clumsy and ungraceful

[rootroot]

I trip over alot of things, i'm physically uncareful, basically i'm clumsy. any types of meditation for this?

[Oolong Rabbit]

I trip over alot of things, i'm physically uncareful, basically i'm clumsy. any types of meditation for this?

 

Any type of martial art will help make you more spacially aware. I would recommend something that combines martial art and meditation such as Tai chi, Bagua etc.... Then again, something like ballroom dancing would probably even help.

[joeblast]

I think some simple mindfulness would help...be aware of where you are, what you are doing. If your mind is off somewhere and not on what you are doing in the present moment, you're far more likely to stumble. It can be applied anywhere and to everything, whatever it is that you are doing.

its something I've been trying to teach my boy...

[steve]

Taiji is great for this. Meditation alone may help as well but taiji really focuses on coordination of movement in time and space and integration of the mind with physical movement.

[VCraigP]

Taiji is great for this. Meditation alone may help as well but taiji really focuses on coordination of movement in time and space and integration of the mind with physical movement.

 

While I agree that Taiji is the supreme ultimate, it may be a bit too much of a bite for starters.

 

What is likely to be missing here is sufficient mind/body connection. It is SO common for people to be out of touch with their body. Somehow you must find a way to make that connection.

 

I read recently somewhere (a source I trust but cannot recall at the moment) that the joints are responsible for holding the bulk of proprioception in the body. Proprioception is a big word meaning your sense of space and movement of the body. As side note I recently sprained my ankle somewhat severely, re-injuring a decades old weak point. Initially even after I could walk mostly normally I still was experiencing some interesting uncharacteristic clumsiness. Like running into things with my other foot, or knee. Seems like the inflammation in my ankle was helping to prevent me from getting proper spacial signals.

 

I really like doing a warm up where I go through each part of my body and rotate or turn or otherwise move each joint in turn. Doing something like this WITH mindfullness will be helpful in making a better body mind connection. Focusing on opening the joints should help improve proprioception.

 

Maybe I'll post a list of my "Taiji" warmups later as an example.

 

Again, any martial art, yoga or similar discipline should incorporate such work, but IMA and Qigong are more likely to consciously work on developing better centering in the body.

 

Craig

[Buddy]

Hi Craig,

"While I agree that Taiji is the supreme ultimate"

While obviously taiji has a literal meaning that is something like that, it doesn't mean that it is the "supreme ulitmate" martial art, obviously that depends on the practitioner. But if we look at the taiji symbol, I think Yin/Yang boxing would be a better translation.

[steve]

While I agree that Taiji is the supreme ultimate, it may be a bit too much of a bite for starters.

 

I'm going to respectfully disagree. The majority of taiji programs are health/fitness oriented and many are geared towards seniors whose primary need is better balance and coordination. Most teach a short and non-demanding form with easy warmups. An intense, martially oriented program might not be the best fit but a qualified teacher who focuses on health and wellness would be ideal for this purpose. They can often be found at YMCAs, senior centers, wellness centers, and so on - just my $.02.

 

PS As was already mentioned, simple mindfullness practice would be very beneficial but is one of the most challenging and ellusive disciplines I've ever practiced...

[VCraigP]

Hi Craig,

"While I agree that Taiji is the supreme ultimate"

While obviously taiji has a literal meaning that is something like that, it doesn't mean that it is the "supreme ulitmate" martial art, obviously that depends on the practitioner. But if we look at the taiji symbol, I think Yin/Yang boxing would be a better translation.

 

 

Arrrgggghhh. OK. ummm. Yes there are several good ways to translate Taiji. I was kinda playin with words there.

 

Not really the point of my post. Perhaps you would care to help out with your own suggestion to address to initial question in the thread??

 

Craig

[steve]

Hi Craig,

"While I agree that Taiji is the supreme ultimate"

While obviously taiji has a literal meaning that is something like that, it doesn't mean that it is the "supreme ulitmate" martial art, obviously that depends on the practitioner. But if we look at the taiji symbol, I think Yin/Yang boxing would be a better translation.

I agree that Supreme Ultimate Boxing is a poor translation but it ain't going away anytime soon. Here's a good example of poor translation causing widespread misunderstanding in issues related to Daoism. I think a better concise definition of Taiji would be Complimentary Opposites. Yet most of us on this forum know that defining taiji requires a parapraph, or a book, or better yet, meditation, not two or three words. I never use Supreme Ultimate Boxing - I like to call it Taijiquan. Taiji Boxing or Yin Yang Boxing also work quite nicely. Maybe we should go back to Long Boxing... Complimentary Opposite Boxing doesn't sound quite right...

[VCraigP]

I'm going to respectfully disagree. The majority of taiji programs are health/fitness oriented and many are geared towards seniors whose primary need is better balance and coordination. Most teach a short and non-demanding form with easy warmups. An intense, martially oriented program might not be the best fit but a qualified teacher who focuses on health and wellness would be ideal for this purpose. They can often be found at YMCAs, senior centers, wellness centers, and so on - just my $.02.

 

PS As was already mentioned, simple mindfullness practice would be very beneficial but is one of the most challenging and ellusive disciplines I've ever practiced...

 

 

Xuesheng

 

I disagree with simple mindfullness practice as the prescription here. In fact since a lot of people in the west tend to be HEAD oriented they tend to be DIS connnected from their bodies. Result: clumsy and ungraceful.

 

Focusing on mindfullness ACCOMPANIED by exercises designed to lead to a greater consciousness of the body moving in space would be a good way to address the issues at hand.

 

I am not so sure that one can or should address being clumsy and ungraceful with a mental approach, in fact I am saying that this seems to be focusing on the head and not on the center of gravity.

 

Not to denigrate your experience with mindfullness practice but I think the route of going directly into the body would be the most effective.

 

What is the first lesson many IMA teachers try to get across? Sink the Qi. Bring your attention to your lower tantien. Most people have their energetic center floating higher than the Lower Tantien due to overheated heart and brain (western style excess Yang ) or other issues. <Yes I know this is a vast overgeneralization but it is my understanding of the situation > People who are overly "in their head" tend to be more clumsy and ungraceful compared to those who have put more attention into physical mastery, whether they are martial artists or any other type. People who watch TV or spend time at the computer tend also to have their energy more in their heads and less in their body. Therefore most if not all people need to learn how to Sink the Qi. (Buddy - you can just use the idea of putting your mind in your center of gravity, although I am sure you don't need IMA advice from me)

 

 

 

Craig

[steve]

Xuesheng

 

I disagree with simple mindfullness practice as the prescription here. In fact since a lot of people in the west tend to be HEAD oriented they tend to be DIS connnected from their bodies. Result: clumsy and ungraceful.

 

Focusing on mindfullness ACCOMPANIED by exercises designed to lead to a greater consciousness of the body moving in space would be a good way to address the issues at hand.

 

I am not so sure that one can or should address being clumsy and ungraceful with a mental approach, in fact I am saying that this seems to be focusing on the head and not on the center of gravity.

 

Not to denigrate your experience with mindfullness practice but I think the route of going directly into the body would be the most effective.

 

What is the first lesson many IMA teachers try to get across? Sink the Qi. Bring your attention to your lower tantien. Most people have their energetic center floating higher than the Lower Tantien due to overheated heart and brain (western style excess Yang ) or other issues. <Yes I know this is a vast overgeneralization but it is my understanding of the situation > People who are overly "in their head" tend to be more clumsy and ungraceful compared to those who have put more attention into physical mastery, whether they are martial artists or any other type. People who watch TV or spend time at the computer tend also to have their energy more in their heads and less in their body. Therefore most if not all people need to learn how to Sink the Qi. (Buddy - you can just use the idea of putting your mind in your center of gravity, although I am sure you don't need IMA advice from me)

Craig

This is getting interesting. I'm going to continue this detour as I think it may be instructive.

 

I would prefer to say that people are too much in their thoughts, not their head. I think this is an important distinction. Also, this raises questions about the "head" - body relationship:

 

Is sinking the qi in the head or the body?

Is mindfullness just in the head?

 

Obviously questions that are worthy of further discussion, IMO. Nevertheless, I agree with you 100% regarding the importance of a physical component to this questioner's problem, that's why I mentioned taiji. I also think there is great importance in a mental component (what causes the qi to sink?). Some of the greatest benefits of taiji, yoga, qigong, and other martial arts derive from the integration of the mental with the physical which helps get you out of your thoughts and into reality.

[Buddy]

Craig,

I guess it depends on the age of the questioner. In a martial art vein I would suggest some type of long fist or something. But, really anything that is strenuous, enjoyable, and involves rhythm I think would suit nicely.

 

I'm going to agree with Craig on "public" taiji. Most people try to think and feel rather than do. And most public teachers have no clue about shen fa. Any choreography is sufficient if you're not going to use structure.

[VCraigP]

This is getting interesting. I'm going to continue this detour as I think it may be instructive.

 

I would prefer to say that people are too much in their thoughts, not their head. I think this is an important distinction. Also, this raises questions about the "head" - body relationship:

 

Is sinking the qi in the head or the body?

Is mindfullness just in the head?

 

Obviously questions that are worthy of further discussion, IMO. Nevertheless, I agree with you 100% regarding the importance of a physical component to this questioner's problem, that's why I mentioned taiji. I also think there is great importance in a mental component (what causes the qi to sink?). Some of the greatest benefits of taiji, yoga, qigong, and other martial arts derive from the integration of the mental with the physical which helps get you out of your thoughts and into reality.

 

Xuesheng

We are not in disagreement.

 

Is mindfullness just in the head?

Yes I knew the question was inherent in this discussion, as well I surmised that "mindfullness practice" was a deep topic for you.

 

What is mind, what is thought, which if any is contained in the head? What causes one to not move from their center of gravity and what are the best ways to realize and correct this?

 

Does being too much in ones thoughts lead to energy or Qi being too much in the head?

 

What exactly is mindfullness and can it assist in centering in ones body?

 

to simplify my earlier statment. I think Taiji, Bagua or other physical trainging centered on the same principles would be very useful here.

It is my personal experience that one can begin to learn and apply principles common to these arts without having to delve too deeply into the specific forms or techniques of those arts.

 

If I were teaching someone who has the issues described I would try to begin with basic joint exercises as briefly described and some balancing exercises obtained from IMA training as well. I would add a simple technique which helps to sink the qi (breath and sound technique).

 

That is what I was thnking when I wrote that Taiji would be too big a bite to take on. Perhaps I was thinking more like prescribing medicine to address the presenting issue and not asking the patient to take on more than he was willing or able as an initial response.

 

Not everyone is willing or able to take on real martial arts training. By which I am saying I have a personal bias against "YMCA" Taiji, watered down Taiji. Which is really ironic because I am practicing at a local YMCA with a couple of friends the Taiji I am studying.

 

I think it would be much more useful to study good principles than Fluff Taiji.

 

Craig

[Cameron]

Ken Cohen says sitting and forgetting and standing meditation are the foundation of qigong training. If someone were to ask me what to practice with no backround experience in meditation or already not focused and ungrounded I would say focus on those 2:sitting and forgetting and standing meditation, for a good year before moving on to more exotic qigong systems or martial arts which already require a bit of balance, focus etc to perform well.

 

Cam