deleted

[Mark Foote]

7 minutes ago, Cobie said:

 

oh one, so in touch!
Touché they’re not haiku, more 

senryu. Love you. 
 

 

senryu, love you
some senryu, you sure do
me, I like the rain
 

 

 

Edited February 18 by Mark Foote

[Cobie]

 

On 27/02/2024 at 8:30 AM, Taoist Texts said:

… bafflingly unreasonable. who would write a useless book? ...idk ppl just keep saying the damnedest things...

 

Indeed.
 

Like the first line of the DDJ. If the Dao cannot be expressed, then “who would write a useless book”!

https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/55433-do-you-need-to-learn-chinese/?do=findComment&comment=1022024   
 

https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/55124-you-and-wu-in-chapter-one/?do=findComment&comment=1014660   
 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 29 by Cobie

[Cobie]

 

2 hours ago, Nungali said:

… bring up your kids right, no matter what you suffered …

Yes. Reminded me of this quote: 

”It’s not to say that these things didn’t haunt me, because they did. I just stopped them from haunting my son’s childhood. He was 37 when he finally learned the full story. … During that phone call, … he kept repeating ‘you were so normal’ … To me, this was one of my greatest accomplishments in life.” (she survived an attack by Ted Bundy)

 

Edited February 27 by Cobie

[Taoist Texts]

9 hours ago, Cobie said:

Like the first line of the DDJ. If the Dao cannot be expressed, then “who would write a useless book”!

i donno why ppl say that. the first line says exactly the opposite: dao can be expressed. funny peeps;)

[Cobie]

12 hours ago, The Biggest Nobody said:

I want to change my name to 'An Insignificant Nobody' because I am now an insignificant nobody.

I want to change my name to 'The Biggest Nobody' because I am the biggest nobody of them all.

‘grandiosity’ & ‘depression’ are two sides of the same coin. No worries, you will find the middle way. Be well. 

 

Edited February 28 by Cobie

[Cobie]

26 minutes ago, Mark Foote said:

...  Everything changes …

panta rhei (πάντα ῥεῖ) "everything flows" (Heraclitus)  

 

 

[Cobie]

The guard at the gate asked Laozi to write down his teachings, in reply, Laozi started with:

道 可 道 也 - As for the teachings that I [Laozi] can express, 

非 恆 道 也 - they go against the customary teachings.

 

名 可 名 也 - As for the morals that I [Laozi] can express, 

非 恆 名 也 - they go against the customary morality.

 

Edited March 2 by Cobie

[Cobie]

On 28/02/2024 at 7:54 AM, Taoist Texts said:

i donno why ppl say that. the first line says exactly the opposite: dao can be expressed. funny peeps;)

Could you please post your current translation of the characters of the first line? 
(I posted my latest version in the post above).

 

 

Edited March 1 by Cobie

[Taoist Texts]

12 hours ago, Cobie said:

Could you please post your current translation of the characters of the first line? 
(I posted my latest version in the post above).

Sure why not. Of course the official translation is meaningless and thats why they never explain what the heck it means and why. But so will remain mine transl if i dont explain it first. Here goes:

1st of all the line is the chinese version of  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logos#Origins_of_the_term; Philo distinguished between logos prophorikos ("the uttered word") and the logos endiathetos ("the word remaining within").^[11]

2nd it is the older version of the Yijing's formula for the dao: in one of the appendixes to the Book of Changes (Yijing), "one Yin and one Yang, this is the Dao."

3rd the point of this line (same as with the greeks) is to explain the origin of the world whereas the world IS speech, name , dao, logos

 

so the line is

there  is  spoken speech  道可/there  is unspoken speech 道非/ together they are the permanent dao 常道。

there are  named names  名可/ there are unnamed names 名非/ together they are the permanent name 常名。 

[Cobie]

9 hours ago, Taoist Texts said:

… 道可 … 道非 … 常道。

… 名可 … 名非 … 常名。 

 

Thank you very much for elucidating, it is a very ingenious translation.

However, I prefer to use the oldest available text (MWD A). Your version does not comply with MWD A, which: 
 

1j splits up the characters in a different way:

 

道 可 道 也 

非 恆 道 也 

 

名 可 名 也 

非 恆 名 也 

 

http://www.daoisopen.com/downloads/CC1.pdf 
 

2) uses 恆 

恆 was the name of a later emperor. The taboo on the use of the emperor’s name, resulted in the substitution 常 

 

 

Edited March 2 by Cobie

[Cobie]

.

Edited March 9 by Cobie

[Cobie]

 

8 hours ago, Taoist Texts said:

… they believe the voices in their heads are real "things from other worlds." …

 

Yes exactly.
“Problems come from putting on the outside what’s actually on the inside.”

https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/55700-have-you-ever-been-blessed-by-someone/?do=findComment&comment=1028154 

 

 

Edited March 22 by Cobie

[Cobie]

“It's hard for me to take sound advice too sometimes.”
https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/55713-full-description-of-methods-for-the-4-stages-of-internal-alchemy-in-book-internal-alchemy-for-everyone/?do=findComment&comment=1029208

 

I find that remark so condescending. 
 

 

Edited March 27 by Cobie

[Cobie]

“That's gaslighting nonsense …”
https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/55713-full-description-of-methods-for-the-4-stages-of-internal-alchemy-in-book-internal-alchemy-for-everyone/?do=findComment&comment=1029317 

Yes, “Yae can't digest this fact” is just an ad hominem; it’s what some people use when they have no arguments left.

 

 

 

Edited March 27 by Cobie

[silent thunder]

2 hours ago, Cobie said:

I find that remark so condescending. 

 

2 hours ago, Cobie said:

Yes, “Yae can't digest this fact” is just an ad hominem; it’s what some people use when they have no arguments left.

 

 

[Cobie]

1 hour ago, silent thunder said:

…

 

Thank you for your feedback. Please note your logic is faulty:

 

-> Yae … <-  ad hominem directed at Yae (in the discussion)

 

-> I … <- my personal opinion (in my own thread)

 

 

Edited March 27 by Cobie

[SirPalomides]

On 3/2/2024 at 4:01 AM, Taoist Texts said:

Sure why not. Of course the official translation is meaningless and thats why they never explain what the heck it means and why. But so will remain mine transl if i dont explain it first. Here goes:

1st of all the line is the chinese version of  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logos#Origins_of_the_term; Philo distinguished between logos prophorikos ("the uttered word") and the logos endiathetos ("the word remaining within").^[11]

2nd it is the older version of the Yijing's formula for the dao: in one of the appendixes to the Book of Changes (Yijing), "one Yin and one Yang, this is the Dao."

3rd the point of this line (same as with the greeks) is to explain the origin of the world whereas the world IS speech, name , dao, logos

 

so the line is

there  is  spoken speech  道可/there  is unspoken speech 道非/ together they are the permanent dao 常道。

there are  named names  名可/ there are unnamed names 名非/ together they are the permanent name 常名。 

 

 

This is very interesting! Has anyone else put forward a reading like this? If your reading is correct, it might line up with something I noticed about Zhuangzi- many people notice Zhuangzi's skeptical attitude toward conventional language, and stop there, without noticing his idea of "goblet words", his expansive idea of language, speaking non-speech, that can indeed harmonize with the flowing character of life. 

[Taoist Texts]

20 minutes ago, SirPalomides said:

This is very interesting! Has anyone else put forward a reading like this?

i am pretty certain that no one;)

20 minutes ago, SirPalomides said:

many people notice Zhuangzi's skeptical attitude toward conventional language, and stop there, without noticing his idea of "goblet words", his expansive idea of language, speaking non-speech, that can indeed harmonize with the flowing character of life. 

thats all true but the issue is ...what are these goblet words or this non-speech good for?

[SirPalomides]

45 minutes ago, Taoist Texts said:

i am pretty certain that no one;)

thats all true but the issue is ...what are these goblet words or this non-speech good for?

 

According to the Records of the Snoring Goat there is a creature called the jibber-cat who lives in the western highlands whose head detaches in the moonlight and flies through the air, whispering into the ears of sleeping highwaymen. In the morning they awake and go robbing but they forego silk, gold, and jade, taking from the passersby only their stocks of salmon, carp, and milk.

 

So it is with words. 

[silent thunder]

Walking Two Paths simultaneously is among the most practical and profound teachings I've encountered.

[Cobie]

On 29/03/2024 at 5:37 PM, Taoist Texts said:

i am pretty certain that no one;)

Ah, I’d wondered about that. Kudos to you, it really is most ingenious. 
 

 

Edited March 30 by Cobie

[Dedicated]

On 27/03/2024 at 7:54 AM, Cobie said:

“It's hard for me to take sound advice too sometimes.”
https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/55713-full-description-of-methods-for-the-4-stages-of-internal-alchemy-in-book-internal-alchemy-for-everyone/?do=findComment&comment=1029208

 

I find that remark so condescending. 
 

 

Yes, it didn't sit as well as it could have for me either. It was a sad conversation thread.

Edited March 31 by Dedicated
Thread not link.

[Cobie]

 

 When a con artist points at the moon, don’t take your eyes off the finger. 

 

Edited April 1 by Cobie