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TheWhiteRabbit

US ideology has been decided

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As time progresses, the ideology of the United States has become focused on the conceptualization of distinction and Political Correctness.

This is something that has become widespread as identity politics has taken over largely both parties up to a point.

It made Republicans more Democrat in thinking.

But, if one line of thought is only allowed, is this ethical?  Especially, when it does not allow room to challenge the "Status Quo" of ideas?

This video covers how this grew and changed our society over the past decades.

[video]

[/video]

 

What is left to ask, I am beyond the point of stressing the gravity of the choices made.  I have reached a point not of giving up.  But, a point of curiousity, mingled with humor that humans actually fight to support a concept that leaves them with fewer choices and allow people to be bullied into passivity when it comes to challenging ideas.

 

Naturally, all ideas should be challenged as people have the right to decide, as much as they have the right to think freely.  Perhaps, this is my way of explaining that yes, you can challenge this "Status Quo" but you will have as much trouble as I have had in addressing the problem.  In the video, it states plainly that the defensive mechanism is that you are made to look as though you are threatening weaker social groups.  This is madness... The madness of our time.

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In another clip , which was about a course on Kant. The prof describes logical argument as battle, a freudian attempt to kill an enemy. 

As long as argument is used like that, it will be an aggressive behavior. Society does appear to be becoming dumbed down in this arena, as intellectual discussion becomes democratized. 

The madness of our times for sure. 

Turn the like button into an acknowledged button, and disable video clips. Imo.

Edited by Stosh

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Actually I'd like to see to see a little more 'politeness' in the political system.  In my view the move towards hyper-partisanship keeps the pragmatism down.  There were long periods where both sides were much more willing to work with the other side to get things done.  These days many moderates are gone and people play for the camera and the 'red meat' of there constituencies. 

 

I think there's a wide difference between Republicans platform and Democrats**.  Yet, intelligent politics has to be pragmatic and benefit the majority of people.  This creates compromise, which is good, imo.  Zealots and 'true believers' on both sides are destructive. 

 

 

**imo Trump leans Republican and a bit Libertarian but is mostly pro-Trump and makes decisions based less on ideology (or study) and more on instinct, populism of his current audience and who he talked to last. 

 

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I guess we will have to wait and see what happens.  I'm all for peaceful resolution.  Or did I mean REVOLUTION?!?!?

HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

 

kidding.

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23 hours ago, Stosh said:

In another clip , which was about a course on Kant. The prof describes logical argument as battle, a freudian attempt to kill an enemy. 

As long as argument is used like that, it will be an aggressive behavior. Society does appear to be becoming dumbed down in this arena, as intellectual discussion becomes democratized. 

The madness of our times for sure. 

Turn the like button into an acknowledged button, and disable video clips. Imo.

 

Out of curiosity, I noted you said "as long as an argument is used like that, it will be an aggressive behavior."

 

No, it is not.  This is another lie.  If you believe passionately in something, you do give your opinion very passionately.  Just because someone strenuously disagrees with something does not make it aggressive.  But, this lie is taught on many major campuses.

 

So, if strenuously disagreeing something passionately is aggression, I want no part in that idea that it could be conceived of as aggression.  Because this kind of thing happens all the time in life.  In fact as Alan Watts put it "if you destroy your enemy you are really in a sticky situation"  and "it is because enemies make us stronger because we adapt, thus it is important to love our enemies."  So even if a term, perspective is in fact a real aggression, it is actually doing you a favor.

 

That whole paradigm or school of thought is deeply flawed and there is no way to resolve it through the same means we used when we created the problem.  I am not saying lets grab pitchforks and torches and go after the trouble makers.  No, destroying people is never the solution.  But realizing that these lies run deep and that we have created a new generation of people so dependent upon a system that forces people to turn things inward is part of what has even caused much mental illness as well.  Because we do not live in a bubble or vaccuum.  You will run into people who will challenge everything about you.  It doesnt matter if it is on a street or in a forum.  You don't get people stroking your ego when you are middleaged and telling you everything is okay.  If you are one of these, like I once was... There is no one around to help you fix a broken world that you realize you damaged because you thought all of that was "OK".  That is what happened to me, yeah it took a while to get back on track and set things up for success but this whole line of thinking or microagressions and aggressions we learned in college is garbage.  It does nothing to help people in the real world and does more harm than good.  I have lived it.

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I didnt equate discourse with arguing, I said if it used like that then the point is valid, which means that it may not be used like that. 

There are certain rhetorical tricks , which when used ,  indicate to me, that there is the goal of trumping a point on rhetorical grounds, not necessarily, the goal of coming to the truest representation of reality. 

So we may agree fairly closely on the subject of the potential value of discourse which is done correctly, often though its not. 

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6 minutes ago, Stosh said:

I didnt equate discourse with arguing, I said if it used like that then the point is valid, which means that it may not be used like that. 

There are certain rhetorical tricks , which when used ,  indicate to me, that there is the goal of trumping a point on rhetorical grounds, not necessarily, the goal of coming to the truest representation of reality. 

So we may agree fairly closely on the subject of the potential value of discourse which is done correctly, often though its not. 

 

You're grasping.  That is why I can not agree.  To clearly communicate shows an open mind and open heart. That is why when I speak I do so without any fear of reproach.  Try letting go of what is holding you down and just speak freely.

 

Grasping happens when we are too attached to points that we feel stuck and struggle to defend them.  Just try letting go and speaking freely.  It works.

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2 minutes ago, TheWhiteRabbit said:

 

You're grasping.  That is why I can not agree.  To clearly communicate shows an open mind and open heart. That is why when I speak I do so without any fear of reproach.  Try letting go of what is holding you down and just speak freely.

 

Grasping happens when we are too attached to points that we feel stuck and struggle to defend them.  Just try letting go and speaking freely.  It works.

Can you be more particular , what you feel I am grasping at or about? 

 

If I were to just speak freely, the superego censorship in my head would be gone , that is also part of me and , I cannot respond genuinely by suppressing it. It cares how my words are to be read ,, what the impacts will be. 

Edited by Stosh
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1 hour ago, TheWhiteRabbit said:

 

  Just try letting go and speaking freely.  It works.

It may also get you reported.

 

We do have some PC folks here.

 

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11 hours ago, Marblehead said:

It may also get you reported.

 

We do have some PC folks here.

 

I wont fight directly against political correctness.  I will tell people the dangers of political correctness.  In that sense they are safe.  I will have no part in genocide-of-thought because that is what political correctness does.  In that sense political correctness is safe.  Too safe.

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13 hours ago, Stosh said:

Can you be more particular , what you feel I am grasping at or about? 

 

If I were to just speak freely, the superego censorship in my head would be gone , that is also part of me and , I cannot respond genuinely by suppressing it. It cares how my words are to be read ,, what the impacts will be. 

 

Deep down there is the clearest fundamental point that your original spirit or original self is trying to convey.  That is what I mean.  When we start worrying too much about this or that I becomes truely bothersome like you stated, albeit indirectly. But there is something deep that you must get in touch with.  Taking some time to slow down and just trying to sort out what you mean to say means all the difference.

 

When I give advice, I don't mean for you to do exactly what I say.  That is bogus for the main reason that everyone is different.  People handle and address things in different ways.  Your propensity towards thought is a part of this.  So, this would put you in the Jungian Thinking Perciving or Thinking Sensing areas of the personality spectrum.  Something unique you can play around with is discovery of your unique personality type.  It can allow you to find out what your strengths and your weaknesses are. As you will grow and change your personality type may also change as you find aspects of yourself that are self-defeating and you make efforts to change your thinking/feeling/sensing/perceiving attributes.

 

You are a great thinker Stosh and so I can tell you that you most likely deal with thinking and perhaps things along the lines of but not limited to chemical or physics and social sciences like psychology and epistemology.  Generally men tend to dominate at least for now most of the stem psychology areas.  What you can take away for yourself is that in the thinking spectrum, there is a lean toward the focus onthe thinking itself and it being yin in nature (neither good nor bad actually)... Lends itself towards not making as many decisions and inactivity.  Learning to quickly sort through it and be decisive can help with this.  But that is also the reason that studying one's personality type is more helpful because we learn what these strengths and weaknesses are.  Exercise is most important because it helps us be more decisive and slows much of the degrade of intelligence as time goes on.

 

I can tell you something important about myself, that I did start off in the scientist area (INTJ) and as I came in contact and interacted more with people helped them target their strengths and weaknesses as an ENTJ... Eventually, I became the most nefarious of personality types an ENTP.  But, that was my own personal journey.  I enjoy tackling large mainstream thought and patterns in nature and making them available to humanity.  So, in a sense my humanitarian interests never died.  They were just sublimated and crystalized into the form it is now.  I know that people who are conscientious enough are the only ones who have the ability to grow and become something more.  The 'I just want quick things I can do that will change my life' will always be the bane of human existence.  Learning and never taking the time to understand why things work is never anything that ever achieves greatness because in the end they give way to doubt and concessions of the evil and corrupt that seek to undo mankinds movement towards greatness.  This deep aspect of the human psyche is embodied in the concept of Kali.  She shows what the eventual end is.. Angry women, death and destruction, but in this manner is the best teacher because we learn very well the need for order.  All living beings achieve a homeostasis which is the ability to adapt to the environment to maintain life.  This order is apparent in nature and humanity.  Once we realize this, the options are clear and we don't look to degrading established things to further disorder.  When I said "Angry women" I mean this sarcastically.  But the vivid picture shows how people can be given to too much emotion and just like PC thinking it can become too aggressive, stifle new thoughts and innovations.  Thus the outcome is one that becomes destructive by its nature.  Any too much yin or too much yang is not a state of balance and leads to the undoing of health or being of things given the thing, being or whatever.  I say too much and that is good enough for now.  Study of Kali probably isn't something for the normal person unless you are interested in time travel or playing God.  People who are not conscientious enough simply do not have the capacity or fortitude to understand something so deep, subconscious and aggressive, nor able to understand or use those things effectively.  Kali is not accessed by prayer but by rare indrajaals and texts that put you in touch with her.  These can still be purchased if you look hard or long enough and probably is a good thing too.  Because if just anyone got their hands on that type of knowledge it probably wouldn't be a good thing.  We would end up with too many people causing way too much damage to an already imbalanced system (Earth).

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Just now, Will said:

This is not related to this thread topic at all LOL, but I like the quote in your signature, @TheWhiteRabbit. Where's it from?

I came up with it.  Because I realized that the infinite possibilities of human existence are already there, we just have to choose the best one for ourselves.  So, it is a self-quotation.  I merely want people to be aware of the fact that what we do as people has an impact on everything.  That we all have decisions to make on our co-created reality here on earth and that has results.  If we choose to give our power away to ideas or things we are just as responsible as if we did those things ourselves.  So, if we are part of something or an organization we become responsible for it's behavior.  The way we exempt ourselves from that Karma is if we merely inspire people to do things or do good things for people or society ourselves.  By extension we can create organizations we have hold dynamic over (note I did not say control).  It is just another in a long line of working through understanding how people do things and what makes us responsible for things.  I am just a human.

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White Rabbit,

I think I did test out as INTJ but lost track of what it means, I would be the same either way, right?  In Campbells book I saw an image of Kali I liked. It was my impression that such are symbols of complicated ideas. Even if they seem fearsome, one who comes to terms with the concepts favorably , may find they no longer feel the same about the symbol. 

Edited by Stosh

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21 hours ago, Stosh said:

White Rabbit,

I think I did test out as INTJ but lost track of what it means, I would be the same either way, right?  In Campbells book I saw an image of Kali I liked. It was my impression that such are symbols of complicated ideas. Even if they seem fearsome, one who comes to terms with the concepts favorably , may find they no longer feel the same about the symbol. 

 

INTJs are usually the scientists, sometimes they mastermind evil plots.  They are the focused and decisive thinkers in the world..  Which is good if INT ends in P or S they endlessly work on problems and drag their feet.  As an ENTJ I found throwing people like the aforementioned directly into situation or conflict scared them into achieving results they were later happy with... Turning them more INTJ...

That is a good question.  Rather than an easy answer try Alan Watts on "why we need enemies" and if you Have access to Milton Erickson's books/volumes I would say "frames of reference" may have meaning when we talk about desensitization to vivid imagery.

18 hours ago, Spotless said:

The guy in the video is scrambled eggs.

 

Always someone throwing the baby out with the bath water, but not everyone likes everything you know.

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4 hours ago, TheWhiteRabbit said:

 

INTJs are usually the scientists, sometimes they mastermind evil plots.  They are the focused and decisive thinkers in the world..  Which is good if INT ends in P or S they endlessly work on problems and drag their feet.  As an ENTJ I found throwing people like the aforementioned directly into situation or conflict scared them into achieving results they were later happy with... Turning them more INTJ...

That is a good question.  Rather than an easy answer try Alan Watts on "why we need enemies" and if you Have access to Milton Erickson's books/volumes I would say "frames of reference" may have meaning when we talk about desensitization to vivid imagery.

 

Always someone throwing the baby out with the bath water, but not everyone likes everything you know.

Desensitization has its value, but what I was talking about , with Kali, was that understanding the image changes the way we react to it. , kind of like getting to know a scary looking person , and they turn out to be really cool. Then the looks ,no longer indicate what you took them for originally. 

I think, that in the Tibetan book of the dead , there are these scary beings , and one needs to know what to do with them , in order to move along , so they are potentially object lessons. 

 

I suppose Any of the letter-group -label people can end up behaving on either side of society. 

Edited by Stosh

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19 hours ago, Stosh said:

Desensitization has its value, but what I was talking about , with Kali, was that understanding the image changes the way we react to it. , kind of like getting to know a scary looking person , and they turn out to be really cool. Then the looks ,no longer indicate what you took them for originally. 

I think, that in the Tibetan book of the dead , there are these scary beings , and one needs to know what to do with them , in order to move along , so they are potentially object lessons. 

 

I suppose Any of the letter-group -label people can end up behaving on either side of society. 

 

Yes, that is true.  Kali is in pop culture usually portrayed as evil.  But, in realty it is a highly reactive presence that sets in motion the destruction of evil and in hindu imagery shows what happens if we give way to ignorance.  Initially I started writing much about this but instead I decided to provide a few videos.   At the end of the post, Ill provide some meaningful tidbits.

And Sadhguru's synopsis:

So, my impressions having worked with this for a while... I had initially encountered opposition because people just assume the worst.  Over time, I learned to keep to myself.  Most people think that sacrifices is what Kali is about.  In realty, Kali is more about consciousness, time, primordial reactiveness.  People who have worked with it enough like me see it as a test of will.  Because you are constantly being challenged by something fierce and unwaivering.  In the end, this become a part of the self.  That is not to say that sweetness and compassion is lost, for it is still there, people just learn to use it in different ways.  With Kali compassion is like the female bear with cubs.  Yeah, she cares dearly for her cubs, but she violently destroys any who come close to her cubs.  So, this is the dark side of compassion.  Compassion is good, as long as you are on the receiving end.  But, it doesn't solve the problems because Kali eats demons and evil things alive.  Very vivid.

 

Yes, I agree you can have people on any spectrum with a personality type.

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The personality types seem a similar tool, for inspection, like the images of these gods and goddesses. ... alas, its difficult to depict nothingness. 

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