A Good Tai Chi class

[Dharmandy]

Dear All,

 

what does, in your opinion, constitute a good tai chi class?

 

the reason I'm asking is that in the place where I currently practice Tai Chi they never mention the word "chi" or talk about it. And I don't know if its a good idea to keep going to the place if all we do is repeat the movements the teacher does.

 

When I asked the guy about "chi" his answer was that "chi isnt something you look for. If you look for it you loose it."

 

Any thoughts?

 

Thank you all in advanced!

 

Andy

[idquest]

Depends on your goals and priorities. Taiji can deliver.

 

I'd measure the performance against your needs. If you need martial applications - one thing. If you need qi development - another approach and set of requirements.

 

The answer you received from the instructor is not so bad IMO.

[devoid]

Hi Andy,

 

Here are things I recommend looking for in a good teacher:

• Does the teacher act professionally and with integrity (i.e. does he take his own medicine and do you feel you can rest assured that he doesn't get a kick out of throwing inferior people around needlessly)?
  
• Does the teacher correct your posture by encouraging slightly bent limbs, a straight back and tell you to have your tongue touch your palate?
  
• (If you're very new to this) does your teacher seem to pay attention to detail in a way that might seem slightly pedantic or fussy?
  

If you can answer yes to most of the above, you've got a good teacher (you might need to go there a couple of times before you can really tell, but try analyse your gut feeling and then test it / look out for further signs on your next visit).

 

My teacher also tells us not to focus on qi and instead tells us to concentrate on getting everything about our posture, technique and form right. The point is that to a skilled martial artists it makes no sense to talk about fine-tuning technique with top-level details, when the student hasn't learned to walk, let alone crawl yet. After you have diligently trained for a while (say 6-9 months) you will probably begin to appreciate this viewpoint.

 

Thus, my advice to you is to check through the list above: If you can answer yes to them all, you're already on a very good path. Apart from that it is up to you to:

1. Study (there are tons of good books that will teach you about qi in connection with tai chi and other IMA)
   
2. Train every day (repeat the forms and techniques you are learning daily! - even if for only a few minutes on some days - waiting till the regular class next week ensures only that you will never progress to a high level because you will be spending the lion's share on each class trying to remember what you learned last time)
   

 

Keep training and do let us know how it goes!

Edited September 25, 2010 by devoid

[Dharmandy]

Thanks for your answers.

 

Devoid, special thanks for all the effort! Next class is on tuesday, I will see how things get on!

 

Cheers,

Andy

[Mal]

My teacher also tells us not to focus on qi and instead tells us to concentrate on getting everything about our posture, technique and form right. The point is that to a skilled martial artists it makes no sense to talk about fine-tuning technique with top-level details, when the student hasn't learned to walk, let alone crawl yet. After you have diligently trained for a while (say 6-9 months) you will probably begin to appreciate this viewpoint.

 

I tend to agree. I see a lot of people come to classes over the years with great "book-fu" They've read lots about Tai Chi and can discuss this principal and that energy....... Unfortunately they can't actually "show" what they are talking about and often seem to prefer just talking about it after class (rather than practicing) and tend to give up before the end of the course.

(I know this type well as I started out with awesome book fu but no actual skill )

 

Teachers tend to see a lot of this. It's not necessarily a bad thing, as you wouldn't expect people to be interested in attending a class if they weren't interested in all the "stuff" that you hear about Tai Chi. But talking about eg "Chi" while a lot of fun, isn't that helpful for the students. Especially if they are not at that level yet, my Sifu likes to say "less talk, more practice"

 

So I'd suggest looking around at the students and the teacher in that next class. If you would like to be like the teacher, and you can see the other students moving towards that goal as they spend longer with the teacher. Then it's a good class

 

p.s. as far as "Repeating the movements the teacher does" After several years I still can't do that. As I improve I am able to notice finer details and nuances that I couldn't even see before, let alone copy. Yet we often have beginners in our kung fu class saying they already know a certain technique and are doing it exactly correct. But as teachers we can see numerous "errors" and differences, and are actually still trying to perfect our own version of that technique But the student is just at a level where they can't see those differences yet. It's particularity frustrating for the students when they encounter this, many move on to something else before they have put in the time and work to progress.

 

hope that helps a bit...

[Dharmandy]

hope that helps a bit...

 

Yep, it does. Thanks Mal.

 

Cheers!

Andy

[Martial Development]

When I asked the guy about "chi" his answer was that "chi isnt something you look for. If you look for it you loose it."

 

Any thoughts?

 

One frustrating practice that old teachers, Chinese teachers, and master teachers all seem to have in common: they often answer the person who asked, not the question that was asked.

 

It is an important distinction. When two different people ask the same question, two different answers may be appropriate.

 

Since we don't know you or your teacher, it is difficult to say whether he gave you a good answer.

 

I will say that answers which are good in theory can be bad in practice, and answers which are bad in theory may be good in practice.

 

Hope that helps a lot!

[simply puzzled]

Dear All,

 

what does, in your opinion, constitute a good tai chi class?

 

the reason I'm asking is that in the place where I currently practice Tai Chi they never mention the word "chi" or talk about it. And I don't know if its a good idea to keep going to the place if all we do is repeat the movements the teacher does.

 

My taiji comes downline from William C.C. Chen. William barely ever speaks about qi, but the few times my teacher has gotten him to speak about it privately, he's expressed the thought that qi is concentration energy. For example, if I give you chinese characters to copy inside the traditional 9-box grid, and you don't know chinese writing well, you're going to be thinking in your head about making them, and you'll write them poorly. However, if I were to ask you to copy a phrase in English, you will be able to do it well, even if I make it hard by asking you to write along a curved line. That's because you're not thinking about it in your head, but rather putting your "qi" in your hand. Try it, and you'll understand what I mean. Reading the works of Chen Man Ching, this view seems to be inline with his thinking.

 

So, if you were to come to my class, you probably would not hear the word "qi" very often, unless we were talking about trying to move our "qi" into our hands for push-hands or further up the blade of a sword when we are fencing. We are practical people. My teacher likes to say "this kid [me] doesn't have a mystical bone in his body." He means it as a compliment. We are more concerned with getting our body mechanics perfect than trying to move an invisible energy through our bodies.

 

When you are repeating the movements that your teacher does, think of yourself as an engineer. Every time you do a posture, you're trying to build the absolute strongest structure possible for the applications of that position. For example, on single whip, I should be able to push and push your hand inward to your shoulder without you moving. For golden pheasant stands on one leg, I should be able to push you on opposite side of your rooted leg, and you should remain fully rooted. Thinking about these sorts of concerns will greatly advance your practice. As you explore each posture, your instructor will be able to help you determine where your energies should be focused. And as you advance, you'll be able to think of each posture not as a fixed position but as a movement.

Edited September 27, 2010 by simply puzzled

[ZhengLi]

The thing about Qi is that it takes a lot of physical hard work to even start thinking about it. In the very beginning, it is senseless to concern yourself with it. The meaning of cultivate is "to grow in a prepared culture". Before you can work with Qi, you need to work hard to prepare your body. This is where I'm at right now. At the same time, the student's answer to your question alludes quite strongly to the possibility that he may not know what he's talking about.

 

Another thing to keep in mind, it is a mistake to separate tai chi for meditation, tai chi for health, or tai chi for fighting. Neither of these individually will work, only can somebody gain Tai Chi if his method contains all three of these in one.

Edited September 27, 2010 by ZhengLi

[TzuJanLi]

Greetings..

 

Another thing to keep in mind, it is a mistake to separate tai chi for meditation, tai chi for health, or tai chi for fighting. Neither of these individually will work, only can somebody gain Tai Chi if his method contains all three of these in one.

Crap!! There's a difference??

 

Be well..