Nungali

So if I leave my private contact info might be given to decibelle, .. . . and ( good lord I forgot his name - that mad Turkish astral samurai and ...... ) Looks like I am doomed for a life of slave labour writing posts here on Daobums ( Insidious Chinese ! )

Serves 'em right for showing off !

We know ..... ,,, thats why, and in other threads previous to this, I keep urging him to break out, seek individuation ... break the cycle ... Independence is quickly got by jumping in the river . (do you know the story ? ) from 1;16 (ignore the title - no one is a jerk here ) Ya gotta start somehow .

I agree. soul and imagination, in a way, are the same thing. In Harpur's Book 'The Philosopher's Secret Fire' (an essential read here, I think) he makes a good case for identifying this secret fire as the 'imagination'. (And again, we might have as different an understanding of imagination as we do of soul. ) But if we have a 'soul' and there is a 'world soul'. would not that 'external level ' of the 'Anima Mundi' have an 'imaginative soul' as well ? I agree , once we remove a lot of the political content of religion. And some take it further back (picking up yoga along the way) to psychotropic drugs. ( Ethnobotany) Thanks ! Until one gets to 'psychotic' explanations when it approaches the 'boundary' of 'Quantum' .... like the Universe has multiple personality syndrome

In my experience and studies, most certainly ! But in some cases I think they can be otherwise. The issue is, as Seth points out above with 'what type of magic' ... what type of spirits'. So far the conversation topic has been pretty broad and undefined. But we have flowed along through that. besides, I rarely have a strong one- sided view of things and 'reality'. If you read the fairly brief extract in the Dr vanDusen paper above that Donald linked to, you will see some of the indicators and qualities of the two types of 'spirits' he talks about. One distinction is this very quality of one type only knows what the patient knows, but another type seems to have knowledge beyond the patient's ... and other related matters. Some of these distinctions qualities and tests, make up some of the 'rules' or practices of one type of magic. Of course, to get further into that, the source of these 'higher' .... 'personified energies' ... being 'external' it does become more philosophical. One view that deals with this issue ( that I like ) is in Exo-psychology where there is 8 levels of consciousness of the self, with each level having an equivalent location in the physiology ( hind brain, frontal lobe, cell genetics, etc ) , the highest level is said to be ' non local' . Not really because there is that 'magic' generalisation again. I would say that shamanic practice is a type of magic. Oooooo ... we just went from Psyche ( soul) opening that 'Golden Box' , above ^ , to Pandora and another type of box ! I think we have to connect inside with the aspect ( we can become 'fractured' and 'alienated' ) and then reconnection is required. but some things we might need de-connection with. I see this totally different to shamanic soul retrieval and loosing the soul. But the soul connection is broken anyway (thats what the myth of Psyche is about, and getting that connection back) . We function with a broken connection nowadays ... most of us ... in the 'machine' . When the connection is gone, the person is like a zombie. Soul 'mucks up' a bit when it is not acknowledged, when it expresses itself and finds happiness and is given appreciation, it blossoms. Then again, I know what I mean when I use the term 'soul'. it might be far from others concepts. Its a large complex subject and I try to be brief. It is an experience of part of it. I think psychology is a way of looking at part of the dynamics of magic.

DB - I watched my father work himself in to an early grave. First he had a bad heart attack from stress and overwork (after being layed off for a disability in the fire brigade and ripped off on a proper injury payment ) . But he recovered and could have had an early retirement and still done all the things he loved; surfing, but not in big surf, fishing, but get a little outboard motor instead of rowing ... etc. His work ethic wouldnt allow it and he went back and died from another heart attack. That made a bit of an impression on me when I was young. What;s the point anyway if you slog the best years of your life out and even do get 20 years retirement when you are old and worn out at the end, even if it doesnt kill you first. Of course, everyone said I had to, that is how it worked, you saved up and got 'superannuation' that would look after you. I even said way back then, "They will probably steal that off the old people when they become old and helpless. I dont trust the bastards ! " Everyone thought I was a terrible person and being ridiculous ... but that is exactly what ended up happening here ! So I decided back then to drop out and have my fun. I have never looked back and had a full and wonderful life, lived in many places, travelled and had many wonderful relationships. What you describe above, what you seem to be projecting on us en mass ? is nothing like I think or what I have done. Sure I have had straight jobs at times, some for years on end; in the hospital, cooking, film industry, teaching (hmmm ... now that I think, I had it so I could walk barefoot across the paddocks and go to work at the school as it was next door, and they didnt mind if I taught in bare feet - back then, - I guess the point is , jobs dont have to be that straight or limiting or not fun. Just dont get bogged down in them. Or in a life situation either.) When I made the break I had about $600 some clothes and camping stuff and a small cheap motorcycle .... off I went. Do you know the Sufi story where the master instructed the seeker to go and throw himself in the river ?

oh good (sometimes I think my little visual quips get misinterpreted ? ) its good to have a laugh.

Likewise we can see that we interpret things by what we know ( e.g. a report of a first European landing; some clouds came over the sea ( ships sails coming up over the horizon) and stopped out in the ocean, out of it came a water insect walking across the water ( a long boat with oars) and men got out of it. I extend that concept the way you do above ( and there is a magnificent book I read once that does this throughout our history, it tracks developments in spiritual cosmology and 'scientific' discoveries and how they effected interpretations of current psychological themes - but I can for the like of me remember title or author ) to - we are used to dealing with people and personalities, so we often give 'energies' and forces a personality or identity to be able to relate to them. When we become 'fractured' or 'alienated' misunderstood or unidentified parts of the self are given or assume such 'separate' personalities'. On the other hand , is our 'psyche' so much 'contained' within ourselves ? I think not. We 'spread out', we are connected with many forces, we stand at the crossroads. Are we going to think that what 'constitutes us' is sealed up in a membrane, a little unit of 'self' ? In my experience, no. How does one 'connect' with something without partly being that thing itself ? Where does the Sun 'end' ... what is the limit of itself ? Just what we can see visually as a fiery sphere ? Or are we inside the greater sphere of its influence? The same with the unconscious ... or, I prefer here, the 'soul' - the 'personality' of the 'unconscious' * , it may well include components from 'outside' . *

isnt that the point of tantra ( in a simple sense ) ?

Errrrmmmm .... I think, considering the context here ... you might have made an unfortunate typo up there ?

Thank you . I actually dont go out on dates ... maybe I will go to a restaurant very rarely, but the food is usually not as good as I can cook and it costs a lot as well. Its better to invite them to a cooked meal at home ( but its harder for many to go to a home first than a restaurant - but then, I dont go on dates, or go out with people I dont already know ), in my case, /// what's you pleasure ; Thai, Chinese, Japanese, Persian, Italian, Greek ? Once I told a woman I was hopeless at dating , I wouldnt know what to do or where to go. I would rather make some food and supplies and take it up to Gondwanaland picnic area, cook over hot coals on a BBQ and eat it looking out over the rainforest . She thought that sounded great and said 'Can I come?" I wasnt expecting that! A picnic ! How lame could I have gotten ? { I just remembered that I have some old scripts about special cooking for dates at home when I did a radio show , a segment called ' Cooking with Eric Esoteric' .... perhaps I should put one up here ? To explain some of the ' finesse' of the 'art' ( I am sure some can imagine what sort of a radio show I might produce ? ) - have to rummage through the files ... as I recall the one with the recipe for ' Venusian Oysters' might be the go ?

Michael Sternbach ! That is the most outrageously violent reactive suggestion as to how to deal with me I have ever read anywhere on the all the forums I have been on .... tut tut ! However I will put it down to your 'poor ' understanding of English terms and familiarity with internet forum lingo DFP ; The next level is a TFP ( but hard to achieve by oneself ... it is usually achieved by consensus ) ; next in intensity is I am shocked that you think I would use violence against this cute innocent little guy Truly shocked !

hate ? stop with it ? Okay I will be clear for you yes, everything has seemed to change since a few decades ago, one never knows what you might see next or what people will do next or find fashionable, possible or interesting, its nearly surreal like. Like some 'jingle sayings' too perhaps ?

There are peacocks about , you say ? Jolly Good !

Nah ... you should speak for yourself, I am part of 'we all' and noooo I dont agree at all. Not at all how my sex life goes. For me, when I did ( and note - it wasnt 'all the time' ) I had an increase in those things, and 'she' did too ... to the extent that people would notice it, ask about it, want some, try to touch us , etc .... OH ! Riiiight ! I get that .... but errrmmm .... me ? True ... if one has been overdoing it IMO. Tell that to some women I know ! (And for nature ... well, the goat pic above should suffice .... there was a monkey gang bang pic, but I though I should not post that here ? ) . One could say it is a cultural meme and script that women are not that sexually motivated like men ? ( I mean ,,, they dont even have orgasms, eh ? ) One could even say, men might find women liked sex better if men were not so 'self - concentrated' during it ? Aha! That could be the 'issue' .... you do realase quiet good male orgasms can be had without ejaculation , dont you ? Yeah, thats a bummer. There seems to be a distinct lack of training, which, I thought was from sexual oppression, not the opposite, which seems to be what you are suggesting ? In a thread such as this, I am not at all sure how to read that comment !

< APERADFP ! - actually physically enacted reactive automatic double face palm > Okay then .... I am saying the same thing ! ( Man ..... if you do get a date and some of your 'classic comments' slip out .... )

Ohhhhh ... everything has changed since then !

Of course its real ... just as real as anything else . But this is why we have 'filters' . Perhaps 'getting back' is a matter of learning how to operate the filters ? I had similar experience as you , not so much with pavement cracks but each blade of grass, the colour of the sky, the smells coming out from the rain forest, the first rays of dawn lighting the trees and mist ... I was in tripped out ecstasy (yep, pretty much like all the good stuff and non of the urkey stuff - like stomach - from the good old days of pure Swiss LSD). This happened a few years back after a bout of serious ill health and the doctors told me, my condition had flared up and I might only have a few months left. I accepted that as I have had such a great and satisfying life already. Then the 'mystic wonder' / visionary stuff really came on strong! That eventuated as mis-diagnosis, another 20 year 'lease', a different healing approach that cured most of the problems, a new young GF with 3 young kids and me instantly hurled into family life with babies and everything ! Some thing I have never experienced before. That ,at times, tended to take me away from the state, the 'in the moment wonderland' ( some of the 'relationship dynamics' not the young kids - they are great for sharing that 'wonderland space' ! ) . I noticed when I was 'In it' (that space) it was near impossible to deal with dicks, go to the supermarket, etc and when I could do that, I had lost the space. Over time I learnt how to 'open and close the shutters' as it where. I can re-enter that space ( but I do have a really nice natural environment around me). At times, I can even be in it in the supermarket - to an extent - one doesnt want to come home with only 10kg of broccoli because it is so beautiful ) . But I cant really explain how I came to be able to do that .... I know it took time , and there must have been some original proclivity in my make up. I can think also, of a whole lot of meditations, rituals and visualisations I did , also the 'dharma' (in the sense of, you do 'certain works' - 'certain results' will follow, sometimes years later). At the time, these accrued latter results were not apparent, they are now. Perhaps it is a matter of selection of the right techniques for the specific person ? B E S makes a good point above about revealing stuff. At one stage, contact with 'other world personified nature energies' was so strong, I began building them a spirit house. Some people though that was great and wanted one for their garden. Other people I just said it was 'pixie house' , some I told I was 'working on a model'. When I left the house the owner said to take it out the garden and take it with me as It was mine. I said it was a gift for the garden. I think she may have dumped it after I left.... I would not want to be in her shoes after that (and her cutting down the beautiful old tree in the garden, for no reason whatsoever but, as she said, she didnt 'like it' - which was the cause of the 'trouble' / disturbances in the first place ! )

yes, its getting like that < knocking sound > Oh crap! <goes to the door > OH ! Its just the brush turkey ... that's a relief !

Your mum ?

There ya go DB .... the goose and gander thing. He certainly 'asked for ' that. True! I am not attractive, or well built or 'handsome'. I am overweight and unfit, even when I was fit and training 3 to 4 times a week I still had a paunch. I am just that type ( lazy ) .... but those things never seemed to matter. Also I am a dag, unfashionable, dont have much money of any fancy possessions. But it never seemed to have repelled women. Actually I used to get people , both men and women incredulous as to to the women that used to be attracted to me. I have found that many women just dont care about that stuff. The stuff those women do care about, I seem to be able to supply . I think DB would be far better off cultivating those qualities - if that sort of thing is possible ? And DB, in a way, this all seems strange. Didnt you go out and pull yourself out of this mud ? Didnt you meet a nice woman and have lunch and laugh together? What the hell happened to that real life situation ? You were supposed to follow that up ! Then you returned to this silly dating profile business that has delivered nothing but frustration and a thought of acting dishonestly and seems to lead to depression and comments about 'ending things' as a stupid dating site isnt working for you. Snap out of it man! That's like continually going to on line tarot readers and getting upset as their promises of an impending tall dark and handsome stranger are not coming true. { bes is being nice DB and giving you really good advice }

I thought legally, it was part of a pre marriage contract. 'Will you accept the ring and marry me? Yes. Then here is the ring or No. I wont take the ring. If it is yes and take the ring then not fullfil the conditions, and not marry the 'contractual token' should be returned, Its part of the dowry. ?

Ah re-load shows em Doh! + peck peck + whoop whoop nyuk nyuk = Nugali .... ? Fair enough.