wandelaar

Benjamin Hoff's "Tao Te Ching"

Recommended Posts

If the brush was used alongside the Guodian method, then likely the meanings stayed the same, not?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hoff talks about pre ‚Äėwriting-brush‚Äô¬†characters. E.g. the characters the Guodian was written in. They were not written with a brush. In the preview Hoff mentions they were written with some¬†other implement that could easily make circles.


 

 

Edited by Cobie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, SirPalomides said:

… the way the text has been carried on and read throughout the ages is more important than … the author's true intent 


What‚Äôs ‚Äúimportant‚ÄĚ can be¬†rather personal. My¬†only interest is the oldest available transcripts. ¬†:)
 

 

Edited by Cobie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

(From the preview) chapters deleted by Hoff:

5

36

45

58

80

 

 

 

Edited by Cobie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Did not Wang B write with a brush?

 

In the preview Hoff says: 

- he translated from the pre-brush characters

- he uses the Wang B text

 

Legend has it that the brush was invented by Meng Tian (? - 210 BC)

Wang B (226-249 AD)

 

 

Edited by Cobie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
59 minutes ago, Cobie said:

Legend has it that the brush was invented by Meng Tian (? - 210 BC)

 

Yes - legends... Why not go by the facts?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, wandelaar said:

Yes - legends... Why not go by the facts?


I couldn’t find any.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The facts were mentioned immediately after your quoted legend. I posted the complete passage earlier in this topic where it says after mentioning the legend:

 

Quote

However, primitive painted pottery contains decorative designs painted by tools resembling a brush. Visible stains or brush marks clearly remain in certain places on the pottery. This evidence suggests that the brush may have predated written language itself.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That refers only to ‚Äúdecorative designs‚ÄĚ. No mention of it being¬†used¬†for written literature. Fact is that¬†the Guodian was still not written with a brush.¬†

 

Edited by Cobie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I could not find out a date for when they started to use a brush for writing literature.

 

 

Edited by Cobie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It proves that a brush was in existence way before Meng Tian. And how do you know that the Guodian TTC was not written with a brush?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

DIO picture of the¬†Guodian text shows it was not done with a brush. Brushes caused the characters to be changed from round shapes to square shapes. E.g. see etymology śó•

 

 

Edited by Cobie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Cobie said:

DIO picture of the Guodian text shows it was not done with a brush.

 

I'm not convinced.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, wandelaar said:

I'm not convinced.

 


:lol: Have fun researching it. :P Please let me know what your findings are.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Cobie said:

Did not Wang B write with a brush?

 

In the preview Hoff says: 

- he translated from the pre-brush characters

- he uses the Wang B text

 

Legend has it that the brush was invented by Meng Tian (? - 210 BC)

Wang B (226-249 AD)

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

???
 

Hoff uses the Wang B text, I think Wang B used a brush. So I totally fail to understand what Hoff is going on about with his pre-brush characters. 
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Cobie said:

???
 

Hoff uses the Wang B text, I think Wang B used a brush. So I totally fail to understand what Hoff is going on about with his pre-brush characters. 
 

 

Yes - that's a strange thing to do, if you are interested in the meanings of the old characters then you should work with manuscripts that contain those old characters. Apparently he thinks the Wang Bi version is somehow superior. Also the very term "pre writing-brush characters" is vague and imprecise.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, wandelaar said:

… he thinks the Wang Bi version is somehow superior.


Wang B was a Confucian who tried to adapt the DDJ to Confucianism. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Cobie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hoff is into western Taoism. Or rather he was when he wrote The Tao of Pooh and The Te of Piglet. I'm not so sure where he stands now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:lol: PWT, we did that discussion on OD.  :P
 

 

Edited by Cobie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites