Nungali

The snow frames the window panes , the scent of the real Christmas tree wafts through the house . The fire burns brightly in the grate while Granddad naps in the chair after too much pudding and brandy sauce . Mum and Gran are cleaning up after the Christmas lunch, the kids play happily on the floor with their new toys and dad puts on some Christmas music ;

I am reading the thread title of the thread you created and continue to post in .

I am . YOU are the one that doubts what even a single word means . I even gave you an etymological dictionary for Christmas to help you . But I do realize some people can not be helped .

I thought you sat in a room all day with no thoughts ... thats what you often claim . and in this thread you claimed to be a satanist ... they have 'monks now' ?

Why not , tis the way of the modern world . I mean if it looks like a pair of scissors , thats enough to get out there on the market ... cheap plastic parts that are going to break so you will end up throwing the rest of the irreparable metal parts away , un-designed finger holes that hurt your fingers and blades that don't actually touch so they bend paper instead of cutting it . Chairs that look like a chair until you sit in it and realize it was never considered to support the human form properly . Cars full of high tech and safety and comfort gadgets that become useless due to some installed computer that does things for you that everyone did manually up to 10 years ago . ERrrmmm ... isnt that what I just did ? Like 'hard' and 'soft ' ? Well , I dont remember ever buying a word ... but I am pretty sure that birds are those critters that fly through the air , this thing I am drinking atm is 'coffee' abd it is out of a cup' . Life must be confusing for you to drink out of a cup and not be sure you know the name of it or even how to ask for a 'cup' of 'coffee' .... I guess you could mime it . Wow ..if you have that problem, imagine how confusing and hard for you to comprehend anything , especially when words are a communication medium ... say, like on an internet forum ! Actually I do that all the time . A few times here I have written about the meaning of the word religion ( relating to 'to bind' and in other cultures 'Law' . 'Enlightenment ? Ditto several times . Love .... mostly I talked about the two main distinctions between 'eros' and 'agape' . .. spirits ? Nah, we never talk about that word ( being associated with air , breath, life force , and (in my view ) essence . Then again, I never bought words , I do look into their meaning though here you go, this might help , I consult them all the time and often post info to clear up someone's confusion ; https://www.etymonline.com/ ( consider that your Christmas present ) Eh ? No wonder words confuse you ! Ya gotta get them in the right order . Eh ? What is my take on ' just if there isnt or it can not be seen or felt anymore - to me its fake ' just after you complained about the lack of clarity in the meaning of words ? _ I dont really know what to say about that . Usually around this point . I like to point out the hope of reptiles and whales to the sacred as well but I dont do it in a profane manner then again there are people who point out the sacred aspect within the most profane things so it makes sense and ...... ( no sorry , I cant fix the rest .. whales and reptiles are profane ? or , there is hope for them ? ... or , you have a secret code to explain to us what those words really meant ... I know ! You are going to examine the Book of Jonah in its original Hebrew to see what דָּג גָּדוֹל means ? what do those words actually mean ?

at the end of it .... that would be the whale's arsehole .... so I am not sure what you inferred about the stairway to heaven ... I dont know about all that lining up and all those stairs , it seems very tedious and somewhat worse than Seaworld

No ! This is serious business ! Do you realize all pretzels used to be soft ? ! Thats the original and true pretzel . It wasnt until that upstart , Martin Luther like , Julius Sturgis ( an American , of course ) decided to intentionally bake hard pretzels and market them , thus splitting the holy symbol into two followings . This 'Church of England America Pretzel ' now has influence world wide ; Hard Pretzels: Account for approximately 57% to 76% of total market revenue. Soft Pretzels: Account for approximately 24% to 43% of total market revenue. Thus overthrowing the once true and only pretzel . Gosh ! They are nearly like a 'Communion wafer ' ! ... except you can make them at home . [ No, I have no idea what that is . ]

Dont pretzelytize ! Pretzelytize ; To convert or attempt to convert someone from one ( a mixed up hodge - podge of ) religion, belief, or opinion to another.

Oh no .... thats plagiarism !

Cool ! That is a major basis of Australian Aboriginal spirituality ( re distinct ethnicity and 'nations' connection to land , birthplace and identity ) . AI Overview; There were hundreds of distinct Aboriginal groups (often called tribes or nations) in Australia before European colonization, with estimates ranging from 500 to 600 different groups, speaking over 250 languages (or dialects), each with unique lands, cultures, and traditions, forming incredibly diverse societies across the continent I have also explored it with Tarot; ( not in a reading but ) a way of viewing the deck in its 'construction' , or a 'lay out ' . ... for 'countries and continents ' This has happened at least twice in this environment , Wibalma was one of them In Ngarinyin and Kimberley tradition, Wibalma was a visionary artist-ancestor credited with being the primary catalyst for Wunan Law, the ancient social and legal system of Northwest Australia. His role is defined by several key actions and characteristics: The Visionary Artist: Wibalma is described as the figure who "started society" through his art. He is closely associated with the Gwion rock art tradition (formerly known as "Bradshaw figures"), which serves as the original graphic legal documentation of the Wunan system. Creation of the Sacred Object: Traditional accounts state that Wibalma created a single sacred object of Justice (manjilarri), which became the catalyst for the entire Wunan legal framework. yes. In most ancient traditions they are related or a 'reflection' of one to another . In some places its even etched onto the stone giving a function of timing ( ie. when the image carved in the stone lines up in certain ways , with the images in the stars ). Your comment also made me think of what I call 'Earth Acupuncture ' . On a large scale : see Tibetan Sinmo https://rubinmuseum.org/the-demoness-of-tibet/ On a large scale ; temples or on your land , smaller scale , hammer in a few of these at the appropriate points Of course, personally I would not fuck with it ; down here landscape energies are regulated by natural features and all connected to the central feature ; Which is why the indigenous dont like people moving stuff around, taking rocks, changing landscape and especially dont like people 'mucking around with crystals ' as they dont know what they are doing ( indigenous have a highly secret active crystal technology that they use ) . .

Of course they are ... this is Abrahamic religions discussion forum It is apparently a Christian religious answer . I never made a good Christian as a little fellah ... apparently I asked too many questions and was encouraged to drop all that .... just 'be good' , plod along, dont cause trouble, no rocking the boat , and stop being interested in all that other stuff you want to know about ... and eventually :

Exactly ! Brilliant ! Classic example of a new age blend of east and west mysticism ... in that (in case you never realized) ; a pretzel is NOTHING like the infinity symbol .... a perfect demonstration of how the east and west mysteries correlate ! but then again, maybe you can not tell the difference ?

Dont call me love . Somehow .... I missed that .

Hang on - were you not playing at being an enlightened Buddhist that dropped desire ( and was congratulated for it ) last Sunday ? and for months previous, lamented that you sit around doing nothing and thinking nothing due to 'spirit invasions / something putting wires in your head / other 'stuff' . Now back to being a Satanist again ?

Since you yet again quoted me and edited out most of what I said , to enable you to ........ ??? I shall now demolish your silly comment last count ( on reviewing my post here ) I offered at least 4 variations or possibilities of what I thought it could mean . So I would like yo know how my 'translation' is 'merely one' of many possible translations . OR you could just quote this post , remove most of it, leave a few words to change meanings and then criticize that ..... if that is 'what does it for ya '

A local indigenous dance (sort of titled; ) ' We hunt what we see ' : anyone can do it, it has elements of 'free form' in it ; hunting, stalking, watching , considering , choosing then ...... bam ! Spearing it ! (into the ground in front of the person , object or process they have incorporated into the 'dance' . Even old 'Gubbo ' ( a renowned elder from 'out of ' this 'country ; Gumbaynngirr ) who was sitting in the audience. The Gumgayngggirr lead dancer approached him , looked at him with head cocked , smelt him, fluffed his beard (all highly impolite ... out of the dance ) then yelled and speared the ground in front of him . Ted smiled . .. it was actually a compliment . Most think its a simple hunting mime . Some think ... they hunt people ! ? ... others misunderstand it as being a simple process , you have to see what you hunt , after all .. so what are they on about . Its about learning from life , searching for lessons in nature and environment (hunting 'truth' ) , evaluating , using , seeing best benefit , considering it and how to apply it then 'taking it in ' and using it to grow and develop . 'Hunter and hunted' ; .................................... ( Uncles Wirrunga- Gumbayynggirr elder and Ted { Thomas} - Yuin Elder ; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guboo_Ted_Thomas What ... who ... where ?

Dont you mean that famous book ; ' The Hairy Blood and the Hairy Grail ' ?

... line 6 and 8

Thats what I thought . My translation is , actually, what it is NOT ... it isnt just zero , void .... nothingness'

Lambs slaughtering lambs then ? Makes sense ; Jesus thing makes 'sense ' too .... IF we assume the Lord ( Jehovah) wanted lamb for dinner as well . Not surprising at all since this lord likes fresh blood scattered around his temple , joints and legs of meat in a 'wave offering ' and burnt upon the altar and his fav. incense is the sizzling fat of BBQ kidneys . But that all got subverted by Jesus ending sacrifice like that .. after he got sacrificed up to own farther as some type of strange Canaanite offering .

I clearly stated that . and demonstrated it mathematically as well . But not perceivable by us ; can you perceive anything else in 0 ? yet +1 and -1 can come 'pout of' zero . of course, anyone can argue with me , but when citing the TTC you cant argue with what is written there ' The Tao begot one.One begot two.Two begot three.And three begot the ten thousand things. if you go against that you still have to explain whrer the 1 and the 2 came from . Well. I could argue that potentials are unmanifest . but I dont need to ( taps Ch 42 again ) Depends how you look at it ; eg , in science , we look at 'nothing' and see nothing ... its not 'manifest ' yet we know ( from observing other things - perhaps like Lao did ) that 'empty space ' is full of virtual particles and quantum fields .. What was 'lao' thinking of when he said 'nothingness' ... or did he actually say 'The Way ' COBY ! So it may not even be 'nothingness' at all ! IMO it is a word to describe the fundamental natural order of the Universe and an all pervading principle ; 'The Way ' or 'the Path ' . The no naming and no speaking of it describes the 'issue' that it is beyond normal human comprehension , communication and observation ( at Lao's time ) . bringing its influence down to human comprehension and behavioral emulation ( ie its human application ) means living in harmony by applying the principles of nature and the 'natural flow' of things instead of applying forceful human actions that then lead to conflict or imbalance . You then need to define what this special 'logic' is first , otherwise I have to run with standard definitions . Logical thinking will not describe the Dao, void, the way of the universe, quantum fields or virtual particles . That is 'Classical Logic ' ( the principle of non - contradiction ) yet we have quantum physics and Schrodinger's cat and also even some philosophical views on that ; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialetheism Hmmm .... we seem to be hopping all over the place ... how did this 'creator' get into it and why would any creator need to abide by logic only , when even the Greeks saw an alternative ? I dont think we can insist what any creator , the Way of the Universe , The Dao or nature MUST conform to such human insistence . Which is precisely what Lao infers and states . I can give you many examples where observe 'nothingness' ( from our limited perceptive point of view ) , yet it is FULL of potential . One can be electromagnetic fields . Can you see it ? can you feel it ? ... can you detect it it by using equipment other than what you have naturally ? No, but we can detect its effects ... just like quantum (and astro ) physics has done ... just like Lao did . The 'one' fits in between the 0 and the 2 . Perhaps you are a monist trying to claim that's what Dao 'must be ' ? ... and that ^ is a manifestation of the two that came out of the one, that came out of the Dao and ... dont forget you need to include ... generated the three . In your theory , if the '' ... “1” here means the display of the Creator '' , then I assume the Creator is the 0 ? We have two things ; creator and the created . 0 or Dao postulates a pre state to that . if the creator 'created' they must have existed before the creation ( as 1 'thing' ) and then created OR creator and created ' generated ' together . - either way , they are potentials that came out of 0 . Let's say there was a 1 creator ( which you seem to call 0 ? ) , first you would need to describe how that came into existence ... aside from void , 0 or Dao (according to your theory ). In any case there is a stage where we have 1 or 'creator' then creator creates your ' 1 - the display of the creator ( I am assuming you mean 'the creation, ie the '10,000 things' ). Now we have two things ( your 1 and 0 ) BUT that creates a third dynamic that didnt exist 'before ' , now creator can observe know and be aware of creation , something that could not have happened before the split into 0 and 1 ( minus 1 and positive 1 ... actually make that n+ and n- ) . So now the third principle comes into action, forming the basic primal 'ideal' ( not yet 'real' - physically manifested ) triad . and from that comes the fourfold world of 'the real', the 'material' , forces and principles - the 10,000 things . Literally ? Well, is it actually about nothingness or the way 'heaven' works ? Hang on , why should we accept that ? Do not all who proclaim to be Daoists use a 'Daoist method' in their actions and beliefs ? Ie they try to emulate the way of heaven / natural order . Well ... you can say that ... but you might be wrong I'll let 'one of those guys' answer this for you . Tracking our originating information and interpretations that lead to the arrival conclusions is a way of seeing the validity of those conclusions . . if they are at fault , well ..... Of course the 'two' are obscure as they pre-empt the 10,000 things . The 3 is also obscure as it resides 'above the abyss' in the ideal triangle that generates manifest realities . Its all in CH 42 .

Yes ... I think that is also called having a 'God Complex' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_complex Nah ... Enlightenment is usually described in other terms ( a profound state of spiritual awakening , wisdom, liberation from ignorance and suffering - stuff like that) . You seem to be describing some type of religious emulation via sublimation . Yes, that seems to be about the idea that true power and influence come from humility and yielding, not dominance - The greatest leaders attract followers by being humble and putting themselves below others, just as rivers collect tributaries by being the lowest point. It seems advice for rulers in the way of the Dao ... not advice for the people to become like Gods ... which seems to be what you are now suggesting ? Again affirmed by the use of 'King' - the perspective here is not aimed at 'the people ' ( here , the rivers and streams are 'the people' ) NOT in Christianity ,,,, not at all . Jeus is clearly the Shepard ( John 10:11 , Mathew 25: 31 - 46 , Hebrews 13;20 , 1 Peter 5 : 4 , - I will put this down to yet another Christian trying to juggle Daoism into the 'Christian Box' of their own belief system . ... or perhaps there is some other 'motive' ?

Moving onto your comments (about the 'confusion' or 'contradiction' ) in Ch 3 ... this is the 'verb ' ; advice on how to act in the 10,00 things ie . 'Way of Dao ' .

May as well start here ^ . This first mention of Dao is the 'nothingness , with nothingness but potential' out of which comes pairs of primal 'contrasts ' which underpin everything else . 0 = 1- + 1 + Thats it , nothing else no 'way of causality response' . That is a dynamic involved after creation . As though the first were a noun and the second a verb . Dao is one thing ( concept ... as its actually no thing ) 'The way of Dao ' is another thing that would involve influence on our inspirations > thoughts > responses > actions if we choose that way . However , I dont understand what you mean by 'all being read ' . And I would dispute your last sentence ... except for the inclusion of ' force' which would not be the way of Dao , in all things . At most ; 'gentle force along with the direction of the natural forces in question ' , again its an action , a verb and not the original essence of 'no thing' . I would say however Tzu understood the fact that attempting to use this knowledge to create or 'bring about ' positive outcomes creates positive outcomes.. A perhaps simpler way of describing it is , the other day after much frustration watching people do ;the wrong thing' and causing problems all around , when the solution is ( well, to me ) blindingly obvious ... and bored and over the continual crap over it , I 'came out ' and said ' Look ! ' I am a Daoist Magician ! I can show you the easiest way to get to the best outcome that YOU want .'' Of course strange and weird look at me . I asked the main person involved ( not an Aussie ) ; ''Do you go to our beaches and swim in the surf ? '' '' Sure ... what's that got to do with it ?'' '' What if you get caught in an off shore 'rip' , on a remote beach with no life savers , and get sucked out to sea ?'' '' Oh wait... I remember this , when I got here I did a course on beach safety ..... ummmm ... you dont swim or fight against it, heading straight back to shore , you swim across it to the side ... and you might even end up in a current that brings you back to shore . '' Me ; '' See ... you are a Daoist Magician too ! ''

I suppose , as time goes on, we will be seeing more of this .