybe it switched to the red ball as soon as that one entered its perception.

 

(I have good experience with the method of testing theories by imagining them in their extremes.)

[Mizu]

Can someone now please explain to me how my realization was limited?

 

MY REALIZATION: I mean, being infinite, all powerful, limited only by our belief structures (thoughts, attachments & egos) - is that not INSTANT enlightenment, or does this "awakened state" entail something more?

 

It is my belief that buddha just sat down under a tree and was like... "OH... It was ME the entire time!!! 17 years of breathing just to realize THIS? HaHaHa COSMIC JOKE!"

 

So my theory is that once he understood he was creating his own reality then from then on he understood the necessity to only think of Right Virtue, which he teached, that healed himself, and his world.

 

Am I wrong in stating/realizing/assuming this? That we are ALL already "awake" perfectly realized divine creative beings, pretending we are not or imposing limitation on our already perfect unlimited Self?

 

Is that the great "A-HA!" of 'enlightenment' ??? To see that YOU ARE CREATING ALL OF IT???

 

So you have no Self except that which you create? You are everything, and nothing. Yes?

 

So it's like.. no 'practice' does *Anything* per say, only reveals us to ourselves... like, if I believed standing on my head chanting "OMMM CHOCK NOK SLOK OHMMMMM" over and over again would bring me Gold Dragon Body and Samadhi, and I FULLY and TRULY believed it would (even though it would be me the entire time) than it WOULD, right?

 

So I've ARRIVED... but I've never really left? Is this it?

 

 

Input highly appreciated.. thanks..

Edited July 25, 2011 by Mizu

[Owledge]

Am I wrong in stating/realizing/assuming this? That we are ALL already "awake" perfectly realized divine creative beings, pretending we are not?

Pretending means you are aware of something and intentionally act different. So if you can't just decide to be enlightened and get an epiphany, you are not enlightened.

Beware: Words don't have objective meaning. It is easy to philosophize about the meaning of words. Try to use their established definitions as a basis instead, otherwise communicating spiritual ideas becomes very mushy and confusing.

 

like, if I believed standing on my head chanting "OMMM CHOCK NOK SLOK OHMMMMM" over and over again would bring me Gold Dragon Body and Samadhi, and I FULLY and TRULY believed it would (even though it would be me the entire time) than it WOULD, right?

And those words FULLY and TRULY can now be filled with meaning depending on the outcome of someone's efforts towards enlightenment. If you try and work and act and give into belief and everything, but just can't manifest or reach enlightenment, someone can always say that you didn't TRULY believe, but what does that mean anyway? ... Those words are not an adequate means of conveying an idea. "Truly" is a filler word, creating arbitrary divisiveness.

[Mizu]

And those words FULLY and TRULY can now be filled with meaning depending on the outcome of someone's efforts towards enlightenment. If you try and work and act and give into belief and everything, but just can't manifest or reach enlightenment, someone can always say that you didn't TRULY believe, but what does that mean anyway? ... Those words are not an adequate means of conveying an idea. "Truly" is a filler word, creating arbitrary divisiveness.

 

Truly meaning the essence of TRUTH itself.

 

Ie... this is a cup. That is truth. It is a cup. ISness. Truth.

 

So, TRULY, 'wholly' realizing a state of whatever one wills, in truth.

 

Ie perfect health, perfect love, perfect bliss, perfect samadhi, perfect siddhis ie levitation or walking on water, etc. Virtue.

 

And is this where compassion comes into play? Because people don't know Who They Really Are (infinite, omnipotent HERE AND NOW etc) so they don't realize they're falsely believing themselves into thinking they are limited? So like when a teacher points inside them and tries to show them that and then they go; "Oh.. I just need to practice this spiritual technique for X amount of years, THEN I will be enlightened and free!" THAT is where compassion comes into play? Because you are sad they are putting self-imposed limitation on their perfect, infinite Self?

 

"Uhhh, you can be enlightened and free RIGHT NOW and you don't need to sit in a cave for 20 years to realize that... it's all about beliefs..."

 

And I meant "pretending" in the sense that we are all walking around true GODS acting like goddam fools! Putting self-imposed limitation over our perfect, unlimited Self - here & now. So yes, thanks for the warning, I guess that was the incorrect usage of that particular word.

 

edit: so if someone didn't "Truly believe", they did not fully realize the essence of the Truth [iSness] they were seeking. They muddied the waters, so to speak.

 

Make sense? Did I hit the nail on the head with this whole "Awakening" business, or what?

Edited July 25, 2011 by Mizu

[Ish]

IMO "believing" you are omnipotent enlighteneed etc is meaningless. You have to REALIZE it, honestly do you REALIZE you are omnipotent, perfect enlightened or is it an intelectual conclusion?

[Mizu]

IMO "believing" you are omnipotent enlighteneed etc is meaningless. You have to REALIZE it, honestly do you REALIZE you are omnipotent, perfect enlightened or is it an intelectual conclusion?

 

Intellectual.

 

So then, does that mean I am false and there's more to this Enlightenment thing, or do I need to simply start to force-focus my mind in such a way that is on Right Virtue.. like love in every moment, perfect health, glowing radiant body, seeing Oneness in the all with everyone, etc? Or, do I need to LOSE my mind and continue to cultivate continual stillness [awareness] - or, does that simply bring me right back to realizing that it's ALL ME and I am creating all of it, so it's just one big loop when stilling your mind?

 

Or are all these questions utterly meaningless because I am now awake and already "there" I just need to start correcting myself and my mis-creations in my un-enlightened state.

 

i.e "After enlightenment, the laundry." -Old Zen Proverb

 

???

 

Please share wisdom.

 

<3 ~m

Edited July 26, 2011 by Mizu

[Sunya]

Who is creating all of it? Who are you? Just a thought? A feeling? Presence? Awareness? Where is this 'I' that you cling to so strongly? Does it really exist? Has it ever?

[Ish]

Intellectual.

 

So then, does that mean I am false and there's more to this Enlightenment thing, or do I need to simply start to force-focus my mind in such a way that is on Right Virtue.. like love in every moment, perfect health, glowing radiant body, seeing Oneness in the all with everyone, etc? Or, do I need to LOSE my mind and continue to cultivate continual stillness [awareness] - or, does that simply bring me right back to realizing that it's ALL ME and I am creating all of it, so it's just one big loop when stilling your mind?

 

Or are all these questions utterly meaningless because I am now awake and already "there" I just need to start correcting myself and my mis-creations in my un-enlightened state.

 

i.e "After enlightenment, the laundry." -Old Zen Proverb

 

???

 

Please share wisdom.

 

<3 ~m

 

I dont want to say to you its this way or that way as I am not Enlightened and it would be deceitful.

So far for myself in terms of meditation, I find just being with no mind for attainment, past, future, god, reality etc etc, not blocking thoughts but reaching a state where thoughts do not arise is an excellent practice.

I believe wisdom will naturally arise in this way.

I also practice chi kung as your energy has a very noticeable impact on your mind, health is important.

 

I personally wouldn't say you're already there as you wouldn't need to ask any intellectual questions, you would know you are there without any doubt.

 

Good luck with your practice

[Mizu]

Who is creating all of it? Who are you? Just a thought? A feeling? Presence? Awareness? Where is this 'I' that you cling to so strongly? Does it really exist? Has it ever?

 

So it's all just a dream then... And then I would need to now "dream" in a more, pleasurable "enlightened" virtuous way since I now see myself as infinite and without limits?

 

Like I'm now awoken from the nightmare now dreaming that I have a perfect healthy body healed of it's sicknesses, perfect harmonious relationships... a constant state of joy etc, my goal is now to realize and now BE this...?

Edited July 26, 2011 by Mizu