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[HHC Study] Hua Hu Ching Chapter 5


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#1 Aaron

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 12:52 PM

[Note- Although posted in the Taoist Discussions section of this forum, this thread is intended to be a chapter study of Chapter five of the Hua Hu Ching. With that in mind please restrict your responses to the chapter at hand. Any discussions regarding the validity, origins, or intent of the Hua Hu Ching should be directed to another thread and not this one. I welcome everyone to participate. Questions are welcome, as well as answers. Please follow the FAQ rules located in the Tao Te Ching subforum (changing Tao Te Ching to Hua Hu Ching where needed).]

 

Hua Hu Ching 

Chapter Five

 

Do you imagine the universe is agitated? Go into the desert at night and look out at the stars. This practice should answer the question. The superior person settles her mind as the universe settles the stars in the sky. By connecting her mind with the subtle origin, she calms it. Once calmed, it naturally expands, and ultimately her mind becomes as vast and immeasurable as the night sky. 

 

Translated by Brian Browne Walker

brianbrownewalker.com/hua-hu-ching


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#2 Marblehead

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 01:41 PM

I like the metaphor and I agree that we should find our own way of calming when we are agitated.

 

However, yes, viewed from a distance it appears that there is much calm in the night sky.  But viewed up close there is great turmoil.  But we can imagine, right?


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#3 Mal

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 02:51 PM

I originally read this one as an actual practice instruction.

 

Have we looked at the night sky, was it recently? Have people ever seen the sky at night in a desert (or somewhere with clear air, low humidity and no light pollution) If not make the time to DO IT. Even though I live in “remote areas” and the night sky is quite clear (unlike some places where you don’t even see stars at night) I remember my Dad showing me this for the 1st time. We were driving between towns (5 hrs) in the desert, new moon. He stopped the car, got us all outside and turned off the lights.

 

The sky is so spectacular!

 

But even just staring up at the sky in most cities can give you something like that experience… and it truly does settle the mind.


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You are not what you think you are. But what you think... you are.
"Don't think.....feel" Bruce Lee | "Feel.....don't think" Qui-Gon Jinn

#4 Mal

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 08:11 PM

Namibian nights

Very cool but not a substitute for the "real thing"

 

edit ... Hmmm keeps trying to embed when I just type the link so

 

Top link on goggle? https://www.google.c...iw=1280&bih=885


Edited by Mal Stainkey, 04 February 2013 - 08:41 PM.

  • Aaron said thanks for this
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bye for now
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You are not what you think you are. But what you think... you are.
"Don't think.....feel" Bruce Lee | "Feel.....don't think" Qui-Gon Jinn

#5 Mal

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 03:23 PM

While I lean towards Walkers more "practice like" translation there is "more" in Ni's

The old master said, "Kind prince, what do you think? Can the great space of the East be measured by the mind?"

  The prince replied, "No, Venerable Teacher."

  "Kind prince, what do you think? Can the space of the four directions, as well as above and below, which constitute the profound vastness of the universe, be measured by the mind?"

  "No, Venerable Teacher."

  "Kind prince, the mind can be just as immeasurable as the universe itself. An integral being settles his mind just as the vast universe settles itself. He unites his mind with the unnameable Subtle Origin and it's expression as the multi-universe in which there is no past, present or future. This is how an integral being deals with his mind."

 

Ni's HHC 5


KAP

bye for now
Mal - artmgs@yahoo.com
You are not what you think you are. But what you think... you are.
"Don't think.....feel" Bruce Lee | "Feel.....don't think" Qui-Gon Jinn

#6 spiraltao

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 12:26 AM

" it's expression as the multi-universe in which there is no past, present or future. This is how an integral being deals with his mind."

 

 

so the concept of this little snippet is to understand that to be "integral" there is only now?


Absorb what is useful/Reject What is USELESS


Do good things for people and be humble.

"If you pray, do not pray for wealth, health or other bullshits, pray for luckys!"-Dr-Ng

#7 Marblehead

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 03:27 AM

" it's expression as the multi-universe in which there is no past, present or future. This is how an integral being deals with his mind."

 

 

so the concept of this little snippet is to understand that to be "integral" there is only now?

True, but don't forget the lessons of the past and don't forget to plan a little bit for the future while you are living in the "now".


  • mYTHmAKER said thanks for this

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#8 Mal

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 02:22 PM

Yes, It’s important not to starve when there is no food, or freeze when it’s cold, and using past experiences to plan for the future is certainly helpful avoiding things like that.

 

All we “actually experience” (as opposed to thinking about) is now.


  • spiraltao said thanks for this
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You are not what you think you are. But what you think... you are.
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#9 Mal

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 03:00 PM

 that to be "integral" there is only now?

 

I'm not sure if this is going off on a tangent, as the "now" stuff was only in Ni's but I have been contemplating Spiraltao's comment  and how that fits with Marbelhead's remembering the past and planing for a future (which I think is important and perhaps an area that "Taoism" doesn't overly address but perhaps "Taoism" feels there is enough focus on these things already)

 

That there really is only "now" is increasingly something that I experience and agree with, making "life" rather strange with planing holidays, doing things next Wednesday, being asked why you did this last Friday. With past and future not actually existing (except in our memories) how can we learn from the past and plan for the future.

 

Perhaps this is where the I Ching comes in. While there is only "now" there are patterns/cycles that gave rise to that"now"  and knowing where "now" is within those patterns a "future" can be "prepared for"

 

?


Edited by Mal Stainkey, 09 February 2013 - 03:01 PM.

  • spiraltao said thanks for this
KAP

bye for now
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You are not what you think you are. But what you think... you are.
"Don't think.....feel" Bruce Lee | "Feel.....don't think" Qui-Gon Jinn

#10 spiraltao

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 06:40 PM

Food for thought Mal!    Great post.   Aaron?


Absorb what is useful/Reject What is USELESS


Do good things for people and be humble.

"If you pray, do not pray for wealth, health or other bullshits, pray for luckys!"-Dr-Ng

#11 Marblehead

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 04:10 AM

Perhaps this is where the I Ching comes in. While there is only "now" there are patterns/cycles that gave rise to that"now"  and knowing where "now" is within those patterns a "future" can be "prepared for"

 

?

Hey Mal!!!  I think you've got it!

 

(I don't do the I Ching but that doesn't matter.)


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Peace & Contentment!


#12 Mal

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 04:54 PM

:-) I only got into the I Ching because of this book, and as I prefer Walkers translation in this case I'm going back to looking at the stars (very pretty with no moon currently visible)
KAP

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You are not what you think you are. But what you think... you are.
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#13 Marblehead

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 03:22 AM

I'm going back to looking at the stars (very pretty with no moon currently visible)

Yes, one can attain great inner peace doing that if one can empty their mind while doing it.


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YIN-YANG.jpg I reserve the right to change my mind. Anarchy4.jpg



Peace & Contentment!


#14 流浪者

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Posted 24 April 2014 - 06:02 PM

This one brings harmony to my soul. 


No star in the sky is misplaced. No ripple in the sea a destination. A beautiful stillness drifting towards eternity. 

 

Love is boundless and profound!






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