Apech

Welcome to TTBs.

Do we have to supress or inhibit habitual neg thoughts? Is it an effective way to transform them? I think we watch them, listen to them, bring them to the light, dont attach to them, dispassionately observe ourselves being pupeteered by them, suffer them, and move on, use taoist or other techniques to purify, purify, purify, and then purify some more.

yes but to 'watch' them you have to stop yourself immediately acting on them don't you? That's what I meant by some kind of control ... but if you just inhibit something in a dumb sort of way then you actually increase its energy ... you could pressure cook yourself by damming up sexual energy. If that's what's meant by suppression it not a good idea. But I think there are people who choose celibacy for instance for entirely positive reasons ... its right for them ... they must go through some kind of process which allows them to release and redirect the sexual energy otherwise they become a suppressor.

If by 'inhibit' you mean when we think someone is a complete asshole , we dont splurge our thought out at them, then I agree we do that. But I think we do more than that. We work with the thought to dissolve it, with humour and awareness at our lack of empathy so that we get to a place of neutrality or at worst a comfortable 'no thanks' instead of a reactive repudiation.

Oh to be a complete asshole ... if only ... I spend my days as a partial asshole looking up at my betters ....

If we only inhibit, and dont transform, we are in a position of no change, no growth.

 

I wouldnt like to think that I would be tempering negative thought responses in the same endless way ad infinitum. That would be 'manners' and 'being polite' which is a good discipline in its own right, but not enough for a practitioner, I'd have thought.

 

I know that when I share doubts and negative responses with you,Apech, for example, doing that removes the charge from them and they dissolve each time with less to them than before. If I inhibited them to the extent that I didnt share them, and I wasnt able to work with them, they would cause me grief and impede my progress/clarity.

Completely agree.

Seems almost contradictory to say people flock to one who holds to the Tao and yet while people stop for music and good food the Tao is bland and lacks flavour.

I guess that what it is saying is that the Tao is not about entertainment or stimulation. People will feel complete and at ease when they meet a Sage but on the other hand its not like stopping at a sweet shop window and looking at all the candy. In fact I suppose it is saying they are opposites of a kind.

well, you know the saying."If its too hard, I cant understand it."...

I read that in the Evening Standard.

I don't think you can do this mystical thing without some level of control. So in a sense this is suppression or inhibition of some tendencies in your being - for instance habitual negative thoughts. But I also agree that its not about sexual repression.

I think the problem is that we start from a state of confusion - so we have to start by sorting out the wheat from the caff. Also we have been conditioned to think certain ways about sex which may be harmful. So we do have to purify in a relative sense. But also it is true that it is all about disclosing to ourselves the true nature of our selves an dour sexual energy which you can't do if you are suppressing what is an essential part of yourself.

My hunch is that at a high level of development ones needs a consort if one has that active reaching out impulse within one's being. Otherwise the free flowing of ones sexuality may well be considerd unboundaried by others who needs must have a boundaried sexuality.

 

I dont think everyone has the active reaching out kind of sexuality.

 

I dont want to think of guru 'molestation' as actually 'merely' that, I would prefer to think of it as something we are not understanding.

 

Having said that.. sexuality isnt just a wild horse, it's a herd of wildebeest, so....

Needing a consort ... yes I can go with that ... but apparently Mr. Baba liked to massage people's genitals with oil ... even that might be ok if there was some kind of context for it ... but yes maybe its something we don't understand.

Hello and welcome - look forward to your questions.

He can molest no longer, good riddance.

A lot of these people who take on the 'guru' status turn out to have some kind of sex scandal in their lives. I'm not sure why that is. Many of them teach celibacy or some kind of strict moral code as well. To be honest - although I started this thread when I saw the news item - I don't know a lot about Sai Baba - though I've met people who regarded him as god (more or less).

I wonder if there is something about being a guru in this way which distorts the person. Cultivation and meditation is generally a lonely practice and I wonder what it is like if you become surrounded by thousands (or millions) of worshipers all focusing their minds on you.

I say this not to excuse any of the molestation but rather to explain why it might occur ... and because I find the guru thing highly unattractive ... I think that people look to teachers in this way as an excuse for not working on themselves and for not picking up their own burdon (so to speak).

Welcome Andy - look forward to your contributions.

Obituary

I'm not a follower by the way (!).

Here is the 17.00 offer.

 

 

http://earthwaterfir...us-revolutions/

Looks like awful spam/commerce to me.

Why has he got the four western elements on a Taoist book? Where is metal? Dodgy.

I don't think you can draw any conclusion between the shower and the surgery ... as in don't have the surgery because of the shower ... but it is true (IMO) that there is resonance or connectivity between things that happen to us.

Assuming things is a bad idea. As in - it's wet under the shower therefore the shower is leaking. Its always more interesting/enlightening to find out what is actually happening rather than assuming. The way is a real way and not an abstract way.

If you want to see the third connection look inside at how you are feeling.

 

 

I don't want to coddle other people's egos, nor do I want mine coddled. I'm not interested in trying to reinforce anyone's delusions, nor do I want mine reinforced. I want to cut away everything that is not necessary, and spend my practice in the essential. I look around the Bums, and see a great group of intelligent, wise, experienced and kind fellow travelers. Can this be our mutual dojo for practicing making sense? Can we keep each other honest, not by being mean or superior or dismissive, but by being fearlessly clear? Can we assist in each other's growth, without falling into either extreme of being against - or just trying to please - each other?

THIS!!!!

The most interesting, intelligent and controversial participants have been banned temporarily or permanently. With that action by the moderators, that has created a lack of interest by some that remain. There seems to be a move to create a more sanitized discussion forum that is more spiritually correct. Very boring to say the least!

 

These punitive actions have been a result of a few "valued members" complaints. I have yet to have an answer as to who the valued members are.

No one at all has been banned or suspended for being interesting, intelligent or controversial. Everyone (except spammers) who has been banned or suspended either insulted another user or was trolling/multi-posting to hijack a thread/topic.

All members are valued as far as I am concerned - if a post is reported we look at it the same way whoever reported it.

Just to be clear - passionate and emotive language and debate is not a problem. At all. Its not the discussion of ideas that is a problem its when that breaks down into personal attacks at the person you disagree with. If you start swearing at them or calling them an idiot because they hold a different idea then that is a problem. As I see it the 'no insult' policy protects freedom of speech.

Welcome Maria - enjoy your time at TTBs.

Not very helpful I know - but access to site is ok from here - so I think it must be a problem local to you.

Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,

Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,

Till on the haunting flares we turned out backs,

And towards our distant rest began to trudge.

Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots,

But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame, all blind;

Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots

Of gas-shells dropping softly behind.

Gas! GAS! Quick, boys!--An ecstasy of fumbling

Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time,

But someone still was yelling out and stumbling

And flound'ring like a man in fire or lime.--

Dim through the misty panes and thick green light,

As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.

In all my dreams before my helpless sight

He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.

If in some smothering dreams, you too could pace

Behind the wagon that we flung him in,

And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,

His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin,

If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood

Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs

Bitter as the cud

Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,--

My friend, you would not tell with such high zest

To children ardent for some desperate glory,

The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est

Pro patria mori.

- Wilfred Owen

Why not give a member a message when you decide to delete everything they ever wrote in their privat discussion thread?

I don't hate to see it gone. In fact it felt clean. It's just the disrespect of not telling a member before you do. Surprisingly brutal

Rain,

I am puzzled by this and am sure it is a mistake of some kind. I don't think any of us delete or edit personal practice - in fact its a self edit area. I can't think of a reason why anyone would do this.

A.

this is amazing.

Yes it is.

 

 

Just happens I am listening to belly dancing music today. No, no videos. That would be too distracting. My mind is already doing a good job all on its own.

Do you have indigestion? That would explain the music.

 

 

I couldn't have said it better myself! I remember the days when he was a dustman down Manchester way, it was a really tedious job, yet he did it with gusto!

 

Also there was the time when he was a tedious milkman. None were more tedious than he!

 

The strange thing that always confused me was how satisfied all the single mums were with his service. That I never understood.

 

 

"Good morning madam, would you like some extra cream?"

"Good morning madam, can a satisfy you with a doorstep delivery?"

These are the lines that always worked for me.

I think that that transition between the speed of the world and the stillness of meditation is very hard. I think getting up 1/2 hour earlier and doing some then is a good idea - if you can manage this - or otherwise in the evening but not either immediately on getting home or just before going to bed. The best thing is to set a routine so it just becomes part of your life ... do it at the set hour whether you feel like it or not - just sit for 20 - 30 mins say and don't worry if it seems good, bad, pointless ... or what ever just do it.

The advantage of systems like Taoism or Buddhism is that it gives advice or answers to your behaviour in the day as well. For instance not getting caught up in strong workplace emotions. infighting, bitterness and so on ... they sap your energy. So a good ethical approach to your work life will support your practice. If you do energy work you could do some breathing exercises quietly at lunch time or at your desk also.

I know i shouldn't ask this but what's the reason for banning some members?

 

More importantly, why were some threads banned? Please give examples of banned threads so we can learn to self-moderate.

 

Ta

No threads have been banned. Some have been locked and some have been moved to off topic. Either they were not really Taoist discussion or they were repetitive slanging matches between certain parties.

The main reason for suspending or banning is repeated insults. There has also been an outbreak of multi-posting and some trolling. Read the Moderation Guidelines if you what to know what is ok and what is not. If there seems to be more moderation recently then it is because of people not respecting these rules which are how Sean who owns the site wants things to be done.

Believe it or not moderation is a pain which takes up a lot of time. Most of it is deleting spam and helping other members sort out tech probs and so on (this bit is not a pain). If people respect the guidelines then we don't have to do anything much ... which would be great.

A.