Tian Gu

[wandelaar]

According to Yang, Jwing-Ming in his book The Dao De Jing: A Qigong Interpretation the term "tian gu" refers to the space between the two lobes of the brain. How old is that meaning? 

[Aetherous]

I looked for where it says that in the book, and I think it says "shen gu" rather than tian gu. I tried searching for 神谷 shen gu, but couldn't find anything in historical texts (on ctext) that had a reference related to the brain (also did a quick google search). Maybe the idea comes from somewhere in the Daoist Canon.

Edited December 4, 2018 by Aetherous

[wandelaar]

See page 520.

[Aetherous]

36 minutes ago, wandelaar said:

See page 520.

 

Ah okay I see that now, I found shen gu on page xlvi.

Actually, I just found "tian gu" on page 40...it's from "The Original Collection of Zi Qing Zhi" or 紫清指元集, written by Bai Yu Chan...who I think may have lived in the Song dynasty, and was the Sixth Patriarch of the southern branch of Quanzhen Dao, according to this book.

 

This might be the Chinese text of it.

 

This other Song-Ming era Daoist text might be a reference to tian gu.

Edited December 4, 2018 by Aetherous

[wandelaar]

Yang also speaks of shen gu in his book. What I am wondering about is whether anatomical knowledge in the time of Lao tzu was such that talk about a valley could have referred to the space between the two lobes of the brain.

 

 

Edited December 4, 2018 by wandelaar

[voidisyinyang]

16 minutes ago, wandelaar said:

Yang also speaks of shen gu in his book. What I am wondering about is whether anatomical knowledge in the time of Lao tzu was such that talk about a valley could have referred to the space between the two lobes of the brain.

 

 

Quote

the valley-like space between the two lobes of the brain is called “Shen Gu” (#■£■) (Spiritual Valley) or “Tian Gu” ( A^T) (Heaven Valley) where the “Gu Shen” ( -2Mt) (Valley Spirit) resides. This valley acts as an energy chamber that allows your thinking to vibrate and resonate with the surrounding energy and communicate with other natural spirits. The front end of the valley is the 221 Qigong Meditation “Heaven Eye” (Tian Yan, or “Heaven Gate” (Tian Men, Ef 1 ) and is what the Western world calls “The Third Eye.”

 

It is believed that we humans had this third eye, just as other animals do, and it was opened for us to communicate with other spirits through telepathy a long time ago. Later, when we learned how to lie, cheat, and play tricks on each other, in order to hide our secrets behind the mask, we closed it down and stopped the brain communicating directly through telepathy. According to Buddhist and Daoist societies, when this third eye is re-opened, we will be enlightened and suddenly comprehend the meaning of life and nature. Naturally, we will resume our capability of telepathy and read other peoples mind’s. When this happens, you must retire to the mountains and keep away from the masked human society. In order to reach this spiritual enlightenment, you must learn how to build up abundant Qi in the Real Lower Dan Tian and lead it upward through the Thrusting Vessel (Chong Mai, Hr®k) (spinal cord) to nourish the brain. When the brain has been energized to a higher level, The Third Eye will be re-opened.

He calls the Ming Tian Gu - the "heavenly drum" at the base of the skull.

[Taoist Texts]

6 hours ago, voidisyinyang said:

He calls the Ming Tian Gu - the "heavenly drum" at the base of the skull.

yes he does but thats a different term

 

heavenly valley is 天谷 - а rare term for mystical anatomy locus in the head, from late Taoism. Association with lobes and whatnot is Yang's fantasy. 天谷 is associated with shengu, a DDJ term, which is in fact a misreading.

 

[exorcist_1699]

"Tian Gu" ("天谷" ) literally means "  valley , an emptied  mind , on top/heaven" comes from a phrase  of  Huang Di Nei Jing,  the most important classics of TCM  :

 

"天谷元神, 守之自真"

 

" Focus on  the Tian Gu and maintain that emptied meta-Mind  ,  we can live forever. "

 

Why  just focusing on the upper dantian makes  us live forever  physically seems difficult to comprehend , not to mention that  most of the  later-coming  TCM medical qigong writings mainly ask people to focus on the lower dantian .  In fact , why men can't get rid of  their jing leakage is  due to the uncontrolled lust from their  lower dantian , which  disguised as illusory desires and emotions  (" 妄情 "  )  , that helps nature secretly  "steal"  their  jing and qi   (  see Yin  Fu Jing)  and make them  die  ; a persistent emptied Mind therefore is  the most  reliable safeguard against such an unnoticed loss..

 

(* upper dantian is place of troublesome , be careful )

Edited December 16, 2018 by exorcist_1699

[Aetherous]

58 minutes ago, exorcist_1699 said:

comes from a phrase  of  Huang Di Nei Jing,  the most important classics of TCM  :

 

"天谷元神, 守之自真"

 

I wonder what version of the HDNJ? Or if other texts just say that the HDNJ says it? Can't find it when I search the common version of the text for the term here: https://ctext.org/chinese-medicine?searchu=天谷

[Taoist Texts]

53 minutes ago, Aetherous said:

Or if other texts just say that the HDNJ says it?

This misattribution probably gained currency from

https://zh.wikisource.org/zh-hans/玄膚論

by a fairly famous neidanist

Lu Xixing - FYSK: Daoist Culture Centre - DatabaseAug 28, 2009 - Lu Xixing(  Lu Xixing ), who lived in the Ming Dynasty, was from Xinghua, in Yangzhou (in today's Jiangsu province),

[exorcist_1699]

Huang Di Nei Jing is composed of "素問" and  "靈樞", and the phrase comes from  "靈樞", which specialize in  acupuncture  theory and skills ;  note that both are  ancient paragraphs /books  with many hand-copied versions on bamboo/cloth , so differences in content is likely.

 

My claim based on the following 4 books' quotations, they are either Ming or Song's writings :

 

1) 玄膚論

2) 紫清指玄篇

3) 性命圭旨

4) 脈望

 

It is nothing  strange that if you can't find it on the modern version of  "靈樞". 

 

 

Edited December 14, 2018 by exorcist_1699