forestofsouls Posted February 24, 2008 I think the question to ask is, how do we determine what is relevant in the present moment? It depends on what you're doing. Your inner chatter is not relevant when you're driving, but it IS relevant when you're studying your mind. Nothing is relevant but a single object if you're practicing one-pointed concentration. There is no one size fits all definition. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lotus Flower Posted February 24, 2008 Ok so sure I was in hella pain last night but I got a ton of work done. You have to leverage the need for extreme mind focus as a means to distract you from your body. So I bike home -- sit in more full-lotus. Fall asleep. Wake up with this insane amount of bliss in the nether regions -- like the deepest amazing orgasm. It was awesome. So did more full-lotus, more sleep. Read Ramana Maharshi and Gurdjieff. All I'm saying is that as Gurdjieff states the biggest problem in the West is the lower energy centers remain undeveloped. Read "In Search of the Miraculous" and ignore Ouspensky. Thank you. I guess I will need to do some reading It depends on what you're doing. Your inner chatter is not relevant when you're driving, but it IS relevant when you're studying your mind. Nothing is relevant but a single object if you're practicing one-pointed concentration. There is no one size fits all definition. That is a good point. I think at this point it is important for me (as well as others) to always study the mind. No matter what you may be doing. I feel it gets you more in touch with things. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
forestofsouls Posted February 24, 2008 That is a good point. I think at this point it is important for me (as well as others) to always study the mind. No matter what you may be doing. I feel it gets you more in touch with things. People have gotten into accidents studying their minds while they're driving. I think you will find you always have to limit what you're mindful of. You can only fit so many things in your mind at once*. Even looking inwards, there are deeper and deeper levels that appear over time. Most recently, I've noticed a subtle mind movement that occurs when I think on purpose than if thoughts simply bubble up. If you study your mind, you'll lose externals. If you keep inwardly focused, you'll miss the relationship between sensory inputs and mental reactions. If you focus on your mind, you lose the sense of the body. If you focus on your breath, you'll likely miss the contact of your feet on the ground. Just for reference, what are you studying the mind in relation to? *: In Mt Analogue, Rene Daumal suggests the average mind can only track 3-4 things at once. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
林愛偉 Posted February 24, 2008 If one is concentrating on mindfulness, it isn't mindfulness. Take this for example; The void is vast because it is non-discriminative. All things form the void, the void forms all things. They are as they aren't. Mindfulness would be the non-scattering of the mind, and the non-distinguishing of things. Peace and Blessings, Lin Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
forestofsouls Posted February 24, 2008 If one is concentrating on mindfulness, it isn't mindfulness. Take this for example; The void is vast because it is non-discriminative. All things form the void, the void forms all things. They are as they aren't. Mindfulness would be the non-scattering of the mind, and the non-distinguishing of things. I think a lot of Theravadans would disagree with you, Lin, and the Mahasatipatthana Sutta as well. In fact, according to Bhikku Bodhi, the word "sati" relates to sarati, to remember or keep in mind. You're example makes sense conceptually, but not experientially (at least not to me ) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
林愛偉 Posted February 24, 2008 (edited) I think a lot of Theravadans would disagree with you, Lin, and the Mahasatipatthana Sutta as well. In fact, according to Bhikku Bodhi, the word "sati" relates to sarati, to remember or keep in mind. You're example makes sense conceptually, but not experientially (at least not to me ) It points to knowing all things, without carrying them with you all the times. Thus when the conditions arise, so does the teachings. Mindful of all things, but attached to none. Therefore, if one is mindful of all things, yet all things not being attached to, then all things are not all things, and there is nothign to be mindful of. A non-discriminative mind is all pervasive, non-obstructed. Thus all things are upon the tip of a hair. All Buddha Lands are of all directions, all sounds of the world are regarded, and there is no non-mindfulness, thus no mindfulness. Thus-ness pervades all directions, and not one direction is being pervaded. Peace and Blessings, Lin Edited February 24, 2008 by 林愛偉 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mYTHmAKER Posted February 24, 2008 If one is concentrating on mindfulness, it isn't mindfulness. Take this for example; The void is vast because it is non-discriminative. All things form the void, the void forms all things. They are as they aren't. Mindfulness would be the non-scattering of the mind, and the non-distinguishing of things. Peace and Blessings, Lin Like relaxing your eyes to the back of your head extends peripheral vision. You see everything yet are focused on nothing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lotus Flower Posted February 25, 2008 People have gotten into accidents studying their minds while they're driving. I think you will find you always have to limit what you're mindful of. You can only fit so many things in your mind at once*. Even looking inwards, there are deeper and deeper levels that appear over time. Most recently, I've noticed a subtle mind movement that occurs when I think on purpose than if thoughts simply bubble up. If you study your mind, you'll lose externals. If you keep inwardly focused, you'll miss the relationship between sensory inputs and mental reactions. If you focus on your mind, you lose the sense of the body. If you focus on your breath, you'll likely miss the contact of your feet on the ground. Just for reference, what are you studying the mind in relation to? *: In Mt Analogue, Rene Daumal suggests the average mind can only track 3-4 things at once. I think maybe it would be more appropriate for me to say that I am observing my mind instead of really studying it. I am a beginner in a sense. I am observing how certain thoughts, emotions, reactions come about in my mind. I want to try to calm some of them, especially the ones that are of no use to me. It points to knowing all things, without carrying them with you all the times. Thus when the conditions arise, so does the teachings. Mindful of all things, but attached to none. Therefore, if one is mindful of all things, yet all things not being attached to, then all things are not all things, and there is nothign to be mindful of. A non-discriminative mind is all pervasive, non-obstructed. Thus all things are upon the tip of a hair. All Buddha Lands are of all directions, all sounds of the world are regarded, and there is no non-mindfulness, thus no mindfulness. Thus-ness pervades all directions, and not one direction is being pervaded. Peace and Blessings, Lin Lin, I like the mindful of all things, but attached to none phrase. That is very powerful and holds a lot of truth in the path. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joeblast Posted February 25, 2008 (edited) I think maybe it would be more appropriate for me to say that I am observing my mind instead of really studying it. I am a beginner in a sense. I am observing how certain thoughts, emotions, reactions come about in my mind. I want to try to calm some of them, especially the ones that are of no use to me. I think I mentioned this quote here somewhere as well as at the temple last weekend. "Leave the front and back doors open, but do not invite them to stay for tea." By purposefully not constricting the arising, you arent creating a pressure cooker environment for thought to burst forth; by letting them pass without giving them further credence you are leaving the back door open for them to pass on and out. Further analysis equates to a nice cup of tea Although, depending on the thought, the tea could be such as the Emperor was having served to the Empress When you've established a habit of letting the thoughts go - at least for me - the brain tires of their continued generation. Its like those kids that get picked on in school - the bullies end up picking on the kids that are bothered most by it! By contrast, those that are not bothered become boring targets. The method to train the brain is via the breath Edited February 25, 2008 by joeblast Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
