Flying Phoenix Chi Kung

[ridingtheox]

John has me considering a question: How many minutes of Flying Phoenix to hit the tipping point energetically?

 

What I mean by this is, How many minutes of FP gets you into a really strong energetic state?

 

IIRC Sifu Terry once said doing three of the advanced MSW series would yield really good results. Several of the advanced MSW meditations take me around 45 minutes to complete. So three of them can take a good two hours or more to complete.

 

So to answer my original question: *While any amount of time doing FP yields positive benefits*, for me personally at about the 45 minute mark FP practice, the FP energy hits a tipping point where the energy feels like it jumps up a level in power and also the benefits seem to take a jump as well.

 

I'm curious if anyone else has noticed a tipping point, and if yes when does it kick in?

 

Lloyd

John's answer is pretty complete, my experience is that the length of time before the intensity of the experience increases dramatically can vary significantly. Years ago doing the simple, standing still meditation (zhan zhuang) seemed to make the transition around 30 min, very suddenly. Recently, revisiting that exercise and after two years of FP daily, I can say that within 5 min the ramping up of qi began. Although it still takes several minutes (5-10) to reach what I think of as very deep physical energy; that is not quite so sudden a transition, but the level is much the same. Mathematically the two are like a) a discrete step function and a logistic curve if that means anything to you.

[ridingtheox]

Business news for all Flying Phoenix Chi Kung practitioners and enthusiasts:

The retail price of Volume One "5 Basic Standing Meditations" and of Volume Two "6 Basic Seated Meditations" of the Chi Kung For Health DVD series will be increased to by $5.00 to $29.95 effective September 1--after exactly 10 years at the current bargain price. These titles can still be purchased at the current price of $24.95 from now through August 31.

 

Thank you to all for your support over the years.

 

Sifu Terry Dunn

 

www.taichimania.com/chikung_catalog.html

still a really great bargain!! (I just ordered the yang long form on dvd as my old tape is dead after 20 ? years!)

Edited August 25, 2013 by ridingtheox

[tao stillness]

What if all business in America decided to do what Sifu Terry just did? Stop the price gouging and just offer products as a fair price instead of whatever the market will allow? I'm not sure if Sifu's price increase even matches the price hikes from the post office for shipping over the last 10 years.

 

Now I have to comment on what John has written about length of time doing Flying Phoenix. I think the most dedicated in this art, or any art for that matter, have a tad bit more of a perfectionism streak than most folks. That is what drives us to want to do it precisely and get the results. So that makes us put maybe more pressure on ourselves than is good for us. And then we get a bit unbalanced for awhile. I have been staying up till midnight each night for the past several months because I want to get in as much chi kung as possible but I also have other enjoyable things that I do after work. I know that I have not gotten enough sleep and this lowers my immune system. So no surprise that I came down with pneumonia a week ago. So this forces me now to adjust my practice and strive for what I can reasonably do instead of push it to the limit. That is why John's take on how long to practice this stuff really rings true for me. We're not in the Shaolin Temple where a new movement is practiced for 4 hours at one time. At the same time, I greatly admire you guys who want to go for the gold and put 45 minutes into one meditation just so you get the maximum benefit. It comes down to individual needs, desires and lifestyle. It's what works for the individual.

[Fu_doggy]

John and Charlie - thanks for your comments... Good points made by both.

 

A couple more thoughts:

 

First, I think we can all agree that tipping points *do exist*. In chemistry or physics there is the "quantum leap" in which a given "ground state", with energy added, will JUMP to a higher level state. The transition from ground state to the higher level state is not gradual, but rather it is sudden and instantaneous. Or, a more common concept is that of critical mass....that point at which something drastically different occurs. That point at which these changes occur would be an example of tipping point.

 

Second, energetically and/or metaphysically most of us who have practiced an energetic art such as qigong or a meditative art have at some point experienced this. So I am saying with thought and observation, we should be able to approximately replicate the initial conditions of a tipping point.

 

Third, to John's point, in a metaphysical state of being there is no concept of time or space, so trying to find a hard and fast timeframe or set of rules for reaching a tipping point can get a bit fuzzy. Indeed some of my most profound experiences while doing FP have happened within the first 20 minutes from the start of practice....and they happened spontaneously and unpredictably. So my own experience would validate John's observation. And also Charlie's point about the time it takes to experience an energetic jump can vary significantly would also corroborate.

 

That said, I am searching for some set of *general practice guidelines* that would significantly increase the probability of hitting a tipping point on a daily basis (my wacky long work days notwithstanding). In other words given the busy life most of us lead, I am searching for that tipping point that is actually doable. Any further comments and observations are appreciated.

 

Lloyd

 

PS - Steve, I am convinced part of reaching an energetic tipping point with some regularity includes getting enough sleep. So sorry to hear about your pneumonia....please take care of yourself and get better soon! I tried doing the same thing you were doing, that is doing long sessions of FP at night at the expense of my normal sleep. That didn't work out too well, as I also became run down. Sifu Terry has always advised Flying Phoenix practitioners to get plenty of sleep. ;-)

[Fu_doggy]

Pitisukha - my experience say yes.

[tao stillness]

Lloyd,

Thank you for the well wishes.

You reminded about something Maharishi was once interested in. He wanted to see if they could use a person's daily biorhythm to find the optimum time that person should meditate in order to get the deepest experience. The person would then not even have to spend the required 20 minutes for a meditation session if the results could be achieved in less time. He never spoke about that idea again.

[pitisukha]

Pitisukha - my experience say yes.

My girlfriend has started to wake up at night and seeing people, she usually gets scared and the presence disappears.. this happens only in my apartment..

I have too say that she often has nightmares, and sometimes talk during sleep so I suppose the people seen can be something like a residual of some nightmare.

However the fact that these presences are seen only in my apartment give rise to my question on FP practice.

Fu_doggy, can you elaborate more on this? How do you approach this kind of things?

[Healing Artist]

Lloyd,

Thank you for the well wishes.

You reminded about something Maharishi was once interested in. He wanted to see if they could use a person's daily biorhythm to find the optimum time that person should meditate in order to get the deepest experience. The person would then not even have to spend the required 20 minutes for a meditation session if the results could be achieved in less time. He never spoke about that idea again.

This is a very meaningful and revealing point in the dual / non dual nature of meditation and it's effects in the world of waking consciousness Steve. I have found out about this actual realization for myself over the years of practice and trying my own different times and frequencies on many levels of not only Transcendental Meditation, but with other traditions as well. Enlightenment is beyond our ability to fully grasp intellectually. Nothing is written in stone. I also know some other good stories regarding Maharishi and his outside interests too.

Sifu Terry has asked me to share something with everyone here who has been following lately the discussion. In that I also have days where I only do three or four short groups of FP and Bot Dim Gum, Bak Fu Pai in a 20 minute or half hour time span before my work day. It seems that on those days I have some of my best experiences throughout with energy, attitude and physical comfort, and actual outcomes of that day (like today). In other words, I have a really good day. And I do the long form after at the end of the day (maybe with a few seated MSW). It seems to me that just a brief amount of the right combinations, often feels to be way more than enough to get through non stop of eight to nine hours of driving, conversation, lifting heavy luggage and a quick lunch as well. If I have the time before work to do more, I do so and it also works wonderfully well too. But the point here is that energy cultivation with celestial healing and martial arts is not necessarily a linearly restricted practice. A relatively little bit of time here apparently does go a long way. And in retrospect, I can easily see how it makes all the difference (in the world).

Sincerely

John

Edited August 27, 2013 by Healing Artist

[Fu_doggy]

John - that's a very good testimonial about the benefits of doing FP in the morning.

 

As is I seldom do a morning session because of my work schedule but I must say on the days I do things seem to go better.

 

Also, the nonlinearity of practice time-to-benefit is a valuable point. Your post is compelling enough to get me to consider making more of an effort towards a short morning session.

 

Thanks for posting… Lloyd

[Fu_doggy]

Pitisukha - I will send you a PM.

[tao stillness]

Lloyd,

I don't have time for chi kung much in the morning but I always do 90 80 50 20 for the energy.

Edited August 28, 2013 by tao stillness

[Healing Artist]

John - that's a very good testimonial about the benefits of doing FP in the morning.

 

As is I seldom do a morning session because of my work schedule but I must say on the days I do things seem to go better.

 

Also, the nonlinearity of practice time-to-benefit is a valuable point. Your post is compelling enough to get me to consider making more of an effort towards a short morning session.

 

Thanks for posting… Lloyd

Lloyd, If my time is limited as usual in the morning I do The 1st standing med. from vol 6. 90 60 40 30, for 5 to 10 min and then the 4th and 5th med from vol 5. I also do a (previously posted) med from GM Doo Wai's youtube videos. It is short, sweet and packs a big wallop. So do the other short med's that I just listed (also the 5th med from vol 6. 50 40 30 20 10 is most empowering too). The beauty seems to be what Sifu Terry has posted here in the past, that "less is more".

Thanks for your kind words

John

[ridingtheox]

John,

do you actually have vol 6? I thought it was not out yet?

[tao stillness]

vol. 6 I think I had read on this post was put out only on video years ago and was being redone on dvd.

[Healing Artist]

John,

do you actually have vol 6? I thought it was not out yet?

Charlie,

Steve is correct. I do have the older VHS from a long time ago when it was first released. I still look forward to this, and all of the other forthcoming new releases of Terry's on DVD.

John

[tao stillness]

I have seen the VHS series still advertised in somewhat current issue of Qi Magazine, volume 22, no. 2. Summer 2013.

Volume 5 of that VHS series in the advertisement has the picture of Sifu Terry, younger looking, in front of Stonehenge.

I would wait for the new DVD version.

Edited August 29, 2013 by tao stillness

[CrunchyChocolate555]

Hi Terry,

 

I know most people experience great benefits from doing a high volume of FPQG but I recently noticed (I say recently, as I was kind of denying this before), that I tend to quickly get nervous system exhaustion if I do anything over 30 minutes of qigong (including FPQG), despite being in excellent physical condition.

 

My question is, given my observation, what would be the best thing for me to do if I want to continue cultivating FP energy? Tone it down on the volume? Say 15 minutes a day for a couple of weeks, and go up 5-10 minutes at a time?

 

Anything more you could add on that note would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[pitisukha]

Hi Crunchy,

 

As a beginner with FP I'd like to ask you, what are the symptoms that tells you get nervous system exhaustion?

 

A more open question to everyone, how one can tell with quite certainty that is practicing too much?

[CrunchyChocolate555]

Hi Pitisukha,

 

I would say it's not something you need to be overly concerned with doing FPQG. It seems I am a rare case in this instance.

 

For a detailed explanation of CNS exhaustion from doing too much internal work, I would suggest reading "Opening the Energy Gates of the Body" by B.K. Frantzis.

 

Basically, it's like physical exhaustion, but worse.

 

 

Hi Crunchy,

 

As a beginner with FP I'd like to ask you, what are the symptoms that tells you get nervous system exhaustion?

 

A more open question to everyone, how one can tell with quite certainty that is practicing too much?

[zen-bear]

Hi Terry,

 

I know most people experience great benefits from doing a high volume of FPQG but I recently noticed (I say recently, as I was kind of denying this before), that I tend to quickly get nervous system exhaustion if I do anything over 30 minutes of qigong (including FPQG), despite being in excellent physical condition.

 

My question is, given my observation, what would be the best thing for me to do if I want to continue cultivating FP energy? Tone it down on the volume? Say 15 minutes a day for a couple of weeks, and go up 5-10 minutes at a time?

 

Anything more you could add on that note would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Hi CrunchC:

 

My first response is to advise you to practice at a duration each day that doesn't bring-on nervous system exhaustion--if that exhaustion is truly debilitating. It may be possible that what you are feeling to be nervous system "exhaustion" is actually nervous system relaxation. In which case you should try to practice through the exhaustion feeling until you "hit" rejuvenation through allostasis. But I can't say for sure without seeing you.

 

I can't really give you a confident prescription on improving your FP cultivation without seeing your practice. And also seeing your over all aura and state of health. This can be done, however, through a Skype video consultation...as I recently acquired a new webcam.

 

**So I will take the opportunity here to announce to all FP Qigong practitioners that I am now officially offering video consultations/lessons in FP Qigong via Skype. And the fee will be the same as what I charged Fu_Dog (Lloyd in Orlando,FL) in 2009: $90 per half hour, with a fifteen-minute ($45.00) consultation being the minimum service.

 

Sorry I can't be of more help. But let me know through Private Messaging if you want to set up an appointment for a Skype session. You can also contact me at [email protected]

 

Best,

 

Sifu Terry

Edited August 31, 2013 by zen-bear

[zen-bear]

My girlfriend has started to wake up at night and seeing people, she usually gets scared and the presence disappears.. this happens only in my apartment..

I have too say that she often has nightmares, and sometimes talk during sleep so I suppose the people seen can be something like a residual of some nightmare.

However the fact that these presences are seen only in my apartment give rise to my question on FP practice.

Fu_doggy, can you elaborate more on this? How do you approach this kind of things?

Hello Alexandro,

 

There are two modes of experience being experienced by your girlfriend that you both want to be careful not to confuse or cross-up:

First, you state that she has been waking up from sleep and seeing presences in your apartment and that this happens only at your apartment...and that they disappear when she becomes scared (and I assume abreacts in some way). This is evidence of a haunting by a dis-corporated entity or entities.

 

Second, you state that she often has nightmares and that she talks in her sleep.

*Does she have nightmares outside of your apartment as well?--or does she have the nightmares only at your apartment?

 

*Most important question: Are the presences in the apartment that she sees upon waking up from sleep the same entities that she experiences in her nightmares? Getting her answer to this question will help with further advice.

 

The characters in your girlfriend's dreams come from her own mind--unless she is under pressure/attack from dis-corporated entities that are in your apartment. But if she is being woken by entities in your apartment and sees them each time, then that's evidence that she is probably being haunted or being messed with by low-level spirit(s).

 

In any event, to answer your question: FP Qigong practice will sensitize one to be able to recognize and perceive spiritual entities (usually after years of practice, unless one has a gift or predilection to commune with spirits), but it will not make one more vulnerable to psychic attack or haunting by unpleasant or angry ghosts. Any vulnerability to attack is there to begin with. And the ghost or ghosts are there to begin with. It's one's own karma that "draws" or rather encounters non-physical beings--not a Qigong method. (Participating in a spiritual invocation consciously or inadvertantly, of course, will open the doors to spiritual encroachment of invasion if one is not careful and properly trained to deal with spirits.)

 

Another interesting and key question is whether you are able to see these presences when your girlfriend sees them. If you do, then that's simple confirmation. But it may be a situation where she is able to see the disturbing entity and not you.

 

At any rate, your girlfriend's nightmares-- if they occur both at and away from your apartment--can be addressed and resolved by good counseling and hypnotherapy/dream therapy. On the other hand, her being woken up in her sleep by "presences" if they are indeed supramundane entities is a situation that calls for an exorcism or some adequate countermeasure short of an exorcism. Of course, I cannot speak to such operations in this forum or on the medium of a blogsite.

 

But to get better understanding of psychic defenses and vulnerability, I suggest reading "Psychic Self-Defense" by Dione Fortune.

 

Good luck.

 

Sifu Terry

 

^{www.taichimania.com/chikung_catalog.html}

Edited September 1, 2013 by zen-bear

[CrunchyChocolate555]

PM sent

 

Hi CrunchC:

 

My first response is to advise you to practice at a duration each day that doesn't bring-on nervous system exhaustion--if that exhaustion is truly debilitating. It may be possible that what you are feeling to be nervous system "exhaustion" is actually nervous system relaxation. In which case you should try to practice through the exhaustion feeling until you "hit" rejuvenation through allostasis. But I can't say for sure without seeing you.

 

I can't really give you a confident prescription on improving your FP cultivation without seeing your practice. And also seeing your over all aura and state of health. This can be done, however, through a Skype video consultation...as I recently acquired a new webcam.

 

**So I will take the opportunity here to announce to all FP Qigong practitioners that I am now officially offering video consultations/lessons in FP Qigong via Skype. And the fee will be the same as what I charged Fu_Dog (Lloyd in Orlando,FL) in 2009: $90 per half hour, with a fifteen-minute ($45.00) consultation being the minimum service.

 

Sorry I can't be of more help. But let me know through Private Messaging if you want to set up an appointment for a Skype session. You can also contact me at [email protected]

 

Best,

 

Sifu Terry

[tao stillness]

In my work I am surrounded by schizophrenics who seem possessed by entities. I use an ancient Vedic method to protect from that, it is a CD that has ancient hymns in Sanskrit cognized ages ago by enlightened Rishis. It is called, " Mantras for Divine Protection." Kavachas in Sanskrit means armor. The lower vibrating entities cannot be around the pure frequency vibrations of these chants.

Edited September 1, 2013 by tao stillness

[pitisukha]

Hello Alexandro,

 

There are two modes of experience being experienced by your girlfriend that you both want to be careful not to confuse or cross-up:

First, you state that she has been waking up from sleep and seeing presences in your apartment and that this happens only at your apartment...and that they disappear when she becomes scared (and I assume abreacts in some way). This is evidence of a haunting by a dis-corporated entity or entities.

 

Second, you state that she often has nightmares and that she talks in her sleep.

*Does she have nightmares outside of your apartment as well?--or does she have the nightmares only at your apartment?

 

*Most important question: Are the presences in the apartment that she sees upon waking up from sleep the same entities that she experiences in her nightmares? Getting her answer to this question will help with further advice.

 

The characters in your girlfriend's dreams come from her own mind--unless she is under pressure/attack from dis-corporated entities that are in your apartment. But if she is being woken by entities in your apartment and sees them each time, then that's evidence that she is probably being haunted or being messed with by low-level spirit(s).

 

In any event, to answer your question: FP Qigong practice will sensitize one to be able to recognize and perceive spiritual entities (usually after years of practice, unless one has a gift or predilection to commune with spirits), but it will not make one more vulnerable to psychic attack or haunting by unpleasant or angry ghosts. Any vulnerability to attack is there to begin with. And the ghost or ghosts are there to begin with. It's one's own karma that "draws" or rather encounters non-physical beings--not a Qigong method. (Participating in a spiritual invocation consciously or inadvertantly, of course, will open the doors to spiritual encroachment of invasion if one is not careful and properly trained to deal with spirits.)

 

Another interesting and key question is whether you are able to see these presences when your girlfriend sees them. If you do, then that's simple confirmation. But it may be a situation where she is able to see the disturbing entity and not you.

 

At any rate, your girlfriend's nightmares-- if they occur both at and away from your apartment--can be addressed and resolved by good counseling and hypnotherapy/dream therapy. On the other hand, her being woken up in her sleep by "presences" if they are indeed supramundane entities is a situation that calls for an exorcism or some adequate countermeasure short of an exorcism. Of course, I cannot speak to such operations in this forum or on the medium of a blogsite.

 

But to get better understanding of psychic defenses and vulnerability, I suggest reading "Psychic Self-Defense" by Dione Fortune.

 

Good luck.

 

Sifu Terry

 

^{www.taichimania.com/chikung_catalog.html}

Sifu Terry

thank you for your help,

 

Yes, nightmares and sleep talking happens independently by the place where she is sleeping.

 

Usually the nightmare is about being trapped in some close place and no one knows you are trapped in, a claustrophobic nightmare

So she doesn't see the presences in the nightmares.

 

In one case I'm waked by her having a nightmare and asking for help while sleeping, one night for example she was stating something like "Hug me before they notice that they have me sucked in"

 

In the other case I'm waked by her, this time seems more conscious, scared by some seen entity.

When she become conscious about it, it suddenly disappears, so when I wake up both of us do not see anything.

 

The description that she gives of the entities are not always with human features, when she sees a "human" it has some characteristics in common (gender, hair ecc..)so she thinks it's the same person.

[Warrior Body Buddha Mind]

 

Some LHBF for you Si Hing...