Kundalini vs Jing Chi Shen

[Eden]

Is practiciting Hatha yoga asana and pranayama to awaken Kundalini different to the whole Taoist framework of Jing Chi Shen? Does a Hatha Yogi cultivate these 3 treasures on their path of awakening Kundalini, or do Taoists experience their kundalini awakening?

For me lately Ive been experimenting with these two paths... and they seem mutually exclusive... the idea of a Hatha Yogi is eating a very simple, bland, moist easy to digest sattvic diet (no eggs or meat or garlic, etc), and they are working primarily with the Solar and Lunar energy currents in the body, bringing those into balance to bring the Prana to flow in central channel to awaken Kundalini.. but kundalini path is hard cause she can easily fall back down or fall back asleep.. Its a very particular energy not like jing chi or shen at all... its more like a current of vital energy that begins to flow through central channel when its balanced and opened

Taoist is more about "building" Jing and Chi to help open the meridians for better Chi flow, ie microcosmic orbit... but it doesnt really ever feel like I am working with Kundalini. For me my results of cultivating Jing and Chi lead to similar phenomena as Kundalini, but its more like a basins of water filling... first with Jing becoming full and overlfowing into Chi.. then Chi overlfowing and nourishing Shen, etc

These paths also seems very different way of cultivating energy than Tibetan Vajrayana Buddhism of working with Tsa Lung and Thigle...

[Eduardo]

El 27-09-2023 a las 12:55, Eden dijo:

 

 

Edited February 7, 2024 by Eduardo
Delete

[Dedicated]

This is the whole reason I'm on this site. From what I can tell daoist inner Alchemy is the same as what is talked about in the Bhagavad Gita that even someone from a toxic womb can attain. From what I've gathered we only need reach an alkaline state through not eating much meat, not drinking alcohol or coffee, thinking peaceful thoughts and practicing compassion for a few days. Then through conscious effort allow the process of what can be clumsily termed sacred secretion to occur. My line of investigation is how to tune into when it is going on.

[old3bob]

2 hours ago, Dedicated said:

This is the whole reason I'm on this site. From what I can tell daoist inner Alchemy is the same as what is talked about in the Bhagavad Gita that even someone from a toxic womb can attain. From what I've gathered we only need reach an alkaline state through not eating much meat, not drinking alcohol or coffee, thinking peaceful thoughts and practicing compassion for a few days. Then through conscious effort allow the process of what can be clumsily termed sacred secretion to occur. My line of investigation is how to tune into when it is going on.

 

 "for a few days" ???  besides what goes into the mouth there is that which comes out via thoughts/feelings.  One could be a great yogi and still fall right into the hell realms for various reasons...as happened to rishis long lost to history.

[Dedicated]

1 hour ago, old3bob said:

 

 "for a few days" ???  besides what goes into the mouth there is that which comes out via thoughts/feelings.  One could be a great yogi and still fall right into the hell realms for various reasons...as happened to rishis long lost to history.

Thanks Old 3 Bob!

 

Three days isn't quite enough, good pick up. I like your Jesus reference, not what goes into the mouth, rather what comes out, for words come from your heart. What guidance do you know, heard or read regarding choice realms? 

 

I came across the term sacred secretion surfing YouTube. But I was struggling to find out more regarding recognising it happening, and what stage in the process one is in. Daoism gave the most generous description I could find within my readily available resources. But that's not how I found this site. I found it when my research lead to Pythagoras, which lead me here.

[old3bob]

it's a life time process for most schools (at least) as I believe most Taoists would agree with, btw. I know very little about Taoism but there are many here who have been involved with it in various ways for a long time so hopefully they will be able to help a lot more?  In yoga systems/schools karma yoga is a very important part of and one's foundation for practice,  its also protective in a sense for being grounded for both student and master a like.  So I'd say research is fine but don't jump into methods other than very basic well rounded, down to earth healthy ways that apply to life in general without having well a qualified teacher for further guidance.

Here is a link to a school you might like,  it looks fine to me but one has to find out for themselves in all such things.    https://www.collegeoftao.org/harvest-moon-by-dr-mao-shing-ni.html

 

Edited September 29, 2023 by old3bob

[tao stillness]

I quote from what is claimed to be the oldest school of Qigong, ZYQ, Zhong Yuan Qigong:

"The first step of the transformation of Jing into Qi involves bringing it up to the brain. This can result in our acquisition of special (extrasensory) abilities, prolongation of youth, and achievement of longevity."

I have personally verified the above description when instructed in the Transcendental Meditation Siddhi program. The first time I practiced this advanced method based on the correct understanding of Patanjali's yoga sutras method which had been missing for hundreds of years, energy spontaneously shot up thru my heart chakra and then into the brain resulting in the experience of what TM program calls Cosmic Consciousness, the first stage of enlightenment. This sounds like bringing Jing up to the brain. At the time of this glorious experience, I thought of it as Kundalini rising from the base chakra all the way to the crown chakra. This sounds similar to "bringing it up to the brain". The beauty and blessing of the TM Siddhi program is that it happens effortlessly. Unlike Taoist alchemy Qigong, it does not involve any visualization or concentration at all. Kudos to the ancient Taoists, but their strenuous and lengthy, lifelong practices that only a few people ever succeed in doing, are not needed when TM programs allow people to reach the goal of Taoist alchemy immediately and without strenuous, laborious, hit and miss methods with a very low success rate. If one has the right karma, the right master appears. Otherwise, years of wasted, fruitless effort, all in vain. 

[Krenx]

So are you declaring definitively that Transcendental Meditation Siddhi program results in the same qualities as the microcosmic orbit, Jing qi shen transformation process in the daoist arts? In a faster and easier way? And possibly superior results? 

 

Just want to make sure that is what you are saying. Because it would be quite a significant statement to make. 

 

@tao stillness

Edited Sunday at 02:25 PM by Krenx

[Lairg]

7 hours ago, Krenx said:

Transcendental Meditation Siddhi program results in the same qualities as the microcosmic orbit,

 

My own experience of the Siddhi program is that it extended the mantra to the first chakra beyond the head and down into the solar plexus chakra.   It opened up both higher and lower functionality.  It was and is excellent.

 

I had no conscious experience of a circuit/orbit.  

 

 

[Annnon]

On 20/07/2025 at 7:05 PM, Lairg said:

 

My own experience of the Siddhi program is that it extended the mantra to the first chakra beyond the head and down into the solar plexus chakra.   It opened up both higher and lower functionality.  It was and is excellent.

 

I had no conscious experience of a circuit/orbit.  

 

 

 

no need for initiation for such mantras?

[BigSkyDiamond]

47 minutes ago, Annnon said:

no need for initiation for such mantras?

 

The TM Siddhi program has prerequisites:

the initial TM course (est. cost $500-$1,000)

four additional "Advanced Techniques" courses (each costing the same as the initial course)

the Siddhi program (cost upwards of $4,000)

plus the cost of travel and lodging to attend the portions of the training that are in-person.

 

So it is pricey

[Lairg]

3 hours ago, Annnon said:

no need for initiation for such mantras?

 

To be a bit more precise I had two mantra extensions before the Siddhi program was established.  

 

I can't recall the details of the process for extension but the original mantra was given during a ritual that involved invoking each of the line of Masters.

 

At one stage, as a meditation checker, I dealt with several people that had been initiated into TM by a group of teachers in London that had left the TM organization.  The people came to me because their meditation was not working properly.

 

I suspected that, their teachers having left the organization, the line of Masters no longer energized their initiations

 

 

 

[Annnon]

8 hours ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

 

The TM Siddhi program has prerequisites:

the initial TM course (est. cost $500-$1,000)

four additional "Advanced Techniques" courses (each costing the same as the initial course)

the Siddhi program (cost upwards of $4,000)

plus the cost of travel and lodging to attend the portions of the training that are in-person.

 

So it is pricey

Oh this is a lot!

 

5 hours ago, Lairg said:

 

To be a bit more precise I had two mantra extensions before the Siddhi program was established.  

 

I can't recall the details of the process for extension but the original mantra was given during a ritual that involved invoking each of the line of Masters.

 

At one stage, as a meditation checker, I dealt with several people that had been initiated into TM by a group of teachers in London that had left the TM organization.  The people came to me because their meditation was not working properly.

 

I suspected that, their teachers having left the organization, the line of Masters no longer energized their initiations

 

 

 

Hmm I understand, very nice thanks!