Making sense: How to combine emptiness and compassion?

[silent thunder]

I used to attach imperial importance to thinking... it was my life.  Ruminating, pondering, questioning, answering... seeking better answers, obtaining certainty, wrestling with doubt.  Decades passed in this manner.

 

And then, seemingly spontaneously one day, decades ago, my mind pond hosted this thought 'out of the blue'.

 

"Just because you thought it and felt strongly about it...

does not make it relevant, real, significant, or true.

they're just thoughts.

Don't believe everything you think"

 

 

 

 

They're just thoughts.  We have 60-90k of them daily. 

One may wind one's entire life among such side paths...

 

 

Here's one thought that arose from who knows where that i still cherish.

 

Muddiest waters

Undisturbed by processing

rest in clarity.

 

edit: 

 

What practice is more complete, more encompassing and revealing of true nature than to simply abide as is, here and now?  Raw presence is where it's at for me of late.

Edited July 19, 2021 by silent thunder
changed wording and added a bit

[TranquilTurmoil]

@silent thunder I’m currently trying to rest in awareness as much as possible/is optimal… but if I merely did that all day I might burn out or become agitated as I’m in a place of limited mental strength and concentration. Thus I take music as a refuge, the self expression associated with that, and follow the contemplative impulse very often (which isn’t necessarily healthy, but I don’t want to subjugate my personality/spirit at this moment in time). I hope to shift towards less contemplation, more abiding… but I do also need emotional release. Balance is key 

[silent thunder]

Hey TT.

 

i am not promoting anything as a path, or recommending anything others should utilize.

Just sharing.  No implications aside from how the topic brought forth this bit of musing in my mind.

 

Truth be told, any of my musings and insights here could be considered like the sound of bird chatter, or a stream.

[TranquilTurmoil]

15 minutes ago, silent thunder said:

Hey TT.

 

i am not promoting anything as a path, or recommending anything others should utilize.

Just sharing.  No implications aside from how the topic brought forth this bit of musing in my mind.

 

Truth be told, any of my musings and insights here could be considered like the sound of bird chatter, or a stream.

Indulge my spontaneous association from Zhaungzi:

"The spoken isn't just bits of wind. In the spoken, something is spoken. But what it is never stays fixed and constant. So is something spoken, or has n othing ever been spoken? People think we're different from baby birds cheeping, but are we saying any more than they are?

How could Way be so hidden that there's true and false? How could the spoken be so hidden that there's yes this and no that? How could Way leave and exist no more? How could the spoken exist and be insufficient? These days, Way is hidden in small realizations and the spoken is hidden in florid extravagance so we have philosphies.... declaring yes this and no that. They each affirm what the other denies, deny what the other affirms. If you what to affirm all that they deny and deny all that they affirm, you can't beat illimuniation

 

 

[TranquilTurmoil]

Update: before (Form is no other than emptiness)

 

After: (Emptiness is no other than form )

Forgive the low-quality images, my iphone pics don't usually upload.. And in case you are wondering, no barbers were harmed in the making of these photos, but that was my first haircut I've ever given myself

[BigSkyDiamond]

I know this is an older thread, but what comes to mind for me in reading this thread (and the many wonderful posts in it):

 

Reading the book Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle, and listening to his videos on you tube.  For me he provides the most compassionate, practical, and humorous perspective on how to live this in our daily life.  The way he describes "the pain body" is brilliant and effective in my experience.  Particularly when someone is going through the dark places and feeling overwhelmed.   He can make the most serious issues very funny and that is marvelous. 

 

Also on you tube there are dozens of free videos hearing him speak and present.  They are hilarious and illuminating and effective and healing.  When i was bedridden and despairing and too overwhelmed or scattered to even pick up a book i spent hours listening to his videos and they made a huge difference.  His Zen stories still have me burst out laughing even after hearing them dozens of times.

 

 

Edited June 25 by BigSkyDiamond

[Cadcam]

I can't speak from a practicing Buddhist perspective, but from my experience I've been cut off from feeling attachments to friends and family. I am isolated in myself now. It's peaceful, and boring. Feeling attachment and exchange of soul is invigorating.  It's like a fuel, and I don't think the fuel is illusionary but the perceived understanding might be.

[stirling]

Interesting to see this thread necro'd! 

 

As it turns out there is no need to combine emptiness and compassion, they are in fact inseparable. Where there is emptiness there is always compassion, though sometimes it takes a practice to open that compassion up.

[Surya]

One distinction I quite like, is that instead of thinking attatchment vs. detatchment, think love vs. lust.

[TranquilTurmoil]

On 6/25/2025 at 3:27 PM, BigSkyDiamond said:

I know this is an older thread, but what comes to mind for me in reading this thread (and the many wonderful posts in it):

 

Reading the book Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle, and listening to his videos on you tube.  For me he provides the most compassionate, practical, and humorous perspective on how to live this in our daily life.  The way he describes "the pain body" is brilliant and effective in my experience.  Particularly when someone is going through the dark places and feeling overwhelmed.   He can make the most serious issues very funny and that is marvelous. 

 

Also on you tube there are dozens of free videos hearing him speak and present.  They are hilarious and illuminating and effective and healing.  When i was bedridden and despairing and too overwhelmed or scattered to even pick up a book i spent hours listening to his videos and they made a huge difference.  His Zen stories still have me burst out laughing even after hearing them dozens of times.

 

 

I didn't even remember this thread! It was a trip to see this brought back! My spiritual journey started with Eckhart Tolle via A New Earth and the Power of Now. I have re-visited Tolle a little bit in recent years. It was quite shocking to read and re-visit these years of my life. 

 

One of the traps I was in back then was not taking certain aspects of my mental-psycho-social life as self, and thinking that was nonself... and then re-ifying my "pain-body" formed around loss, relationships, etc.

 

Big thanks to (formerly) Steve, Stirling, and all of the other good folks who offered me words of wisdom and direct encouragement. It meant a lot to me.

 

Best wishes to you all.

 

[steve]

One practical aspect/application of the relationship between emptiness and compassion is found in helping others.

When you to want to offer help, it's very important to notice what is behind that impulse.

So often we try to offer what WE think someone else needs.

Of course there are situations where it is obvious, a drowning person needs their head above the water, but very often what they actually need is different from what we think they need and they are not always able to tell us. Sometimes we may even disagree with what they need but who should make that decision?

 

It is easy to make them feel worse or make a situation worse because we are trying to impose something coming from our own pain, conditioning, or ignorance. So when that urge to help comes up there is nothing more important than emptying out our own reactivity, our own assessment and conclusions, and to be very open, inwardly quiet, and really listen and feel what that other person needs. If unsure, best to simply show up with presence, inner stillness and quiet, and simply be there until it is clear what is needed in the situation. No words are more supportive than holding a hand or a warm hug. 

 

I was once called to help someone at a retreat who was very ill. I did not speak their language but figured out they needed emergency medical care. Unfortunately we were over an hour from any hospital and had to wait for the ambulance for a long time. I felt so helpless sitting there not being able to do anything so I just sat next to her, holding her hand, gently rubbing her back. We would occasionally smile at each other between spasms of pain. It was one of the most meaningful hours of my life, no exaggeration. Unable to do anything but be open and present for someone else during their intense suffering. The experience completely changed my relationship to how I approach my work and the people I work with. We've felt and stayed connected over a long distance ever since.

 

My teacher is currently leading a retreat on longevity practices from the Bön tradition and one of the things that is being emphasized over and over is the value and importance of human connection for health and longevity. That connection needs no words or agenda. Just catching someone's eyes and offering a genuine smile creates instant connection, provided we are open. The openness is the key and that can only occur when we are quiet and still inside, in other words... empty.

[forestofclarity]

One issue is that people often assume compassion is something to be gained. From certain Buddhist points of view, compassion arises naturally from our minds and everything anyone does is due to seeking happiness from oneself or others. Being selfish is actually imposed upon us, through ignorance and timeless mental habits. So in this view, ignorance blocks our compassion. Emptiness dissolves our sense of self and our feeling of being bounded and separated from others. Once dissolved, this compassion flows freely. 

 

 

[Kati]

"Emptiness dissolves our sense of self and our feeling of being bounded and separated from others. Once dissolved, this compassion flows freely."
– Yes, that perfectly describes what I experience when practicing Qigong. Out of stillness, compassion arises naturally—without the need to change anything. There’s also this unconditional love and a deep trust in the goodness of the source. It’s almost impossible to put into words.

For me, Qigong is a powerful way to connect with compassion and to witness how it continues to grow within me, effortlessly.

According to my teacher, Chunyi Lin, a significant moment of transformation occurs when you begin to feel sadness for the suffering of the world. He says this is a sign that your heart is opening.
 

"Emptiness dissolves our sense of self and our feeling of being bounded and separated from others. Once dissolved, this compassion flows freely."

 

For me, it feels as though this teaching is deeply connected to the Dao. The Dao is boundless — the space in which everything arises, unfolds, and returns. The more we open ourselves to the teaching, the more we also open to the innate intelligence, compassion, love, and limitless potential of the Dao.

 

From one angle, it seems paradoxical to speak of the Dao as “empty,” because it is so profoundly alive, powerful, and healing. In Qigong, for example, I can feel the presence of Qi — and with it, a tangible connection to the Dao itself. It's as if the Dao is the source that gives rise to Qi, and perhaps also to the healing energy that flows through and beyond us.

 

There is something deeply fascinating about this process of "emptying." In Daoist and Buddhist traditions alike, emptiness doesn't mean a void or nothingness in the Western sense. Rather, it points to the letting go of false identifications — especially the attachment to a fixed, separate self. This kind of emptiness is actually fullness: a return to the natural state, to spontaneity, to alignment with the Dao.

 

And when we become empty in that sense — when we release what we are not — we return to what we truly are. From this space, compassion arises not as a practice or a goal, but as a natural expression of our original nature, which both Daoism and Mahayana Buddhism point to as inherently whole, interconnected, and awake.

 

So yes, in this light, compassion is not something we need to acquire. It is an aspect of our true being, revealed when we relax into the vastness of the Dao — or, in Buddhist terms, when ignorance dissolves and the illusion of separation falls away.

 

 

Edited Wednesday at 07:51 PM by Kati