Jeff

37 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

Many here have spoken out against the work that Jeff and his group do, some from personal experience.  If the goal of this speaking out was to make sure that no Bums are hurt by this work in the future, then I´d like you to notice something: YOU ACCOMPLISHED YOUR GOAL.  Jeff has promised not to initiate contact with any Bum here with offers of help or scanning.  (I assume this leaves the door open for a Bum to initiate contact with Jeff, which is at it should be IMO.)  It´s possible I suppose that Jeff won´t keep this promise.  Still, I think that those of us who feel this work is harmful can now sigh with relief.  We can relax.  It´s over.

 

 

I was not attempting to leave in any door, and was just attempting to describe what I thought was the area of specific concern. In practical terms, I am saying that I will only be stopping by periodically to respond to any pm messages from a few of the old members that sometimes reach out.

Also, I apologize to everyone for any emotional distress I may have caused. My intent was always just to be helpful, but I realize that it come out that way.

I also apologize that when I sometimes try to explain things, it can come out as sounding arrogant. I do not try to do that, but can definitely see how it could seem like it.

27 minutes ago, steve said:

...

 

You posted the question publicly so I responded publicly. I rarely use PM here.

 

 

The pm comment was not related to you, I was talking about the broader member group if you read it in context. 
 

8 hours ago, Pilgrim said:

So here it is 27 pages later.

 

I am going to get very real and basic in this post.

 

Jeff do you get it yet?

 

Do you?

 

You have been fucking up for years,  people do not like it.

 

You have hurt people,  you refuse to take any responsibility for your actions.

 

You were protected for a very long time by this site which was corrupted by your followers.

 

People do not like it.

 

I think you are done and you should just get on with your real life and stop serving your boredom and fantasy life. I shudder to think if your wife should become privy to your misbehavior. 

 

For years I tried to give you the benefit of the doubt even though I knew better inside.

 

My advise to you is stop now. Just stop.

 

I will never do more than be honest on this site and perhaps one other to get you to see this but you need to be careful now, very careful. 

 

This is my final word of caution I would not like to see you hurt more than this thread has.

 

Enough is enough already.

Relax my friend, you have already won your battle, and I have already promised that I will not initiate contact with any member at this forum (or any other forum). 

1 hour ago, steve said:

Your vision is nothing more than your mind.

 

I don't see it as my responsibility to decide if he leaves or stays.

That is his choice.

 

I mentioned a ban on all members of your group if the energy games continued here in order to protect the members from manipulative behavior.

Sean is clearly not here but ultimately has the authority and responsibility at this point to ban members.

 

I don't know what this means.

 

Yes, the pressure was placed on me.

It's interesting that even when it came to whether to stay here or not, Jeff was not willing to take that responsibility.

It was placed on me. I have no formal authority here and assume Jeff chose me because he respects my perspective.

While I appreciate that, this is something Jeff and your group need to own.

Not me.

No, that is not case. I was not trying to transfer any responsibility. As I have repeated stated, I take full responsibility for all of my actions.  I own everything that I have done with everyone here.

When you work with someone (or hug), it is not some energy transfer or some bizarre sexual game.  It is actually loving someone so much that you are willing to share your soul with them.  Share any and all pains with them. Being the garbage can for all of it.  Sharing the room for dealing with it that they themselves do not have.  And yes, being the barrier that protects when the deep stuff is too much.

1 hour ago, steve said:

 

Outed generally refers to exposing someone's secret.

Is that how you are using the term here?

Again, it's Jeff's choice to stay or go, say goodbye or not...

Not mine.

Yes, it is and always will be mine and I take full responsibility.

1 hour ago, steve said:

Undoubtedly, that is why I am cautious with my interactions with people.

Imagine the trace left when fucking with people's heads, sexuality, trust in deities, and so forth.

Major responsibilities that require one to actually take ownership and be accountable.

Love more...

1 hour ago, steve said:

No problem.

It would be easy to be reactive to your flights of thought as expressed here.

Great practice for me to breath, notice my reactivity, then address your musings with kindness rather than whatever emotion pops up.

 

Great, nothing is more valuable than the ability to let go.

 

I feel the same.

The way Jeff is handled here is up to Jeff, the collective, and the administrator.

It should not be my unilateral decision.

 

 

Peace

Yes, you made your decision, but seemed to not be willing to just tell me. 

More broadly, people seem to love to post these threads, but I was suprised that no one wanted to send a simple pm message.

Finally, there is no need for me to initiate any contact with any new (or existing) member here regarding any help (or scanning stuff).

I will not bother anyone with any such offer at the bums (or any forum).

Love and Best wishes to all  

8 hours ago, Bindi said:

No I don’t really believe it, I think I could tell if someone were channeling energy at me, I was more questioning what wizz believes, which might actually be different to what Jeff believes, cos Jeff states repeatedly that he doesn’t channel or project energy. Do his defenders even have his story straight? The issue with knowing anyway but asking permission is a puzzle that I would like Jeff to try and clarify, because as it stands it doesn’t make a lot of sense. 

You correct in that I don’t really channel or project energy, and the dynamic is different. It is hard to describe, but the difference is more like trying to define the difference between foreground and background. When I go into someone’s “local space” (or hug), it is like I manifest there and kind of look around. My presence will most likely effect (or people notice) at the heart level. Yin/Yang attempts to naturally balance, and you get the polarity differences I have discussed. In the other mode, it is more like I am just noticing the background energy that people are transmitting when they focus on me when they do things like write posts in this thread. Their “thinking” is really an energy process/transmission that is noticeable.

3 minutes ago, Bindi said:

 

This, “One day he messaged me to ask if I was finding amusement in giving him huge breasts and making him try to walk in heels while he was in a business meeting” - is so monty pythonish it’s hilarious, and yet there continues to be serious discussion about this man who is his own parody. Amazing really. 

 

 

would love to see that pm message. Please forward pm it to me when you get a chance?

How about this for everyone as a possible concept for everyone...

1) I promise never to scan someone at the bums when they just want to know based upon interest or for fun.

2) I will only offer to help/scan when someone has expressed extreme issues/concern, and no one else qualified here has previously offered to help or answer questions. And will not engage without expressed permission.

3) As long the being scanned member allows it, I will always post my findings in open for the members to read.

Thoughts?

20 minutes ago, steve said:

Try to imagine how I feel reading the experiences of illumairen, bindi, chaz, and lori... and the treatment they received from you and others. Deeply disturbing to me.

 

I always enjoyed our discussions as well.

 

I am not in authority here but I will say this.

The methods you are using are clearly having a negative impact on several people here, and elsewhere.

I don't feel it's my place to ask you to leave but I will ask that you not engage in your energetic practices with members here.

I will also ask that you try a bit harder to see what effect your actions are having on women, from their perspective.

There is a great responsibility in convincing people you can get into their minds and bodies from a distance.

A great deal of sensitivity and accountability is needed and I don't see that on display.

 

 

Yes, I agree there is great responsibility and I have always treated it that way.  Also, as I have always stated, I take full responsibility for all of my actions, and any resulting Karma associated with it.  But, I am not convincing anyone of anything, one can either do it or not. And with the ability also comes a sacred responsibility, I never go where not asked, but I will never reject any honest request.  When asked, it shall be given.

The authority in this matter is yours to decide, and I give you my word that I will abide by it. I await your decision?

Best wishes to all  

5 hours ago, Jetsun said:

 

I don't know this isn't true, and can't find any evidence to the contrary, it's pretty consistent of you to suggest to people that they see you as a blonde woman when working spiritually, ie polarities reversed... Which is your own concept not found anywhere else in any other systems, completely your own invention.... and suggestion to others . 

Please read my actual posts. I have hundreds of them explaining these concepts over many years.  Additionally, I explained it in this thread.

7 hours ago, ilumairen said:

 

Apparently you missed the answer:

 

 

No, you seem to have not read my post/question.  I asked how many years?

11 hours ago, steve said:

I find this thread extremely disturbing. I've also read some threads on another forum involving the same topic. What I see here is a group following a person who has cobbled together their own method for working with energy, psychology, and spirituality from other traditions; and is bringing a healthy dose of sexuality into the mix, at least in some instances. At least three, and possibly more, people are claiming harm from these interactions. At least two of these people have some background in energetic and spiritual methods. That should give everyone serious pause.

 

Rather than take responsibility and modify the method or selection process, all I see is people defending themselves and the group leader and laying blame on those who were negatively impacted by the interaction. As has been said before, gaslighting 101, not to mention other manipulative behaviors. This is wrong and needs to stop immediately. People can be fragile and susceptible to energetic and psychological "work." Fucking around with their heads by bringing sexuality, gods, and goddesses into it requires considerable responsibility and accountability, not to mention some degree of expert training and credibility. I see none of those at play here. Before now, I felt Jeff and the group were a bit misguided but benign. Now I'm really concerned about what they are doing to people. Playing games with energy, psychology, spirituality, and sexuality is a dangerous business; bringing powerful spiritual entities into the mix even more so, especially when the foundation of the method is so flimsy.

 

I'd suggest the entire approach should be critically assessed and modified to prevent further harm. I would also recommend banning all members of the group from this forum unless they agree to end engaging their practices with members here.

 

Just my $.02

Reading such a post where you believe such things truly saddens me.  I have always respected our forum discussions and considered you to be an open minded person.  Once I made an offer to another member of this forum, and I will make same offer to you...

If you feel that I should leave this forum to you and your friends here, I will go.  Simple as that.  Let me know what you decide? PM is fine if that is what you prefer.

Best wishes to all.  

7 hours ago, Jetsun said:

The whole fundamental premise of the energy work they do is based upon the idea that in the spiritual/energy/light realm that polarities are reversed. So men become women and visa versa, at least in perception.

 

...

With the endless posts and questions of me in the past, you have to know that this is not true.  Please do not make up things.

I have even explained this point earlier in this thread.

14 minutes ago, Pilgrim said:

I never did read any email your patron that enabled you all those years was only too happy to out all of you and many others, it was pretty bad.

 

She loved showing others Facebook pages etc.. for the most part I ignored it.

 

Hope you can break free.

 

 

Again, how many years did you know and not say anything?

I hope you can break free.

Best wishes.

2 minutes ago, Pilgrim said:

I never did read any email your patron that enabled you all those years was only too happy to out all of you and many others, it was pretty bad.

 

She loved showing others Facebook pages etc.. for the most part I ignored it.

 

Hope you can break free.

 

 

So sad that you never seemed to have the courage to tell me. I hope you can break free.

Best wishes. 

38 minutes ago, Pilgrim said:

The hell of it is they are all so damned ignorant,  I tried to explain to Jeff how he was someone else’s play thing but it went no where.

 

He and I both had dealings  with an Indian woman who has connections and more to The darkest Black Tantra.

 

She even told me she kept a certain website running to keep him in her playground as he ran around making his mischief and viewed him as a child.

 

Chilling shit!

...

 

So how long were you involved with this plan to read all of my private messages?  And why did you not bother to tell or warn me, all the time pretending to be a friend?

How many years was it?

2 minutes ago, Earl Grey said:

 

For what we have learned and concluded, bliss itself is not bad, as it is a state that shows the fruits of thy practice. 

 

Seeking bliss is the issue as those who know what bliss is say that it comes when it is meant to, not because you find it, just like you can't explain that sudden spontaneous joy you find when finding a comfortable, quiet spot under the shade of a great tree on a beautiful sunny day and a light breeze that arrives unexpectedly to make a wonderful moment absolutely perfect.

 

One can't force the breeze to come at the right moment or for everything in nature to align perfectly for their Instagram selfie either.

 

The spiritual ponzi scam of Jeff and his group sadly seem to think that it is something they have the unique ability to turn on and off and that as quoted earlier, they have insight where old masters and lineages failed to understand or have any of the delusions of power that only Jeff and his flock possess. 

Turn on and off?  Please explain what in the world you are talking about?  

19 minutes ago, Pilgrim said:

The hell of it is they are all so damned ignorant,  I tried to explain to Jeff how he was someone else’s play thing but it went no where.

 

He and I both had dealings  with an Indian woman who has connections and more to The darkest Black Tantra.

 

She even told me she kept a certain website running to keep him in her playground as he ran around making his mischief and viewed him as a child.

 

Chilling shit!

 

I broke free from her, he has not and is connected via her lineage to very ancient things.

 

It is good Bindi has had the courage to bring this to a stop, it is good Lori cared beyond her own pain to speak up it is good Ilumarian also confirms and is bold and truthful in the face of so much gas lighting bullshit.

 

Of all Jeff’s acolytes there is none I feel more sorry for than Tom, I remember when he was still a nice boy trying to figure things out, a couple of years past and I was shocked to see what a know it all asshole he became.

 

Even more stunned how assured he was yet still ignorant grasping for approval.
 

Tom it is a shame what has happened to you, I know that good person is still inside,  think back over the last 6 or so years where you were in 2013 / 2014 in your life, your marriage how involvement with Jeff and others hurt you.

 

Making a mistake does not condemn one to sticking with it.

 

Of course I know more but I have said enough a certain Indian woman knew everything about all of you and many many others like a fat black spider sitting in the center of a web plucking strings.

The shit you are making up is so sad to see. Especially when you know you are making it all up. Even sadder to see how many people who also know they are lies also like it.

Yes, I am aware that you and another woman were continually violating my privacy and reading confidential personal messages of others. 

No, I am not part of the same lineage, and no she is not part of some dark Tantra. You broke free of her? Come on, be honest with yourself and what you have actually done. 

Additionally, everyone knows that you are simply trying to bait Tom with your disgusting comments about his marriage.

11 hours ago, gendao said:

Thing is, like with Jeff's BustyBlonde Pai...he soon got called out by several members that brought up evidence for everyone to openly consider...and Jeff finally just left of his own accord.  So, he literally lasted only a day here, and the entire dialogue was open to everyone and left entirely transparent for anyone else to review in the future.

 

Yes, it is anti-hierarchical...and more of a digital, egalitarian council circle where no one can pull rank. 

  Reveal hidden contents

In an aboriginal circle of oneness, not pyramid scheme of cevilization. 

But, I'd say it worked very well considering the immense amount of unspoken words that got heard and with such a timely conclusion!

 

I would agree with the OP that it is a good question of discussion to ask, but a meaningless one, as Sean does not really care about moderation.  It is the Wild West and will probably just stay that way.

1 minute ago, Starjumper said:

The above was an experiment to check something, or you could call it trolling.  It sure was easy to deflect Li"l Pussy's piss stream in my direction.  I've got some acres of mountain to weedwhack now, so I'll leave you all to continue your pissing and moaning at whichever target you wish.

 

Enjoy the weedwhacking!

Well it seems this topic has exhausted any real discussion, and I need to get some work done.

If anyone has any real questions, or wants to discuss any of the topics, feel free send me a pm.

Feel free to keep the party going, I am sure you will enjoy yourselves...

Just now, ilumairen said:

 

Yeah, and while one side of his mouth offers the hindering fears narrative, the other side explains hoose he/she is like a "battery pack."

I would agree that a “battery pack” is a useful analogy. 

To any who may be interested...

From the gospel of Thomas

22. Jesus saw some babies nursing. He said to his disciples, "These nursing babies are like those who enter the (Father's) kingdom." They said to him, "Then shall we enter the (Father's) kingdom as babies?" Jesus said to them, "When you make the two into one, and when you make the inner like the outer and the outer like the inner, and the upper like the lower, and when you make male and female into a single one, so that the male will not be male nor the female be female, when you make eyes in place of an eye, a hand in place of a hand, a foot in place of a foot, an image in place of an image, then you will enter [the kingdom]."

Just now, ralis said:

 

Another bad move Jeff! Infinite power belongs to no one individual which well states the case of ego inflation for anyone that believes such nonsense!

Energy is unlimited, only limited by issues and fears of the local body mind.

Just now, gendao said:

I'm not sticking my fingers between your falsies...WTF after this whole thread...c'mon man, FFS! 

I mean, I do support you exploring where that fixation comes from on your own, though?  Perhaps with wanting to feel extremely sexually-desirable or something?

Haha. No problem. 

Best wishes to you  

1 minute ago, ilumairen said:

Jeff, I was being sarcastic about you having told me personally you were the new turning. 

 

At which point your post basically becomes you saying nothing more than I've lost the power you had once granted me in your narrative.

 

And honestly, this pleases me.

Granted you power?  Everyone already has their own infinite power, the problem is that issues and fears obscure their view/access.  I have posted this point hundreds of times on the forum, and always been very clear about that.