rideforever

Yes, it suffices. But still how do you know yourself with out the observer ? What is the means or mechanism ? For instance you observe a cat. Is this how you know you are ?

This is an honest answer and clever one. And it is in that spirit that an intelligent spirituality can occur. How many people are simple enough to simply answer a question. In fact I was not looking at the screen, because I ensured I looked at another object whilst my hands were typing the question. And the reason I did that is that I am asking a real question, perhaps neti neti knew better than me and could see through my eyes after all ... but it seems not. And so it seems that my idea is more likely to be correct. An awakened person is not the One, and this can be demonstrated because such a person does not see through everyone's eyes. An awakened person reaches a kind of merging or bonding with the One, only.

Mindfulness ... is vastly degraded as are many popular traditions. For instance going to a Yoga class is actually "Asana" and most Yogis never did any, and it has limited value in self-realisation. Human society is unconscious ... when it is seen that something is fashionable then the charlatans will join in promoting it ... but because they have no real interest in self-realisation they will naturally not be able to teach the real thing. They are unable to comprehend the real thing, so they teach a degraded version with all important bits removed. Mindfulness of the outside environment is useless. One needs to be "mindful" of your real self inside, in other words become absorbed in the inner feeling of on'es reality. What good is it to be mindful of clouds and walls and candles ? Not only will corporations promote this, but people will promote this to themselves, because few people seem at all interested in their real nature ... it is just too far from them.

When I was 20 I discovered Chomsky and photocopied a simple guide to his views of the world 100 times bound it and stood on the concourse of the university trying to warn everyone. And I still adhere to his anarcho-syndicalist views, which are like a modern guild system. And I have been to a communist meeting in London but found it poorly attended. Having said that I think the right wing is the closest to this today, as it believes in the freedom of individuals ... although in a brutal way. The left has long ago lost all its real roots and become an empty vessel. The Left does not seem to believe that an individual is personally responsible and that giving people money will solve something ... well not much. Your comments at the beginning are not good, what else to say ... beginning a conversation with slamming the door in people's faces, friend or foe. But the really story in my opinion is the Corpocracy that is pushing the society degeneration, and behind them the billionaires. Who is more likely to stand up to the Corpocracy ? Well probably neither side, but the Left is worse.

How can you know yourself without observing ?

That's very true. Who knows what is true ? The compilation of knowledge mankind has is very unreliable and unreality. So ... that's not so comfortable to live in such a society. It's a strange thing. But also it is true that people "know" things more reliably when their mouth is shut !!! Could it be possible that 'god' leaves us here in a madhouse with no way to live nicely ? Well, perhaps it is not so likely. Does the Way of Law of Attraction, or A Course in Miracles, or Surrender to God ... does this lead to a miraculous life ? I don't know, but I know it might because I know mankind's knowledge is not right.

That's great, I am very happy to hear it. So then, what am I looking at now ?

Well are you ? Can you look through other people's eyes ? Just be honest. Can you look through other people's eyes ? No ... Well then you are not the eye of all eyes, you might be in deep harmony with the centre, but you are not the centre. The centres looks through all eyes, but that is something you can't do. This is true, but as you see it is only a temporary solution ... you say this because you still have thoughts. There is a permanent solution to the problem which is that instead of letting go of what is false (your unconscious thought stream) you embody your true centre. Only then will the thoughts actually stop. Embody means you feel inside the true centre and you merge into it. Yes you begin to feel inside the subtle inner structure. However you then refer it to some alchemical concepts about triads but those concepts are not necessary. Sensing the subtle inner structure of your identity is what you want. With small experiments. Well, perhaps it is true that few have need of such knowledge. What is needed is to die into the self-light. What more is needed, to do such a thing on this planet is a mercy beyond mercy. What is loved ? Is it not the self-light ? What is the I, is it not the self-light ? What is of value except the self-light ? Let it take you, and let go.

In the same way do people read the 'science' in the newspaper, it's all so amazing, and then they think they are amazing, as if they own this 'science'. If you read about Elon Musk or travelling to Mars .... it "lifts you up" because you imagine you are something to do with it. But maybe it has nothing to do with you, and you will waste the 24hrs of today dreaming. It would be nice to say that Atlantis is the place were people don't dream and work practically in useful endeavours so that they themselves become capable people, able to do things themselves; and that any good society is only based on one thing, the health wisdom and capability of the people inside that society which they themselves possess. And so having "western medicine" or scientific theories or whatever is actually not important, unless the individuals themselves have it inside themselves. And the way things are, as services are offered to you, you become lazy, you lose competence. A society full of services, be they high tech or high medicine, is a society of people getting weaker. At least that is the natural outcome. Animals that live in people's homes lose their brain size, and their competences. But it has also been said that the nature of the earth is such that changes in the celestial objects have a tremendous effect down here, and that we are at the mercy of them. Anyway, the truth is available to all who wish it.

Also these 3 things are not the same : 1. What is messed up in the world, problems we can see 2. Why it is like this 3. How to stop it being messed up, at least for oneself Knowing one might or might not lead to knowledge of the others. Anyway just watched a trailer for the upcoming Watchmen series, well it's just everyone killing everyone else ... seems to be the official entertainment these days. I don't think that's good.

Siddhameshwar Maharaj : The world is hankering for happiness. Everyone is striving hard only for happiness, if this is so, then how is it that instead of happiness, unhappiness and misery result. In these days from peasant to the prince everyone is found to be unhappy. On careful consideration on the point one must come to the conclusion that the methods adopted to gain happiness are wrong and defective and there is some serious blunder at the bottom of the said methods. In all civilized countries nothing but misery is found. As new discoveries are being made by the modern civilisation, miseries and terror also keep pace with them. By such discoveries there is a growing increase in the needs of people and to meet the same people must toil and labour more and more. The demand upon the resources of people for satisfying their fresh and new wants is growing everyday with the new invention. Every new invention would make only the inventor rich but the pockets of millions of other people are emptied because of the new and fresh wants created by his invention. It is better to suffer from a serpent bite than to increase a single want. A serpent’s poison can be cured by its remedy once only but the want is required to be satisfi ed for the whole life. Once a new invention is out then the same is widely advertised and all sorts of tactics are used to create a demand for the same only to make moneys thereout by exploiting the ignorance. Very often Governments also have to make use of their powers and resort to oppression, intrigues or politics. Sometimes Governments go to the length of waging wars with other countries to force such inventions upon other countries. Thus with the progress in invention, peoples’ wants are increased and various tactics are in progress to extort moneys. In such circumstances how can you expect real fraternity or unity? This is nothing but open enmity. Such robbery and extortion are however described as the great progress in civilization and as increasing universal brotherhood and fraternity in the world. Let those who say so rejoice in such fraternity but it is certain that the world will not be happy by such discoveries. These discoveries are dragging the people to hell. The world is galloping towards hell. If the world will continue to proceed in the same manner and in the same direction, the result would be cruelty, bloodshed, and horrible warfare. Nobody can deny that these new manufacturers of the modern science have only increased risks and dangers to life Why in ancient times people could maintain strict morality and the virtues of truth, honesty and compassion? The reason is obvious. Peoples’ wants were few and they could secure their necessities with a slight labour. There was therefore no reason for people to addict to immorality. Now the wants are so immensely increased that they cannot be satisfied even by hard work, hence rogueries, intrigues, immorality are rampant and people have gone to the length of committing thefts. Providence has arranged that what is required for real happiness can be had everywhere without any cost or effort. He has also arranged for the automatic and natural production from the earth of the articles required for food and drink. These natural products were enjoyed with great delight by the ancient sages and they are still being enjoyed with the greatest delight by birds, beasts and such other creatures who have no sense of discrimination. Only the mankind who are endowed with all senses and faculties and who believe themselves to be wise and superior to all others do not enjoy the same with delight and pleasure and by reason of their foolishness not only themselves suffer great hardships but along with them also cause most unbearable hardships to the dumb animals like horses, oxen, elephants, camels and others who would have otherwise enjoyed independently this natural bliss with pleasure and delight. pdf here : http://www.siddharameshwar.org/resources/Golden Day for upload Final (1).pdf

We are very concerned with other people. We want to be like by them, we are offended by them, judge them, we want to save them, or forgive them. Really what the hell for, what is all this ? What a total waste of time. I can't imagine how much of life is flushed into the toilet on such stupidity. What the hell for ? Boredom ? Is it simply boredom ? Have we nothing else to do ? Do we live and do nothing because we are bums ? Waiting for death with a little entertainment ? Who really cares about "other people". Who knows who they are, what they do, why they do. I have no idea who they are. Is it all totally stupid and destructive - sure it is. Sure, it's a disaster. Now the inner work is ever ready and ever ripe - we gonna do it or not ?

Why bother. Watching people hurt each other whilst sitting on a bench mulling over how self-righteous you will be today and forgive them from your seat ? Is it of value ? Maybe not. Better than printing tickets with a score from 0 to 10, and giving them to people you meet and to yourself ... why not just surrender to God quietly ?

White people ... what ever happened to them ?

You said many things, but I don't know why as you don't have any contact with Julius Caesar.

For it to develop health then you would have to do it regularly, and so you should find something you would actually do and would like to do. And there are many things called qigong or taichi out there. Some just lead to health, others leads to the Tao/spirituality.

Really, then where are they ? Where is Julius Caesar ? Seen him around ? No. Think about this; at night when you sleep, somebody else in Japan wakes up and starts the day. Is it you ? No, it isn't.

Well in the absence of anybody else's comments, I would just say that there are many things that people are doing, and you can read on the forum or investigate on youtube and so on, with regards to subtle energies qigong and magnetism and so on ... and perhaps you can look around and think about what you would like to try and narrow it down a bit, and then perhaps some members here might have some experience in that area.

On the basis of what ? Many things die around you ... they seem to simply die finally don't they ? Better to check first thoroughly who you are and so on.

We are not free to leave, we are free to die. To leave some magic must happen. A large part of that happens in our understanding. We are born into slavery, but perhaps our belief in that slavery is the real slavery. I do not know our true situation or possibilities. As with all such grand concepts, only thorough experiential investigation will provide a satisfactory answer. Few ever try. Only the unknown is safe.

This is a great video (sound quite low unfortunately) about the fakeness of never getting angry and always being nicey nicey, why it happens and so on. You can download it on y2mate if you want to boost the volume btw. Here's another thought, if God doens't care that everyone gets murdered down here, should we ? I believe I have arrived at the satan worshipping juncture of the spiritual path.

It is as easy as watching television, another great hobby of human beings. You are given a body arms and legs and the ability to think. But you have convinced yourself you do not exist ... this is arrogance, lack of responsibility, and not being thankful for your gifts. The truth is, the world is difficult and telling yourself you don't exist is a wonderful escape. And it is an escape that is very much valued by the fools running the planet who love it when you decide that you too will destroy all the gifts given to you, and sit like a melon. That makes the other people very happy when you do that. But, having said that, given the fact that the other monkeys here will literally nail you to a piece of wood until you bleed to death ... if you dare be different to them ... Then it might be a very good idea to adopt the type of spirituality you speak of. On this planet, such arithmetic might make sense. That is why in China it is said, "conceal your strength".

Everything, I truly do hope after you numerous extremely long posts about flowing and freeing and being ... that it doesn't add up to following some hackneyed old repressed commandments and becoming a nun; and using society's judgements of what is wrong and right and trying to jump up to follow them. That would be ridiculous. You can't "truly be what you are" ... if you are following the images given to you by the fools destroying the planet. If you wish to trust, you must trust. Not trust so it fits the agenda and images given to you. Mankind has turned itself into such a fraud, that suggesting that when it rains, it simply rains ... has become alien to people. ( Accepting of course all the caveats and levels of understanding, previously discussed. )

A deep idea today; that knowledge itself is mater, and obeys the laws of mater. Meaning there is only so much knowledge and it is shared or not shared amongst those who want it. It is a subtle energy. It is not words. It is not free. It is not everywhere. It is a resource. In the same way as there is only so many oranges on this planet, there is only so much knowledge, and then there is no more. And ... "equality" cannot work, because if you shared all the knowledge in the word amongst so many hands, they will get only crumbs and it will amount to nothing, in fact it will just piss people off. The only way to run society, is for the knowledge to be passed through a hierarchy, then the knowledge is preserved and spread as much as possible, and the most good can be done with it. Mankind is general appears not to want knowledge, even that which is available to him. He rejects it, and goes back surfing the internet and letting 500 articles pass meaninglessly through his brain as if something happened, maybe he will remember a few words to regurgitate at the cafe before they too are forgotten. Meaning, is wanted by few. Today all sorts of traditions, arts and spiritualities are sprayed everywhere, ancient texts, ancient practices, a bonfire of sacred material .... there is a desperation for students, will anyone hold this subtle mater inside them, or will it crumble into dust and be lost. It is a bad sign that so much is in the open. After World War One a great many great people died, and their subtle mater that was inside them was released into the atmosphere. There is plenty around, much more than normal I suppose. Everything is available ... but does anyone want it ? To develop knowledge inside oneself, is to serve the knowledge with your life energy, to do something worthwhile. By becoming a disciple, of any tradition, of any art, of any lineage .... you become a precious holder of a treasure, without you, it will be lost.

And there's more ! In order to teach people with little self knowledge about wisdom, such examples are used ... anger is wrong, pacifism is right. These contrasts between what is good and what is bad. It is a coarse way of teaching, but it is okay for beginners, but eventually you should migrate to more intelligent approaches to life. However it can become a "dead form", where only the coarse ideas remain and the path does not remain. The coarse polarities of good and bad, of self-repression, are an attempt to isolate an understanding, or to restrict your energies, in such a way that you can awaken. But after awakening, meaning embodying your emotions and identity, then you can finally release all your temporary scaffoldings, your spiritual judgements, and then allow it all just to be as it is. Life flows but you are awake. Nevertheless on this planet any approach that works is acceptable even self-torture, but it is far from a natural understanding of things. That story about Buddha laughing ... in fact he "smiled". The story is : Mahādhana. The son of the Treasurer of Benares. His parents possessed eighty crores, and, for all education, he learnt music and singing. He married the daughter of an equally rich family and of similar education. After the death of their parents, they were very rich. One night, as the husband was on his way from the palace, some knaves tempted him to drink. He soon fell a victim to the habit and all his wealth was squandered. Then he spent his wife's money, and finally sold all his belongings, and used to go about begging, a potsherd in his hand. One day the Buddha, seeing him waiting outside the refectory for leavings of food, smiled. In answer to Ananda, who asked him the reason for his smile, the Buddha said that there was a man who had had the power of becoming chief Treasurer or attaining arahantship, if he did but use his opportunities, but he was now reduced to beggary, like a heron in a dried up pond. DhA.iii.129ff.