I started meditating to relax and I ended up sobbing with rage - am I stange?

[liminal_luke]

6 minutes ago, Apech said:

 

Yes I think I could write a 50 page essay on the idea that meditation is about quieting your mind.  

  

 

Should you undertake that noble task, you´ll have one faithful reader in me.

[BigSkyDiamond]

5 hours ago, Apech said:

I think the key to this and other subjects is intent.  Why are you doing it and what is the purpose.

 

yes, i agree.  And this varies from person to person.

  

Edited Sunday at 05:04 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[BigSkyDiamond]

5 hours ago, Apech said:

I still don't quite get your focus on 'beliefs about meditation' - for me meditation is a praxis and I don't really have beliefs about it - just experience and results.

 

because it is no different than listening to people disagree and argue about what God "really is."  Or which religion is "correct."  Along with the attendant and displayed attitudes  of superiority (for their own beliefs, their own path) and disdain (toward other beliefs, toward other paths).

 

Edited Sunday at 05:27 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[liminal_luke]

5 minutes ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

 

because it is no different than listening to people disagree and argue about what god "really is."  Along with the attendant attitudes  of superiority (for their own beliefs) and disdain (toward other beliefs).

 

 

Forum rules have recently changed to outlaw argument about "current events."  Argument about meditation is still allowed, B"H.

[BigSkyDiamond]

2 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

Forum rules have recently changed to outlaw argument about "current events."  Argument about meditation is still allowed, B"H.

Yes, absolutely.

and i 100% support that.

 

Edited Sunday at 05:29 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[BigSkyDiamond]

it is actually funny in a way.  This forum (Dao Bums) is excellent and i give it an A+ for allowing and supporting and demonstrating a respect and regard for a whole range of paths of "religion and spirituality and esoterics" across the full spectrum of beliefs and practices.

 

yet apparently when it comes to the beliefs we hold around meditation and how it is practiced, that goes out the window and the very same rabid fevered feral  fervent attitudes come out in full force as seen on say other less tolerant forums around the topics of God and religion.

 

Edited Sunday at 06:05 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[Apech]

58 minutes ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

it is actually funny in a way.  This forum (Dao Bums) is excellent and i give it an A+ for allowing and supporting and demonstrating a respect and regard for a whole range of paths of "religion and spirituality and esoterics" across the full spectrum of beliefs and practices.

 

yet apparently when it comes to the beliefs we hold around meditation and how it is practiced, that goes out the window and the very same rabid fevered feral  fervent attitudes come out in full force as seen on say other less tolerant forums around the topics of God and religion.

 

Generally speaking we allow all kinds of disagreements but prohibit ad hominem attacks on others.  Attack ideas not the person that is the main ethos.

[Apech]

1 hour ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

 

because it is no different than listening to people disagree and argue about what God "really is."  Or which religion is "correct."  Along with the attendant and displayed attitudes  of superiority (for their own beliefs, their own path) and disdain (toward other beliefs, toward other paths).

 

If you have practiced meditation with results it is not the same as belief in God etc.  So I would say it is different.  If you hold beliefs on meditation it probably means you haven’t done any. ( generally not at you personally).

[BigSkyDiamond]

1 hour ago, Apech said:

If you have practiced meditation with results it is not the same as belief in God etc.  So I would say it is different.  If you hold beliefs on meditation it probably means you haven’t done any. ( generally not at you personally).

 

bold above is an example of a belief about meditation

 

 

Edited Sunday at 08:17 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[Cobie]

 

4 minutes ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

bold above is an example of a belief about meditation

Some people meditate for decades, believing it will eventually bring ‘enlightenment’.

[Cobie]

 

 

On 09/08/2025 at 9:27 PM, Apech said:

… qi sensitivity (and accumulation) ….

 

23 hours ago, Cobie said:

imo: never ever “accumulate” qi, that’s an obstruction; no hoarding. Just a total free flowing, awareness is flow.

Why do you think it is ‘face-palmy’ for me to have this opinion?

 

Edited Sunday at 07:40 PM by Cobie

[liminal_luke]

They say not to use meditation to deal with out-of-whack emotions, but this thread is weirdly full of conflict between Bums I like -- surely a little deep breathing couldn´t hurt?

[Cobie]

I do find the face-palm emoji rather ‘passive aggressive’.

[Apech]

17 minutes ago, Cobie said:

 

 

 

Why do you think it is ‘face-palmy’ for me to have this opinion?

 

Because it’s wrong - that’s what I think - you are free to think otherwise.

[Apech]

1 minute ago, Cobie said:

I do find the face-palm emoji rather ‘passive aggressive’.

On DBs we are free to express opinions and ideas - you can’t limit that by making these kinds comments ( which are by the way passive aggressive in their own way)

[Cobie]

I don’t think a face-palm emoji is conductive to further interesting exchanges of views/information. I think it is a total bloc to communication. 
 

 

Edited Sunday at 08:00 PM by Cobie

[BigSkyDiamond]

17 minutes ago, Apech said:

Because it’s wrong - that’s what I think - you are free to think otherwise.

 

no, not wrong.

different belief, different view, different opinion

 

 

Edited Sunday at 08:11 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[liminal_luke]

My take?  The face palm is an expression of exasperation.  We´ve all had the experience of being misunderstood, of having our words taken out of context or twisted, of being verbally hurt.  Sometimes when this happens the best way to come back to center is to express exasperation, and the face-palm emoji is a way of doing that online.  

[BigSkyDiamond]

 

1 hour ago, Apech said:

If you have practiced meditation with results it is not the same as belief in God etc.  So I would say it is different.  If you hold beliefs on meditation it probably means you haven’t done any. ( generally not at you personally).

 

1 hour ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

bold above is an example of a belief about meditation

 

Here is a list with more examples of beliefs about meditation,

all of which are taken directly from this thread alone.

and yes as stated above, this is discussing the beliefs, ideas, views, opinions, not the people posting them

 

more beliefs about meditation / all are from this thread

meditation is  about seeing things as they really are
The meditator is doing things inside the body -- moving energy, gathering elemental forces, setting up a cauldron, etc
silent sitting, uniting with the Dao
from the heart  for religious reasons to clear the mind
a process leading to realization
it is an advanced stage for a student, usually requiring a bunch of prerequisites, physical and mental priming
it's not something as simple and straightforward as some believe
meditation can be simple and straightforward
Most (prob 90%) of meditation taught in the West is just beginner stuff, light and without much depth
meditation should never be taught as therapy it is too dangerous
there are safe and gentle forms of meditation
sit and empty the mind
quieting the mind is not the point of meditation
the dreaded mindfulness
meditation has therapeutic benefits
awareness is flow, not forcing or hoarding
should not sit down to meditate with goal of calming down when upset, or settling feelings thoughts in disarray
should not sit down to meditate when physically unwell
meditation is beneficial for calming down when upset
meditation can help when physically unwell
meditation can bring clarity, balance, order, and harmony
it is a healthy, nurturing, nourishing, loving self-care practice
it is a way to see reality
meditation is being
some forms of meditation are more useful for shifting emotional states, than other forms
neigong and inner alchemy
don't want to pilot a space ship in an out-of-balance emotional state

 

Edited Sunday at 08:29 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[Taomeow]

 

And for some of us, especially those of the feline persuasion, I propose adding an enhanced version:

 

 

 

[Cobie]

 

15 minutes ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

… more beliefs about meditation / all are from this thread …

Thanks for putting in the time to collect the info.  That’s the sort of communication I like, informative, constructive and from the heart. 

 

Edited Sunday at 08:43 PM by Cobie

[Cobie]

I think in life in general, as well as on a forum, there is no point really in conversing with people that are not talking from the heart. 
 

 

[BigSkyDiamond]

I have found in the qi gong world there are some practices which intentionally direct and move and push qi around to specific parts of the body through specific routes;  compared to other qigong practices which specifically AVOID and actively WARN AGAINST doing that very same thing.   They still cultivate qi but the qi is not forced to certain areas, instead it is allowed to flow to wherever it goes in the body.

 

My preference and affinity is for allowing flow of the qi and not using force on the qi.  I trust the wisdom of the body and the wisdom of the qi, to flow where it is needed, and taking the route that is optimal.  I do not impose it.  For this reason i actively avoid practices which move qi around through a specific route to a specific destination.  There are many associated risks and dangers to forcing and directing qi.  Some of these have been mentioned in this thread.

 

I absolutely agree (and medical documentation and  literature supports this) that there are medical and personal history contra-indications for qi gong and meditation. And that some forms are inherently riskier than other forms, even for someone without medical contraindications.  I opt always for gentle and safe, that's just me.  There is always a safe and gentle method (That is my belief) for me to approach whatever it is, whether that is qigong or meditation.  

 

 

Edited Sunday at 09:24 PM by BigSkyDiamond

[liminal_luke]

2 hours ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

 

Here is a list with more examples of beliefs about meditation,

 

 

That´s quite the list.  I don´t want to argue about the accuracy of any of your assertions, but would like to point out the "gotcha" flavor of your post. It´s as if you´re saying "you say you shouldn´t hold beliefs about meditations but I found all of these beliefs so you must be a hypocrite."  Is that the message you meant to convey?  

 

Few people respond well when backed into a rhetorical corner.  Instead they throw up our hands, roll their eyes, send face palm emojis.  Marriage counselers sometimes ask their clients a pointed question: do you want to be right or do you want to get along? You likely aren´t interested in marriage with Apech or Taomeow (a mutual feeling, I´m sure) but you might want to cultivate good relationships.  Speaking for myself, I know that each of them has worlds of experience in meditation and spiritual practice.  They have much to teach me.

Edited Sunday at 11:04 PM by liminal_luke

[Cobie]

 

49 minutes ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

… My preference and affinity is for allowing flow of the qi and not using force on the qi.  I trust the wisdom of the body and the wisdom of the qi, to flow where it is needed, and taking the route that is optimal.  I do not impose it. …

 

Yes, that’s me too.   
 

 

Edited Sunday at 10:10 PM by Cobie