Nungali

not if you row across two oceans .... that will spin the compass like a top ! oh .... edit ... my mistake ... sunrise if you row across two oceans the rotation of the earth will be reversed

Then if one is considering its nature 'from beyond' or 'apart from' using the mind (if that is what is meant ) then there must be a faculty beyond or apart from mind to consider it ? or are you saying mind considers itself (it doesnt look like you are saying that ) '' the nature of the mind and eventually identify with this as one's ultimate "self.'' so if mind is supposed to be identified as ultimate self , what is considering this non conceptual or intellectual definition ? or maybe its just the syntax you chose or my misreading ? Are not the first two, products of the mind ? Yes.

I stopped at ' Japan is west of China... if you row across two oceans' . I can affirm its not . ... and I have rowed from Australia to Portugal !

What does the death of an individual have to with the survival of it's race ? The death of the individual is how a race survives , a key mechanism and how evolution works .

But ..... But ....

Gloria Gaynor .

Who claims that ??? and no, not all good comes from the west :

Its often been hard to post an image here lately . yes, 7 and 8 do seem similar , in the western system they would be under the 'invocations' section Ah yes .... little understood that one ! Sometimes I am asked ( usually after a 'session' of 'teaching' ... which is usually just getting bombarded by questions ) '' But what do you do now ?'' or '' Why dont you do that practice anymore .'' - thats the easier answer . I would say , possibly the same with me .... depending on the definition / concept of this 'mind' being talked about . . . and regarding that as the 'ultimate self ' . Very similar to the practice of 'maintaining consciousness center and energy flow through the 'hara ' . I mentioned this training before ; ' Now ... stand up and come over here next to me ..... did you loose your hara ? ... go back and sit then . '' yes it was mostly applied to 'fighting ' training , but after a while it spreads out to other areas . The more you tell me about this tradition the more I like it

Fight ... fight .... fight ..... Mod fight ! Yeah !

Yeah but ..... thats only because you dont have a soul

Australian desert dragon ; Thorny Devils ( ' Moloch horridus ' ) are really small but a wonderful lizard . You can put your hand under them , under the sand and scoop them up . They dont seem to mind and dont move while you do it, or maybe just a bit . On your hand they just sit there, maybe cock their head to look at you . It is illegeal to 'interfere' or touch them .... but I was with an indigenous elder and he instructed me to to do it as it was a desert sand 'roadway ' , so we moved them to safety . Curious little fellahs

You keep referencing this Egyptian 5 soul thing , even though its been pointed out twice its incorrect Egyptian concept of 'souls' is up to 9 . Are you trying to somehow join the Egyptian concept to the Kabbalistic ? and it also seems that by pacing them together like that you are assuming the Kabbalistic soul concept is similar to others .... nah ; '' In essence, while many philosophies explore multi-part souls (e.g., Ancient Egyptian) or the struggle between higher and lower selves, the specific combination of a dual soul structure, the five developmental levels, and the concept of the soul as a literal "part of God" waiting to be revealed within the context of Jewish law makes the Kabbalistic concept unique '' ( not that this helps Tommy with his question ... you just obfuscated things for him )

Excellent ! many just use the term and have all sorts of ideas about it . What do you think it might be ... from your perspective ( not really interested in a copy of others thoughts ... been researching that for decades ! ) ... let's say you do have one , what do you think it might be ? Office job ? Obviously the original context is not following the supposed 'current' recommended religious practice It can mean dont sell yourself out for material gains . Are you familar with the idea that many indigenous or even 'third world ' people with little material goods often seem naturally happy while rich people with a lot of possessions have a high rate of depression and 'pointlessness' ( that is ... unless you own a jetski ! )

A curious conversation . years back around the fire ; an aboriginal guy ; '' I dont get that white people philosophy stuff ?'' Me ; '' What stuff ? '' '' All that who am I , why am I here , what is the purpose of life ? I mean ... if you dont lknow any of that how you gonna do anything else ? How can you go through life like that without knowing who you are and why you are here ? You would think people like would make a real mess of things and not have a clue .'' Me ; '' Ummmmm .... well, yeah ! '' '' What do you mean ?'' Me ; < makes a gesture to include everything > '' Ohhhh ... right ! ''