Annnon Posted Tuesday at 09:34 PM (edited) What really happens on an energetic level when a man and a woman have sex: I've read that the woman only absorbs the man's chi and that's why a man feel tired after sex. Is that true? What I knew is that what actually happens is an exchange of energy(yin and yang) between both partners, no one would "lose". Unless the man masturbates, which is 100% loss of energy. But talking about sex, what is correct to say, both exchange energy? I've also read other opinions like: If you have sex with a woman only for lust, then you will only lose jing, but if you have sex with someone you love, you will exchange that energy with your partner. Edited Tuesday at 09:39 PM by Lukks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ascetic Posted Tuesday at 11:12 PM (edited) I always figured the collection of Yin from woman was a very deliberate action, and not something that happens on its own. There's a cultivation manual called "Yin Plucking Technique" that deals with this exactly. Ehhh, I wouldn't say masturbation is a loss of energy. If someone considers that a loss of energy, then they should really try to stop SLEEPING. Sleep takes more energy from a human than loss of sexual fluids ever will. I do find that preserving Jing, through certain ideas and disciplines works, but honestly preserving Jing should be one of the final steps someone does but I'm sure people will disagree with me. My opinion, my opinion. Most people who I see undergo discipline to accumulate Jing, don't do much better than burning out their meridians. It probably feels like progress, but you're really dooming yourself to a mortal existence if you think the preservation of Jing is important then you're setting yourself up for mundane failure. Sorry that was off topic. Sex is not an exchange of Energy, it is a pure gain. Men gain a large amount of Yang from the Women they sleep with. Women benefit immensely from losing their Yang while Men always benefit from more Yang. Overall, trying to gain Yin from sleeping with someone requires a specific technique, and is somewhat evil. Because Yin is like the bucket, Yang is the water in the bucket. If a Woman loses their Yin during lost, then that basically means that the amount of Yang they can provide is less forever (unless they somehow recover Yin). Yang recovers over time, just like how rain will fill the water in a bucket. But as far as I understand, no matter how much it rains, the bucket holding the water will never change. Hence it is fair to say that Yin does not recover on its own. Only Yang does. The loss of Yin is equivalent to your bucket getting smaller. Loss of Yang is water in the bucket being exhausted. I would argue that even same sex provides the same benefit, like straight sex would. A man can even pluck another mans yin through sex. I must reiterate though: there is serious loss when someone loses their Yin to another person, because it makes their bucket smaller forever. Of course one can collect Yin to make their bucket larger again. But imagine your bucket is full and it suddenly grows smaller. A lot of the water (Yang) is gonna pour out. This is why plucking Yin gives a man so much, as sex gives Yang, which often means someone needs more Yin (make the bucket larger) if they want to hold that Yang (water in the bucket) permanently. Most people who have sex don't do this, so the benefits are temporary. Meanwhile taking Yin from a Woman means they won't be able to provide as much Yang during sex, it's a seriously heavy and often permanent blow for a Woman to lose Yin. Because as far as I understand, its a lot easier for a Man to pluck Yin then it is for a Woman. Edited 18 hours ago by Ascetic 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Annnon Posted Wednesday at 03:00 AM 3 hours ago, Ascetic said: Ehhh, I wouldn't say masturbation is a loss of energy. If someone considers that a loss of energy, then they should really try to stop SLEEPING. Sleep takes more energy from a human than loss of sexual fluids ever will. By loss of energy I mean loss of Jing, I used the wrong term there. But don't you agree that masturbation is a total loss? If not, do you think sleeping makes us lose more Jing than masturbation? 3 hours ago, Ascetic said: I do find that preserving Jing, through certain ideas and disciplines works, but honestly preserving Jing should be one of the final steps someone does but I'm sure people will disagree with me. My opinion, my opinion. Why preserving jing should be one of the final steps? I always see it as one of the first steps people talk about. Even when people don't practice qigong there's this general rule in TCM to not waste Jing - "overindulge in sexual activity", because excessive sexual activity drains our jing and in turn affets our health. 3 hours ago, Ascetic said: Sex is not an exchange of Energy, it is a pure gain. Men gain a large amount of Yang from the Women they sleep with. Women benefit immensely from losing their Yang while Men always benefit from more Yang. What I learned was: You can still drain yourself if you engage in TOO MUCH sexual activity. But I always knew that the woman gave her yin to the man and the man gives his yang to the woman, why do you say the opposite? 3 hours ago, Ascetic said: Yang recovers over time, just like how rain will fill the water in a bucket. But as far as I understand, no matter how much it rains, the bucket holding the water will never change. Hence it is fair to say that Yin does not recover on its own. Only Yang does. This is a very interesting information, I will look into it. 3 hours ago, Ascetic said: The loss of Yin is equivalent to your bucket getting smaller. Loss of Yang is water in the bucket being exhausted. I would argue that even same sex provides the same benefit, like straight sex would. Yes I also heard that it's the same. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sanity Check Posted Wednesday at 05:55 AM Oddball theory about this. Its possible human sex works similar to cordless chargers for phones. . Note the coil in the abdominal area ^. Surely many have noticed this before I did? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ascetic Posted Wednesday at 09:46 AM 6 hours ago, Annnon said: By loss of energy I mean loss of Jing, I used the wrong term there. But don't you agree that masturbation is a total loss? If not, do you think sleeping makes us lose more Jing than masturbation? Why preserving jing should be one of the final steps? I always see it as one of the first steps people talk about. Even when people don't practice qigong there's this general rule in TCM to not waste Jing - "overindulge in sexual activity", because excessive sexual activity drains our jing and in turn affets our health. What I learned was: You can still drain yourself if you engage in TOO MUCH sexual activity. But I always knew that the woman gave her yin to the man and the man gives his yang to the woman, why do you say the opposite? This is a very interesting information, I will look into it. Yes I also heard that it's the same. You're right actually, Preserving Jing is one of the first steps to daoism. I am of a slightly different culture, where refining Qi is the first step. I should have mentioned this instead of adopting the tone of being correct. As for why I believe Sleep is more damaging than masturbation, at some point a person notices how Sleep is what rots the soul towards its chemical container. It's a terrible experience and also yogic at its core. The soul truly turns bright in someone who does not desire sleep, meanwhile a man who no longer relies on sleep to be alive truly starts to live in a way that is immortal. I say the opposite because I know what Yang looks like, it looks like passion and pure spirit. In Vasistha's Yoga, it is mentioned that Women suffer 9 times as much passion as man. What else is this Passion but Yang? That natural accumulation of Yang is so much faster in women, they need to lose it desperately. It's part of what is considered the drive for sex. Now, during sensual pleasure: the feeling of connection that is rhythmic and not sharp (I consider that if Yin is being gained from sex, it would be a sharp feeling or the sensation of hot wax dripping onto skin); it's why I believe that only Yang is being moved. So TLDR during sex, Man keeps their Yang and also gains all the Yang that a Woman loses. Sexual over exhaustion, or at least part of it is due to the unpleasant sensation of a man losing too much Yang. Just like a bucket being filled with too much water again and again, it's quite painful and scarring to experience. We have a limit of how much we can experience this, but I at least believe that if I experienced this again and again (the loss of yang) I would crack. Similarly, we consider that Yang represents man and Yin represents Women. What is it that is the basis of the Female Body? A Female Body is really just a body that keeps loses more "manliness" than a man, you can imagine how losing Yang then could make a Woman more attractive. We are what we lose the most of. I'm sure if a man practiced losing Yang, they too would become more feminine. Just as a flowery man who sleeps with many women, seems subtle and thin in their femininity. Yin on the other hand seems too important and sacred to be lost in any kind of lust. I believe that the collection of Yin during sex would require either pure love or a hostile cultivation technique like Yin Plucking Technique. There is a story about a Merchant in Antiquity who practiced Yin Plucking Technique, they would buy Women and rob their virginity through sex. Plucking their Yin and then throwing them away. The story ends with the Merchant dying after vomiting a silver liquid which is said to either be Yin or Lifeforce. They collected too much Yin it seems was the moral of the story. So I guess your ideas of sexual over exhaustion are true, but I personally believe that if Yin is harvested correctly without hate or greed: then it provides enormous benefit. In any case, when we think about it; women will always keep something in their heart sacred for lust: this is the pattern of Yin. The Importance of a bucket that collects water when it rains. Sorry I couldn't be so clear, I probably come off as mildly insane. But I really appreciate your sincere attitude. I get that not all of it is conformed to normality but its what I sincerely believe and have observed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted yesterday at 03:52 AM (edited) 21 hours ago, Sanity Check said: Oddball theory about this. Its possible human sex works similar to cordless chargers for phones. . Note the coil in the abdominal area ^. Surely many have noticed this before I did? This is amazing and groundbreaking ! Now I no longer have to waste my time ; searching for the right woman , paying money on dates , having a swish car , ( or even a shower ) , foreplay , condoms .... even 'being nice ' ..... all solved .... just wait until phone is at low power and place it on my LDT .... . Edited yesterday at 03:55 AM by Nungali 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted yesterday at 04:35 AM 18 hours ago, Ascetic said: You're right actually, Preserving Jing is one of the first steps to daoism. I am of a slightly different culture, where refining Qi is the first step. I should have mentioned this instead of adopting the tone of being correct. As for why I believe Sleep is more damaging than masturbation, at some point a person notices how Sleep is what rots the soul towards its chemical container. I notice you saying it .... ( and I notice your attempts at giving it validity ; 'at some point ' ... more 'tone of being correct ' ) but I notice no one else ever saying it . I call bizzaro on that one . It seems like one of those overly head trip construct one can get from too much armchair and not enough field work ( theory / practice ) . .. and I mean worthwhile practice that gives everyday material benefit Sleep deprivation will not do that . 18 hours ago, Ascetic said: It's a terrible experience and also yogic at its core. The soul truly turns bright in someone who does not desire sleep, meanwhile a man who no longer relies on sleep to be alive truly starts to live in a way that is immortal. No ... its a stage of 'energized enthusiasm ', is usually transitory ( except in the case of advanced 'genius ' ) and requires 'payback ' ( 'crashing' ) 18 hours ago, Ascetic said: I say the opposite because I know what Yang looks like, it looks like passion and pure spirit. In Vasistha's Yoga, it is mentioned that Women suffer 9 times as much passion as man. What else is this Passion but Yang? One the six spoked wheel it lies in the segment ruled by 'Bhakti Yoga' and 'Invocative Magick ' aka 'love ' ... heading towards the dark outer realm ( towards ignorance ) of obsession , but not in it , and heading out of the light inner realm ( towards enlightenment ) of the ' love section ' . Some of our greatest ( male ) heroes have been driven by their passion ..... it is a distinctive energy between Mars and Venus and without the driving Mars force , well, there is no 'passion' its more passive . Originally passion ( its roots ) meant to suffer or endure ... under that understanding , some women might agree with the above 18 hours ago, Ascetic said: That natural accumulation of Yang is so much faster in women, they need to lose it desperately. It's part of what is considered the drive for sex. Now, during sensual pleasure: the feeling of connection that is rhythmic and not sharp (I consider that if Yin is being gained from sex, it would be a sharp feeling or the sensation of hot wax dripping onto skin); it's why I believe that only Yang is being moved. So TLDR during sex, Man keeps their Yang and also gains all the Yang that a Woman loses This is why I have never been a fan or practiced eastern 'tantra ' (of this type ) , its either totally mistaken and an old outworn sexist influenced load of rubbish ... or a different cultural mindset - either way , not for me . The western tantric view is not fraught with such inconsistencies . In short I would ask , if the container becomes full or is filling , what was the source ? Why not connect to the source and 'flow ' . To flow in and not out or to flow out and not in is not flow , and no flow means stagnation ..... 'pooling ' . If I draw in ki to my hara and extend out my hands ( let's say 'to heal ) , why would I stop ( ever ) drawing in ? No energy like this comes from another but it can be received direct and given to another or received from another .... but it all comes from a source .... why rely on a full bucket and worry and fuss and blame over it being depleted ... when you can just turn on the tap whenever you want water ? Unless you believe chi, ki or 'spiritual energy ' is generated by the person themselves ? The practices that seem like that are about making sure the 'hose' is allowing flow properly and the 'tap' is on .... and of course there is an outlet somewhere . 18 hours ago, Ascetic said: Sexual over exhaustion, or at least part of it is due to the unpleasant sensation of a man losing too much Yang. Just like a bucket being filled with too much water again and again, it's quite painful and scarring to experience. We have a limit of how much we can experience this, but I at least believe that if I experienced this again and again (the loss of yang) I would crack. The 'issue' that you are feeling a loss or drain should indicate lack of flow , or output beyond input . It isn't that the bucket is being filled and emptied that causes the problem ... you should not even need a bucket . But this eastern view is probably all mixed up with the physical process of ejaculation . . . a problem in the west as well . 18 hours ago, Ascetic said: Similarly, we consider that Yang represents man and Yin represents Women. 'We ' consider that men and women contain both yin and yang . 18 hours ago, Ascetic said: What is it that is the basis of the Female Body? A Female Body is really just a body that keeps loses more "manliness" than a man Do I need to go back to my point about old school sexism here ? I think I am glad the meaning is masked (although suggestive ) by the poor syntax ! Now I'm going to go 'Biblical on you ' " Actually Man lost part of his manliness so God could make the female body . A little diversion ; my brother informs me his grand daughter 'has my genes ' ... and here they where thinking I was the lone black sheep of the family ! She is attending Sunday school he informs me and ... Little Millie : " Why did God need to take Adam's rib to make a woman ?" Teacher : " Well, that's ... just what he did ... they way he did it . Why do you ask ? " " Well, he just said 'let there be Light' and there was light . He made this and that and everything just by saying so . But to make Eve he needed an Adam rib first ... and some dust and spit .... why didn't he just say " And let there be woman ? " Why is it different for making the woman ." Teacher : " Ummmm ..... look that's just what he did and it said so in the BIble . " - 'God' bless her ! 18 hours ago, Ascetic said: , you can imagine how losing Yang then could make a Woman more attractive. We are what we lose the most of. I'm sure if a man practiced losing Yang, they too would become more feminine. Just as a flowery man who sleeps with many women, seems subtle and thin in their femininity. Yin on the other hand seems too important and sacred to be lost in any kind of lust. I believe that the collection of Yin during sex would require either pure love or a hostile cultivation technique like Yin Plucking Technique. ... and down the rabbit hole we go ... 18 hours ago, Ascetic said: There is a story about a Merchant in Antiquity who practiced Yin Plucking Technique, they would buy Women and rob their virginity through sex. Plucking their Yin and then throwing them away. The story ends with the Merchant dying after vomiting a silver liquid which is said to either be Yin or Lifeforce. They collected too much Yin it seems was the moral of the story. So I guess your ideas of sexual over exhaustion are true, but I personally believe that if Yin is harvested correctly without hate or greed: then it provides enormous benefit. Silver vomit eh ? I seen that before ! 18 hours ago, Ascetic said: In any case, when we think about it; women will always keep something in their heart sacred for lust: this is the pattern of Yin. The Importance of a bucket that collects water when it rains. Sorry I couldn't be so clear, I probably come off as mildly insane. don't leave out sexist , rude, comparing women to buckets , adopting a tone of being correct .... 18 hours ago, Ascetic said: But I really appreciate your sincere attitude. I get that not all of it is conformed to normality but its what I sincerely believe and have observed. Yoiks ! . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sanity Check Posted yesterday at 07:16 AM 2 hours ago, Nungali said: This is amazing and groundbreaking ! Now I no longer have to waste my time ; searching for the right woman , paying money on dates , having a swish car , ( or even a shower ) , foreplay , condoms .... even 'being nice ' ..... all solved .... just wait until phone is at low power and place it on my LDT .... . I approach this from the perspective of someone searching for fundamental principles to explain x, y, z. Or someone searching for parallels in science which might apply to esotericism. The way boomers construct puzzles or do their newspaper crossword. (Youth today prefer sudoku or wordle.) You might want to try it, sometime. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted 23 hours ago 15 hours ago, Sanity Check said: I approach this from the perspective of someone searching for fundamental principles to explain x, y, z. Or someone searching for parallels in science which might apply to esotericism. The way boomers construct puzzles or do their newspaper crossword. (Youth today prefer sudoku or wordle.) You might want to try it, sometime. That's a classic 'sanity check ' comment ! if you had not noticed , I don't just try ... I do it , all the time . That's what Neo-hermetics is ! Well not exactly , I do it a bit different ; NOT " searching for parallels in science which might apply to esotericism " but understanding the essential principles in hermetics (esotericism is too broad a term for this ) and discovering how they apply to the essential principles within physics . Here you go ... just one example of a post here on record " I might want to try it sometime " Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
